Another new guy thread :)

[Pdon]

Well since my first post got deleted from my computer im going to keep this short and sweet.

I have been looking to get a small army going however the download the website gives has no points costs what should I do? Second, I assume I should wait to get the new rules in Janurary, when will the specific faction books come out? Third, can someone give me a brief rundown of how each army usually plays out, their strengths and weaknesses. I ahve been looking at menoth but I am turned away at the fact that you need to always have a specific unit in your army (cant remember the name sorry :( )

Hope my computer doesnt delete this one!

[Hellspawn]

Well, here goes my first forray into being helpful. It's an unfamiliar feeling...
Q1: My downloaded copy did have Mk2 costs, but that won't help you for the next couple of weeks. Talk with your local press ganger and see if he/she can help you start a beginners list. If you don't know what a press ganger is, than you may have trouble contacting one. Good luck on that. Just pick up a few figs you like and then(Q2) wait for the new rules to come out. Though the books won't be released until the third of who knows, the faction card decks come out in January. The first book (Cygnar) ships in February with more coming out monthly (I assume.) The faction deck will hook you up with every card released through legends, so you won't have to worry about buying old figs. This will also give you a sort of catalog that you can build your army with. That's assuming you've made a choice on armies which brings us to (Q3) strengths and weaknesses. I'm going to stick to just machine factions, as I'm getting real tired of typing. You see what I do for you? Somebody else can cover the hordes side. Hey somebody,GET ON THAT! Anywho, you can play any army any way now that there are so many troop and jack choices, so keep in mind that this description will be very generic. Cygnar= awesome jacks, multiple attacks by bouncing lightning around, shooting you're balls off, and being all morally superior(for the most part.) Khador= headbutts in the face. This is the hevy armor, hard hitting slow as wheelchair races army. Dish it out and take it too. Menoth=cheating. Not really. Well... Lots of weapon masters, dirty spell trickery and army synergy. Keep a notepad handy, cuase' all thier abilities stack and bounce and it's real easy to forget stuff. Cryx:D=Dirty spellcasting, dirty tricks and tons of troops. We also are home to the hottest women in fantasy gaming bar NONE(eat it Sorscha.)Retribution=cheating. No maybe's. They cheat like Tiger. Spellariffic casting, hiding in forests and the best damn solo ever(Narn) they'll ignore your defences and turn your powers against you. They die to a stiff wind, but you'll have to learn how to position that wind as soon as possible. Insert fart joke here. I'm leaving now.

[Bert_the_Turtle]

There's a file with the "Cards" for the models that give Point Costs and rules for them.

[PitLord]

Since no one else has jumped on this yet I will do the Hordes factions.

As has been said there are many ways to play each army so decriptions are generic. If you have to choose, I would go with the one whose models you like best, unless the play style seems totally alien to you.

Trolll Bloods: Though, hard to kill and good at buffing stuff into stupidly powerful attacks. Not the fastest army, and a lot of there best stuff tends to lean to the march forward and smash you side of things.

Skorne: These guys have an interesting mix, of decent troops and decent beasts. A common theme is the ability to weaken the opposing force somehow (spells animus abilities) and get multiple uses out of the same thing (bonuses as things die).

Circle of Oroborus:This is sort of the ticky faciton of hordes. Lots of terrain manipulation (I need a forest Plop! there we go). They also seem to have a set on inheirent sub themes, you can build a Tharn themed army, one centered around constructs, synergy between warp wolves etc.

Legion of Everblight: My faction so I know more here: Generally considered to be able to field the shootiest armies in hordes. Fast, prone to ignore things on the battle field (just read the eyeless sight rule on any legion warbest). I also often heat them described as a scalpel or glass cannon, meaning they are fast, maneuverable, and hit hard, but are generally much poorer at absorbing damage. Legion can do some unexpected things and sometimes people cry broken when they first face them but once you learn what to expect they balance out pretty well.

[Pdon]

First off thanks to everyone so far. I appreciate all the help given!:D

Next pitlord I love your sig haha

So I have found a couple of deals on ebay, I was looking to start a menoth army, the thought of zealous troops is interesting and kinda reminds me of the Knights Templar haha. Now my next big question is if I get 2/3 light jacks, 1 heavy jack and a caster should I be good enough until I get the new rules and new menoth book? Im hesitant on buying units until I can see their stats.

What are Menoth specific strengths and weaknesses?

Also is there anyone in the Illinois area, suburbs of Chicago that plays or knows of gaming stores that run events? The closest stores that has events are either in chicago (30 min drive) or Gamesplus which is a awsome gaming store but its 40+ mins away lol

[Devilsquid]

Well, here goes my first forray into being helpful. It's an unfamiliar feeling...
Q1: My downloaded copy did have Mk2 costs, but that won't help you for the next couple of weeks. Talk with your local press ganger and see if he/she can help you start a beginners list. If you don't know what a press ganger is, than you may have trouble contacting one. Good luck on that.

Just pick up a few figs you like and then(Q2) wait for the new rules to come out. Though the books won't be released until the third of who knows, the faction card decks come out in January.

The first book (Cygnar) ships in February with more coming out monthly (I assume.) The faction deck will hook you up with every card released through legends, so you won't have to worry about buying old figs. This will also give you a sort of catalog that you can build your army with. That's assuming you've made a choice on armies which brings us to (Q3) strengths and weaknesses.

I'm going to stick to just machine factions, as I'm getting real tired of typing. You see what I do for you? Somebody else can cover the hordes side. Hey somebody,GET ON THAT! Anywho, you can play any army any way now that there are so many troop and jack choices, so keep in mind that this description will be very generic.

Cygnar= awesome jacks, multiple attacks by bouncing lightning around, shooting you're balls off, and being all morally superior(for the most part.)

Khador= headbutts in the face. This is the hevy armor, hard hitting slow as wheelchair races army. Dish it out and take it too.

Menoth=cheating. Not really. Well... Lots of weapon masters, dirty spell trickery and army synergy. Keep a notepad handy, cuase' all thier abilities stack and bounce and it's real easy to forget stuff.

Cryx:D=Dirty spellcasting, dirty tricks and tons of troops. We also are home to the hottest women in fantasy gaming bar NONE(eat it Sorscha.)

Retribution=cheating. No maybe's. They cheat like Tiger. Spellariffic casting, hiding in forests and the best damn solo ever(Narn) they'll ignore your defences and turn your powers against you. They die to a stiff wind, but you'll have to learn how to position that wind as soon as possible. Insert fart joke here. I'm leaving now.

Sorry, needed to break that up into chunks for my mind to process it.

Let me also mention Mercenaries. From pirates to dwarves, undead and sellswords, Mercenaries have everything. They have a steep learning curve, but a lot of character, schnanigans, and perhaps the best forum section around (ok, that's a biased opinion). Not the easiest faction to learn, but definitely one of the most rewarding.

Welcome to the forums and the game!

[PitLord]

The stats for everything, including both jacks and units are posted with the MkII rules here (http://privateerpress.com/company/mkii-rules-and-model-info-available-for-pdf-download) (the cards at the bottom have the stats for everything WM). The rules likewise are final, though not pretty (lots of places where it literally says refer to page x instead of giving the page number). That should be everything you need to know about what units do and its all supposed to be final for MkII. Its not pretty like the book and final cards will be, but should allow you to make informed purchases and not miss out on good deals if you see them.

Ok second, your plan to start with a caster a heavy and a couple of lights is feasible, that's how I started back with the battle boxes>

As a faction Menites rely heavy on synergy, meaning that often an individual model is outclassed for us, but often we can get it multiple over lapping bonuses. Take our most generic heavy jack the Crusader. Its not particularly impressive (slow like Khador's but not as much armor) its cheap though, and its not really hard to have a Chior boost its offence or make it immune to range attacks, a Vassal give it an extra attack, AND you caster give it some additional buff via spell.

Menites also tend to field lots of cheap infantry (temple flame guard, Chior and zealots). Our shooting abilities tends toward Area of Effect stuff that is not always super accurate (deliverers, zealots, redeemer).

Themes possible for menoth include making a flame guard themed force, or an Exemplar Themed force (and yes you can pull off a very templar look and feel here). Though can mix the two if you want as well.

Weaknesses include the fact that we are never really all that fast, and that units and jacks without any support can get whipped out by other factions equivalent stuff.

As far as jacks to start with, the Crusader is good but mostly beacause its so cheap that it is easy to fit in lists. I also freequently use a Reckoner to add a little range support. In lights I would say that out best are the Revenger and Devout, though if used correctly (which genreally involved knocking your target down) a Reddeemer can be devastating too.

For a first caster I like both original High Exemplar Kreoss (his feat is one of the best in the game still) and and Severius who I have always though was one of the best all around casters in the game. One of the beauty's of this game is that you will find as you build your army that you can pick up another caster for relatively cheap drop him or her and and the rest of your stuff, not matter what it is really, will suddenly feel new.

[Pdon]

so then you would stray away from being "jack heavy"? I just love the jack models, are any of the other factions known for being 'jack heavy, whether they be light or heavy jacks?

[ricefrisbeetreats]

Cygnar has a lot of Jack Marshals that can help mitigate the focus requirements.

They also can run jacks quite well.

Hope that helps!

[Hellspawn]

Sorry, needed to break that up into chunks for my mind to process it.

!
And just what's wrong with run on paragraphs? Have you read the healthcare bill? It's 1000x worse than that!
Pdon, just buy the models you like and start from there. If you dig jacks, get a few and run Reznik or Amon. Throw in a vassal, chior, some zealots with a monolith, bring to a medium boil, and have a good time. Worry about all the specifics once you've mastered the basics. There are no bad models, only better ones. If you can win with "inferior" models, than you're a better player and whoever tells you those models suck can eat it.
Hence my love for Doom Reavers.
That broken enough for ya' Dsquid?;)

[Pdon]

So then you suggest a cygnar army if I wanted to be jack heavy? I really love the jack models, I probably would start with just a 15 pt force because from what I have read at 15 points you pretty much have just jacks.

[thumperforhire]

with the new rules, I would say Cygnar would be the best bet for a new player, they have a rule that messes with jacks that they hand out like candy, disrupt & have some of the best ranged that is easy to learn. That being said, Mercs is another good pick, because if you dont like them by themselves, you can add them to what you pick at a later time.

[Devilsquid]

And just what's wrong with run on paragraphs? Have you read the healthcare bill? It's 1000x worse than that!
Pdon, just buy the models you like and start from there. If you dig jacks, get a few and run Reznik or Amon. Throw in a vassal, chior, some zealots with a monolith, bring to a medium boil, and have a good time. Worry about all the specifics once you've mastered the basics. There are no bad models, only better ones. If you can win with "inferior" models, than you're a better player and whoever tells you those models suck can eat it.
Hence my love for Doom Reavers.
That broken enough for ya' Dsquid?;)


Sorry, too busy reading the Healthcare Bill.

:p

[malfred]

Pdon, I believe I contacted you via email (if not you, then I apologize).

I run the events out of Chicago and can put you in touch with the people who
run the events out of Games Plus. There used to be a game store out at
Crystal Lake, but the owner died and the store went maybe a year after
that.

Feel free to pm me or contact me via email (again, if that was you) with any
questions.

[dboeren]

So then you suggest a cygnar army if I wanted to be jack heavy? I really love the jack models, I probably would start with just a 15 pt force because from what I have read at 15 points you pretty much have just jacks.

Menoth does jack heavy forces very well, no need to switch factions. But, we're not at full strength yet in Mangled Metal games - this is a common format for 15 point games where only a caster and jacks are allowed, no solos or units. However, we have some really great solos and units that provide warjack support. Menoth jacks will do fine at 15, but they'll really hum in a bigger game where you can put in a Choir and Vassal. Once you can bring all the support I think Menoth has the most effective jacks in the game.

Even at 15 though you should be alright and we have some good casters to choose from. Amon and Reznik are jack oriented, but you can also do well taking someone who just has good spells to put on the jacks and a good supply of focus, say Kreoss or Severius. Defender's Ward on a heavy (possibly an Avatar) can be tough or your opponent to deal with. Stay away from the High Reclaimer/Testament though, those guys are very much troop oriented casters.

[PPS_Mod:Polar_Bear]

Welcome to the Iron Kingdoms! *gives Pdon a cookie and a Nomad plushie* ^_^

I'd been meaning to for a long time, but just kept on forgetting due to other stuff going on, but I posted links to the old Faction Guides in a thread that I stuck to the top of this forum. Though theoretically thinks have changed a bit since MkII, they're still 90%+ accurate for how the general armies play. So check them out for a fairly comprehensive discussion of each of the factions for Warmachine & Hordes.

PB

[Pdon]

Ok so I still cant decide on what faction I want to play. What faction can run jack heavy lists with some troops but the emphasis is on the jacks?

[malfred]

Ok so I still cant decide on what faction I want to play. What faction can run jack heavy lists with some troops but the emphasis is on the jacks?

It'll be based on the 'caster.

Cygnar 'jack heavy includes:

Nemo
Darius
Kraye

Khador 'jack heavy is:

eButcher (?)
Karchev the Terrible

etc.

[Pdon]

Ok, well then which faction has the "best" jack heavy list caster. I assume Khador jack heavy lists would be pretty much run up and smash to bits, and cygnar would be more based on supporting your jacks with your casters spells/feats/abilities? Also is not having a light jack a problem many Khador players face? I think Im begining to like Khador more and more, I love a beat face army!