Kara Sloane Sneak Peak - Rifle Stats!

[Mod_Faultie]

From Bell of Lost Souls here (http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2010/01/warmachine-teaser-cynar-approaches.html).

Cygnaran warcaster Kara Sloan's custom magelock rifle, "Spitfire," is so cool we couldn't keep it to ourselves any longer!

Spitfire

RNG: 14 ROF: 1 AOE: - POW: 12
Magical Weapon
Weapon MasterWow! I love the name! Those dwarves at Ironhead really know how to craft! Sure wouldn't mind them crafting some for their fellow dwarves.

[Jiub]

ROF 1? Awww...

[LemmingStampede]

Not surprised at Rof 1 in the least.

But weapon master? Hell yes!

[PBear]

POW 12 Weapon Master. That might be the hardest hitting ranged attack in the game that you can lay down at a distance and with accuracy. Damn.

[whats82]

It's effectively RoF 2 anyways.

That IS pretty sweet.

[tensteam]

That rifle will kill casters!

[tophalion]

ROF 1? Awww...
*Cough* Gobber *cough*

Not bad, it matches the stat profile of Bucking Jenny prior to her nerf and is effectively as powerful as a Heavy Barrel.

Take a look at the picture at BoLS . Cyclone with some sort of arcane symbol coming out of the chaingun. Could be Runeshot or it could be some sort of jack spell.

[mrhuettel]

i do already love that rifle... now we just need her to have special gun mage ammunition. imagine brutal shot with that or phantom seeker or snipe... or... or... *drool*

after loads of consideration, i'd love to see broadside on her or something similar - with the vast amount of ranged jacks, that'd be awesome!

[Dino-Czar]

She is going to be hated. She certainly doesn't need an offensive spell with a gun like that. 2 (Pow 12: 4d6) attacks a turn for 2 focus and 1 build point? I'm thinking this is a good thing.

[Blaque]

POW 12 Weapon Master. That might be the hardest hitting ranged attack in the game that you can lay down at a distance and with accuracy. Damn.
Lylyth, Shadow of Everblight when she takes her aiming bonus gets an additional die to the damage roll, although she does have two less inches of range and can't move to do it. But it is comparable and on her feat turn, shoots further and three times.

Still, pretty beefy, gotta say. That is if the spoielr is to be trusted. I like to be skeptical on such things.

And stuff.

[Killionaire]

I thought she was going to get Bullseye. But weaponmaster! Wow.

Now the real question is.. what the hell her spell list is going to be? Because so much fits.

Snipe? Totally. Deadeye? Right. Blur? Possibly. Marked For Death/Lock the target? Who knows. Magic Bullet? Fitting but unlikely. Guided Fire? I hope not. Mage Sight? That'd totally fit. True Shot? Probably.

Edit:
Oh wow, she's got some sort of ranged jack buff. There's a Cyclone behind her firing with warcaster rune-circles. I think it reads 'guided fire'. Damn...

[Mutton]

She will not have Snipe; no way in hell when combined with that gun. Hopefully Mage Sight though.

[MadJack]

It's effectively RoF 2 anyways.
Is that because you should always take Reinholdt with her, or is there something else that lets her shoot twice?

[Mod_Faultie]

Is that because you should always take Reinholdt with her, or is there something else that lets her shoot twice?
Yep, because of that 1PC Reinholdt. He's the man...errr...Gobber!

[Dareith]

I compared the runes to an old IK font that I have, and I'm pretty sure that they say "SQUAD FIRING SQUAD FIRING".

[whats82]

I think it reads 'guided fire'. Damn...

Is that from deciphering the rune text ?

[Killionaire]

I compared the runes to an old IK font that I have, and I'm pretty sure that they say "SQUAD FIRING SQUAD FIRING".

Oh thank valen it wasn't Guided Fire. A new spell perhaps?

Also it probably rules out Rune Bullets for warjacks :P

[Knight]

Spitfire. :cool:

[tophalion]

Yep, because of that 1PC Reinholdt. He's the man...errr...Gobber!

I'm reminded of that mod that gave him a pimp hat. He finally gets a break from reloading all the boys' guns.

I hope it's not guided fire....at 3 focus it's excessively priced. Then again we got stuck with the new scramble...

[PPS_Simon]

Lylyth, Shadow of Everblight when she takes her aiming bonus gets an additional die to the damage roll, although she does have two less inches of range and can't move to do it. But it is comparable and on her feat turn, shoots further and three times.

Still, pretty beefy, gotta say. That is if the spoielr is to be trusted. I like to be skeptical on such things.

And stuff.

Spoiler through Bell of Lost Souls is trustworthy. Trust me, I'm the guy who sends it. ;)

[ZenBattleLust]

Pow 12 weapon master is only about a pow 15.5 normal weapon. That isn't so much better than seige's gun, and nowhere near as good as ecaine after his 4th shot. I don't think the gun is so awesome that she won't also have some serious range buffs.

I'm holding out hope for a snipe/deadeye variant. Something along the lines of "Imbued Black Power: Target model/units first non-electric ranged attack this turn gets +2 range and +2 pow".

[GunMageinTraining]

Lol, Well... Pow 12, Weaponmaster... I guess that rules out the possibility of an AP shot hun...

Alas! But seriously, Hot Shot and Broadsides! We NEED em (in a completely selfish, I want to blast things with my jack-gun-wall-o-doom-ish-ness sense.

[ZenBattleLust]

Spoiler through Bell of Lost Souls is trustworthy. Trust me, I'm the guy who sends it. ;)

Wait one second. You're the source of the spoiler and yet all you've spoiled is the gun? You tease, you.

[Cygnarite]

Pow 12 weapon master is only about a pow 15.5 normal weapon. That isn't so much better than seige's gun, and nowhere near as good as ecaine after his 4th shot. I don't think the gun is so awesome that she won't also have some serious range buffs.
I'm holding out hope for a snipe/deadeye variant. Something along the lines of "Imbued Black Power: Target model/units first non-electric ranged attack this turn gets +2 range and +2 pow".

Its not much better then siege's gun on average, but it has much higher top end damage. In addition, anything less than Rat 8 on her would be strange, so she's a lot more likely to hit High def/low armor casters. She'll also probably be speed 6, which gives her an additional inch of threat over siege.
As much as I love the idea of her getting mage eye, I'm starting to doubt it, as that would severely hamper other factions abilities to hide their casters behind forests/smoke/natural stealth.
True sight is a possibility though...
I'm very much a fan of your idea though, I'd love a non-upkeep that added a static value to any binary combination of Range, Rat and Damage, though again, something like that on her would be very, very nasty.

[PPS_Jen]

Great googly moogly.

Is she out yet? What about now? Now?? o_O;;

Seriously, the one model that will tear me away from Angry Elves...

[Galitlan]

While problee won't happen but Phantom Seeker anyone? Its be way way overkill but man it would be cool.

Also while you compare it to seiges gun the fact she has weaponmaster makes it so when picking of infantry/solos she doesn't have to boost dmg all the time.

[PBear]

If she has phantom seeker, I will eat this post. :D That would be re-donkulous assassination potential with her cannon-rifle.

Snipe wouldn't surprise me either way. I'm guessing there will definitely be some ranged support spells, probably more than one.

[Tionas]

When I was in WWII they called me spitfire (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sAsZ8Ql2e8M).

thats a nasty, nasty gun.

[Cygnarite]

If she has phantom seeker, I will eat this post. :D That would be re-donkulous assassination potential with her cannon-rifle.

Snipe wouldn't surprise me either way. I'm guessing there will definitely be some ranged support spells, probably more than one.

You know the whole "One woman rifle brigade" quote from her description has me thinking, what if she isn't a Range support caster, but a caster designed to be your armies ranged support?

SpeedLoad - 2 Focus
Immediately make d3 attacks with Spitfire. You cannot choose the same target more than once for these attacks. This spell can be cast once per turn

[Cronix]

ROF 1 POW 12 weapon master....(sounds not that amazing)

But maybe in return they gave her an amazing spell deck and feat.

[Invaderzahn]

Average of 22 damage a shot (un-boosted) and 26 damage a shot (boosted). without taking armor into account of course.

[Jice_]

I don't know why, but I kinda get the sinking feeling she's going to be FOC 5. When you compair her to eLylyth just by weapon alone, who is the only other caster that can get 4 dice on Ranged Damage, it might be enough to keep her at low FOC.

If not great, but that's what my intuition is telling me.

I did play eLylyth a few days ago and it was hella fun, so I'm not too worried, 4 Dice ranged attacks make you giggle with mad glee.

[Angelus]

Probably missing something, but how are people getting effective RoF 2?

[Gorg]

even a foc 5 caster is still an effective foc 6 caster in cygnar, but i doubt she will be foc 5.

[leo_neil316]

Wait..................................

We get a stealth unit. And a WEAPONMASTER?


OMG!!!!! RUN FOR YOUR LIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIVESSS THE END IS NIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGH!!!!

Next thing you know that stormknight we saw is gonna turn out to be on a medium base and have wounds!!!!! WOUNDS I TELL YOU!

[iksander]

I doubt Sloane will have 5 focus. Seige would also be an apt comparison and he rocks the 6 focus. Our warcaster training academy does it's job well.

I'm expecting typical Cygnaran Mario type stats:

Spd 6 Str 5 Mat 5 Rat 8 Def 16 Arm 14 Cmd 8 Foc 6

[Demeritus]

Wow... just wow. I'm going to hate fighting her. My regular Cygnaran opponents are going to love this.

[Ghyrrshyld]

She will not have Snipe; no way in hell when combined with that gun. Hopefully Mage Sight though.
No. Not unless you really want an auto win against Denny.

Which you shouldn't.

[john_doe85]

Probably missing something, but how are people getting effective RoF 2?
Reindholdt's reload ability

[Typhael]

No. Not unless you really want an auto win against Denny.

Which you shouldn't.

Do you *know* Cygnar very well? :P

That rifle makes me cry. I can't wait to see her fine print, because it'll a) give me great ways to beat her, or b) make me swear off playing the Swan forever.

[Endgame]

No. Not unless you really want an auto win against Denny.

Which you shouldn't.
Won't be any different than playing against Siege. I can't tell you the number of times I've feated, illuminated / mage sighted Denny and one shotted her. Probably dozens of times...

[Mutton]

Honestly, anything that means less Denny across the table from me is a good thing; she's just no fun to play against (not bringing balance into discussion here, just fun)

[Defenstrator]

Two shots (with Reinholdt) doing (with boosting) an average of 26 damage each for 2 focus? You keep your head down around her unless you want it blown off.

[AJ the Ronin]

Damn! POW 12 with 4D6.

I Hope her RAT is at least 7.

[masleth]

I actually cheered. Loudly. I'm already psyched. Where is mine? Hurry the heck up. Drat you January! Go away already!

I hope she has a solid spell list. She at the very least needs arcane precision (true sight or true shot spell would be better). She is bound to be fragile, so Snipe isn't beyond hope. I still think an aimed snipe would be a good ability (when you forfeit movement to gain the aiming bonus, the weapon gains +2 or +4 range). ARRRGGHH! Just gimme the model so I can stop speculating and play!

[Typhael]

(double-post)

[Typhael]

Honestly, anything that means less Denny across the table from me is a good thing; she's just no fun to play against (not bringing balance into discussion here, just fun)

I imagine that Shooty McPew will be much more fun to play against...:rolleyes:

(On that note, I don't play regular ol' Deneghra that often anymore, unless my opponent is being a silly-face that really needs to learn their lesson)



I hope she has a solid spell list. She at the very least needs arcane precision (true sight or true shot spell would be better).

The logic confuses me. Great shooting, ability to pierce stealth, *and* a solid spell list? What shouldn't she have? (You're missing Gunfighter :P)

[otakud00d]

Here's hoping her Feat gives Bullseye or ranged weaponmaster to either her battlegroup or Faction models in CTRL. ;)

[Davian_]

I compared the runes to an old IK font that I have, and I'm pretty sure that they say "SQUAD FIRING SQUAD FIRING".

Squad Firing? I don't know about that...:)

Firing Squad, on the other hand, sounds like a likely name for a spell or feat for buffing a battlegroup's ranged abilities.

[masleth]

I imagine that Shooty McPew will be much more fun to play against...:rolleyes:

(On that note, I don't play regular ol' Deneghra that often anymore, unless my opponent is being a silly-face that really needs to learn their lesson)



The logic confuses me. Great shooting, ability to pierce stealth, *and* a solid spell list? What shouldn't she have? (You're missing Gunfighter :P)

Nah, a good rifle caster, should never have to get that close. Ok, no brokenz. Give her at least one great spell and one that would be good if it didn't cost so much focus. Now that's a Cygnar caster!

[Invaderzahn]

Squad Firing? I don't know about that...:)

Firing Squad, on the other hand, sounds like a likely name for a spell or feat for buffing a battlegroup's ranged abilities.

OoOo, Me likey that.

[Mutton]

I imagine that Shooty McPew will be much more fun to play against...:rolleyes:

(On that note, I don't play regular ol' Deneghra that often anymore, unless my opponent is being a silly-face that really needs to learn their lesson)



The logic confuses me. Great shooting, ability to pierce stealth, *and* a solid spell list? What shouldn't she have? (You're missing Gunfighter :P)


It's the same with me and Harby or eCaine; they only really get pulled out if the other guy needs to lose hard. Although I do run eCaine for fun against friends who want to run their A-game though, as he's so much fun to use...

[bouncymischa]

Squad Firing? I don't know about that...:)

Firing Squad, on the other hand, sounds like a likely name for a spell or feat for buffing a battlegroup's ranged abilities.

Ooooh~ Yes, Firing Squad definitely sounds fun. Heck, it could even be the "Bullseye" spell (since firing squads do tend to stand still and shoot... XD)

Sounds like she'll be fun. I'll admit, despite being a high-end caster I still enjoy taking Siege -- he just makes my Trencher/Long Gunner army run so well. I'm hoping that Sloane will be the same, with the option of making some fun lists...

[otakud00d]

I'll laugh if Firing Squad ends up being remotely like Incite. For range.

[Arkady]

One shot, one kill!

[phreaker187]

It's funny to hear people cry about it being a ROF 1. I can imagine the boo hooing other factions would be doing if they gave us ROF 2 with that boomstick. With gobber she's already killing ARM 14 casters with ease.

[ZenBattleLust]

Arm 14. Pshaww. Arm 17 casters have at most 18 boxes. Pow 12 + 4d6 = 26 on average. 26 - 17 = 9. 9 * 2 = 18. She is killing armor 17 casters on average rolls, without casting a spell or popping a feat. Bad ***.

That is, until you remember it's a gobber with an oversized pocket watch and a telescope that lets her do it. Then it seems slightly less bad ***.

[basicbob]

Kara Sloan will you marry me ?!!!!!

[CeltKhan]

That is, until you remember it's a gobber with an oversized pocket watch and a telescope that lets her do it. Then it seems slightly less bad ***.

Then you remember your warcaster just put two rounds from a .50 cal Magelock through their warcaster's face to win you the game. Then it seems Freakin A.

[Professor Lust]

It's funny to hear people cry about it being a ROF 1. I can imagine the boo hooing other factions would be doing if they gave us ROF 2 with that boomstick. With gobber she's already killing ARM 14 casters with ease.

My thinking exactly

Moreover, we know nothing about Kara herself. She may have magic bullet or maybe a * attack/action that deals additional damage.

[Bobby Hostile]

Anything that lets her have more range or more shots in her spell list will make her golden.

What I'd really like to see is Cathmore's feat. Maybe she's a relative of his and does the whole 2 JWC thing? A man can dream...

[TsavongLah]

...

*drool*

[Sideshow Lucifer]

Can not wait for her to be released.

[Spooker]

Cant wait to see her full stats. I see endless possibilities with that
gun.

Awesome!

[Corevak]

Hopefully we will see her stats in the Fores of warmachine cygnar book.

[otakud00d]

Of course we will.

[TimVanBoening]

Great googly moogly.

Is she out yet? What about now? Now?? o_O;;

Seriously, the one model that will tear me away from Angry Elves...

I want to get her. The model alone was my selling point. Give her some good stats, and I'll melt like butter.

Yeah...I feel like a d.bag hypocrite. I said I'd never take up the Swan, but here I am getting giggly over Sloan. Dang you Privateer and brainwashing me into going back on my word.

Next thing you know, I'll be wanting a Menoth army. Oh wait....crap, I already do.

-shakes fist furiously-

[Tamwulf]

Awesome rifle!

I hope she can do something for warjacks though. A nice range buff for a Cyclone maybe... :)

[EnternalVoid]

I seriously see RAT 7 with her now and if they give her RAT 8, I will be unhappy *amusingly Cygnar is one of my factions and the one I have played the Most in Mark II*.

RAT 7 is above average, infact it is on the higher end of casters and on part with several casters known for their range abilities. She does not need to match pCaine in RAT. For one she is more likely to be aiming then he is, thus something to take into account.

Really in some ways this gun has me wondering. My wishlist for her was to have a decent gun with magesight or Truesight as well as Deadeye. Already we know she has a pretty darn good gun. Weaponmaster means against solos and shieldwalls we likely don't have to boost. But it makes me wonder about what else she will get. I agree we are likely looking at an armor 14 and defense 16. Though I would almost not be surprised if we get Armor and defense 15. Kind of like Irusk, not easy to hit but not hard, not the easiest to hurt but still soft. Likely 15-16 wounds.

I am really hoping she has something to deal with stealth but I can' blame anyone if she does not get it. If anything it will likely be the true sight spell that eCaine has. Magesight is likely to much as it would allow are jacks to fire on the targets and being able to ignore clouds and forests really would give no place to hide. At least Truesight just means no defense bonuses or stealth, you can still hide behind a screen, forests, or a smoke template.

I am starting to feel her Feat will be a defensive one or a Battlegroup only one. To good of an offensive one might start to mess with balance and I would much much rather this Warcaster be fair as well as competative.

[whats82]

All this expectation of existing spells.. I want some spanking new spells, one that's her signature.

[PrudentMantis]

I seriously see RAT 7 with her now and if they give her RAT 8, I will be unhappy *amusingly Cygnar is one of my factions and the one I have played the Most in Mark II*.

RAT 7 is above average, infact it is on the higher end of casters and on part with several casters known for their range abilities. She does not need to match pCaine in RAT. For one she is more likely to be aiming then he is, thus something to take into account.

See, the problem with giving her RAT 7 is that that's bog-standard ATGM RAT. Apart from Caine1, the Dude, the GMCA, and the B13 all have RAT 8. If she's going to be a gun mage warcaster, it's not that she needs to be as good as Caine1, but rather that she should be better than an (admittedly elite) infantryman.

[EnternalVoid]

See, the problem with giving her RAT 7 is that that's bog-standard ATGM RAT. Apart from Caine1, the Dude, the GMCA, and the B13 all have RAT 8. If she's going to be a gun mage warcaster, it's not that she needs to be as good as Caine1, but rather that she should be better than an (admittedly elite) infantryman.

But she is better than an infantryman in this case, afterall she has focus. Seriously, think about it this way. You find out you have an arcanic power to improve your own abilities, whether it be aiming or hitting power. Why would you not use it? If anything you have to be really really really careful not to let it become a crutch.

Why did Nemo's MAT and RAT never really go up from him likely being a Journeyman? It was likely because he could rely on his arcanic abilities rather than do the hard way and train alot. I get the feeling that jumping from a RAT7 to RAT8 might well make you one of those one in a hundred sort that is natural talent built on top of hard work and effort. All those you listed as having RAT8 are elite gunmages that never had the ability to use that addtional arcanic abilities to increase their abilities.

So who is a better shooter, Lynch, or Sloan if she has RAT 7? Sloan is, because with her additional magic potiential she is more accurate *if you fail to get what I mean, which is better, RAT8+2d6 or RAT7+3d6*. Being able to boost is like effectively having a +3.5 RAT.

Caine they made a point of saying has the natural talent and instincts backed by the arcanic talent and on Top of ALL THAT he has put a LOT of effort into it. For his Shoot them up, whirlwind action method he needs to have peerless Aim with out using his other arcanic abilities more often then others might. Sloan on the other hand is likely alot more stable, taking time to aim and not needing to have the sheer accuacy that Caine needs in those chaoic seconds between life and death.

[Jiub]

Sloan will have RAT 8. Feel free to skip the "trying to justify why it shouldn't happen" phase and go straight to the "complaining about it ineffectually" phase. Somewhere else, ideally.

[PrudentMantis]

That's a very good point, and in-universe I agree. Unfortunately, out-of-universe, people expect, for better or for worse, their army commanders to be better, faster, stronger, et cetera, than your rank-and-file infantry. You can get away with it if your army commander is not obviously based on any normal trooper, or if they are, have that trooper not be a front-line type, as with any (in my opinion, false) analogies drawn between Nemo and Stormsmiths, or the perhaps more apt one between Darius and Mechaniks (although, if Ironheads came out, or a non-character Arcane Mechanik...). But for someone like Caine or Kara, who are both obviously based on ATGMs, most people would - rationally or not - have a problem with them not even having a RAT equal to the UA.

Once again, in-universe your reasoning is damn-near impeccable, it's only when you get back here, you run into Authority Equals Asskicking (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AuthorityEqualsAsskicking).

It's just the way most people think, about fiction, at least.

[isawatsuke]

gun looks good enough to make her compete with siege and ecaine for my second tourney lot. Its a lot better than i expected tbh but of course ill hold my excitement till i see the spell list and feat.

People mention her to be rat 8 but with her gun and its potential assasination run i wouldnt mind rat 7 actually. Your probably going to want to bring rangers anyway.

I hope she has snipe tho ive always wanted a competetive caster with snipe.

[EnternalVoid]

First off, PrudentMantis, I found the link very amusing. First off because my favorite characters are often the ones more drawn from reality. I enjoyed the realization of Manji from Blade of the Immortal when he found out just how rusty his skills had grown due to his immortal body. Second off I am a very active reading and I can follow what the article is saying with not just many novels but games as well. So I follow exactly what you are saying, in fact I agree. Many people want their leaders to be the greatest thing to walk the battlefield, luckily not all, but you do bring a very valid point concerning the thought patterns of some people. I thanks you for an intelligent response.

Anyhow, that link is very amusing and I thank you again for posting it, it made me smile and chuckle. I even saved it to show a few people I know.


Sloan will have RAT 8. Feel free to skip the "trying to justify why it shouldn't happen" phase and go straight to the "complaining about it ineffectually" phase. Somewhere else, ideally.

First, I really hope this is sarcasm. It is hard to tell with the internet at times. If it was sarcasm please ignore the following comments. If it was not sarcasm then I think I should be the one asking you to go away quickly before what ever you got spreads and we have a contamination issue. Seriously that post, if it was a honest response and not a joke, is ignorance in motion.

I like a fair game, in fact I would rather have a fair and balanced game then have one where my faction reigns King over all others due to balance issues. I started my wargaming with Games Workshop, so I have seen my share of imbalance armies. The issue with power creeps in Warmachine is nothing like the power surges of Warhammer. Almost all games have these problems, often after new material comes out or along similar veins. I was not surprised when Privateer Press announced Mark II, I had already figured it was going to happen eventually. Instead, I WISH Games Workshop took a page from Privateer Press and did things like Field Tests and general releases over their progressive army book issues. It is far easier to balance a game and system across the board at the get go of an edition then try to spread it from army book to army book.


If Sloan does have RAT 8 rather than 7, Fine I will play the game. I will even play the game if they make her RAT 4. Privateer Press owns the right to their game and can do what they want with it. I do not play the Doom and Gloom game that when I disagree with something I rant and rave about how the very people who own the rights to the game are wrong. It is entirely with in their rights to do things. Does that mean the stuff they do will make the game balanced and fair, no, but I can at least put what faith I can in them that they will seek to keep it as fair and balanced as possible. If the game ever in my opinion gets beyond hope or just to far off course, just as it is in Privateer Press?s right to make the game as they wish, it is in my own right to stop playing. Not likely going to happen soon as I trust Privateer Press not to ruin the game at this point.

[wckdhunter]

I like the rest of you all can't wait to see her real stats but ever since the first announcement all i have been thinking about is "magelock rifle" and what special rounds/shots she has. ATGM are standard style rounds then you have the B13 and they are tier 2 abilities, i can't wait to see hers.

[isawatsuke]

i kinda think the weaponmaster is the "special bullet" already since its an extra d6 damage. actually does weaponmaster work on ranged? i thought it was onl melee since guns had brutal damage or something. I could be wrong tho. Bottom line tho i dont think we can expect anymore special bullets.

[BlackSwan2276]

i kinda think the weaponmaster is the "special bullet" already since its an extra d6 damage. actually does weaponmaster work on ranged? i thought it was onl melee since guns had brutal damage or something. I could be wrong tho. Bottom line tho i dont think we can expect anymore special bullets.

Ranged weapons can have weaponmaster. I believe there are a few of these in hordes (javelins on the wolf riders is an example).

Brutal damage is a bullet. I know that is getting technical, but I think the difference in name is to differentiate that weaponmaster on a ranged weapon is every shot fired while brutal damage is one of a list of choices.

[otakud00d]

She probably won't have special rounds, as much as we'd love it.

Caine sure as hell doesn't.

[Negative9]

She probably won't have special rounds, as much as we'd love it.

Caine sure as hell doesn't.

Caine's got better things to do than sit around carving runes on bullets. Things like killing people.

[Ysthrall]

She probably won't have special rounds, as much as we'd love it.

Caine sure as hell doesn't.

Also, Caine seems optimised more for quantity of fire. And he's using pistols, not a rifle.

I look forwards to her rules coming out...

[PrudentMantis]

I'm not sure about her not having runebullets - after all, both the model and the art have big honkin' bullets with runes carved into them - they even glow!

And like Negative9 and Ysthrall said, for Caine to do that many bullets...? I can't remember how long it takes a Gun Mage to carve one bullet, but I'd bet it's at least half an hour, more likely an hour. Take that, multiply by how many bullets Caine1 fires every time he pops his feat, or Caine2 when he's going all super-solo, multiply again by at least three, so that he has a variety of bullets, as well as having a reserve, then look at how fast he can fire them, and boggle. Alternatively, I've been thinking that maybe all the Spellstorm pistols do is be revolvers and have the Range Amplifiers. The Pow 12 and Range 12 over your typical Gun Mage's Range 10 Pow 10 is him carving a mix of Brutal Damage and Snipe on every bullet.

Also, @EternalVoid - just be careful about that site, it's like Wikipedia (http://xkcd.com/214/), only worse (http://xkcd.com/609/).

(I really should start reading xkcd again...)

[xeletor]

... and then Sloan got line of sight :)

First one to write it, EVAAAA!!!

[mrhuettel]

... and then Sloan got line of sight :)

mmmmmh... already my favourite end to battle reports. i have always liked the "caine's got line of sight" or "lord commander stryker found a lane to charge", but this is completely new.

oh cygnus, how i love thee!

[CT GAMER]

Awesome rifle!

I hope she can do something for warjacks though. A nice range buff for a Cyclone maybe... :)


Her fluff blurb mentioned her being able to coordinate her warjack's fire did it not?

Sounds like "firing squad might be just that sort of thing...maybe anything she hits with her rifle her warjacks then get to reroll missed ranged attacks against or get a flat +2 to hit or similar?

Also the gobber as mentioned in the other thread will allow her ROF2...

[Dyoria]

Lol imagine if she got brutal rounds...

POW 12 + 5d6... hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe. x2


As a matter of fact, all the special rounds sound vicious in her gun.

Brutal: OMG +5d6
Snipe: 24" threat on that gun?
Thunderbolt: Ok not that bad
Blackpenny: Hide behind Precusors, shoot whatever they charge.
Fire beacon: Free Mage Sight? And can still fire a normal round thanks to gobber?

Harsh.

[Northblade]

My thinking is she's coming from the rank and file of Long Gunners, so I look at her from their angle.

Maybe Dual Shot AND an extra attack from Reinholdt? If LG's are RAT 5 and can CRA, then maybe she'll have a RAT 6 or 7? Def 15 ARM 14?

From the photo she appears to have some kind of help or synergy with the Cyclone, spells to buff ranged jacks like Guided Fire, Mage Sight, maybe Magic Bullet?

She is very interesting, and looks to be a great addition to our Forces.

Go KARA!

[Smoke]

Not to be Debbie Downer....

But I do want I do want to point out that this isn't really a HUGE magnitude of superiority over what we have seen before:

Seige's rocket cannon:

14" Range, Average damage roll w/o boost (21) w/boost (24.5) Damage Range w/o boost (16-26) w/ boost (17-32)

+ one shot of armor piercing. This seems equally as able to kill at a distance.

Sloans:
14" range, average damage roll w/o boost (22.5) w/boost (26) Damage range w/o boost (15-30) w/ boost (16-36)

w/o (so far) an armor piercing shot.



THese seem a bit comparable. Not to mention the aforementioned eCaine....

Now the difference should be this: I imagine Sloan with spells/feats that improve her damage output, otherwise, this gun is not as much a difference over the Rocket Cannon.

[Dino-Czar]

With RoF 1 she can't Dual Shot. I'm still hoping for arcane effects on each of her attacks though... Fire Beacon + Truesight (spell) would be just great, but I'm really looking for something new.

If she has Guided Fire I swear I'll cry big buckets of tears. Just maybe Firing Squad will save me from such a fate.

edit:

this gun is not as much a difference over the Rocket Cannon.

Of course it isn't. But we all love that gun too.

[MadJack]

Why did Nemo's MAT and RAT never really go up from him likely being a Journeyman? It was likely because he could rely on his arcanic abilities rather than do the hard way and train alot.
I actually would have thought that Nemo's MAT and RAT did go up, it's just that now he's an old man, and they've gone back down due to slowing reflexes, arthritis, etc.

[Dyoria]

@MadJAck: I agree, and Id also have to use the Picard vs Kirk argument. Nemo, like Picard was a little man, more brain then brawn. Maybe the Sean Connery Bond vs Roger Moore Bond would be a better example.

@Smoke: Except you can only AP once per game. And Siege only has a RAT of 6, Id be very surprised if Sloan got less then 8.

Maybe she will have a *attack that makes one attack act as though it were AP.

[CT GAMER]

[QUOTE=Dyoria;107974 And Siege only has a RAT of 6, Id be very surprised if Sloan got less then 8.[/QUOTE]

I 'd bet RAT7

[Blaque]

I don't see why folks are adverse to RAT 8 myself. We have a lot of warcasters and warlocks that when their primary weapon comes into play get the stat at 8, such as the Butcher(both), Kromac, Caine(both), eLylyth, Xerxis, Morghoul(both) and eMadrak. and Ashynn. ELylyth has similar threat range, similar damage output and doesn't need a gobber to get the second shot. An dhas Eyeless Sight, Arcane Archer adn other chikanary.

Sow ith all that, I really think folks underestimate what Sloan can do there. As for her abilities, I'm also doubting rune bullets. As far as I ever saw it, those getting the Range Amplification are his Rune Bullets. Sloan may simply ahve that same rule as well.

And stuff.

[Mutton]

@MadJAck: I agree, and Id also have to use the Picard vs Kirk argument. Nemo, like Picard was a little man, more brain then brawn. Maybe the Sean Connery Bond vs Roger Moore Bond would be a better example.

@Smoke: Except you can only AP once per game. And Siege only has a RAT of 6, Id be very surprised if Sloan got less then 8.

Maybe she will have a *attack that makes one attack act as though it were AP.

First off, Connery. I don't care in what kind of contest, but Connery. And if we got him as a 'caster, the war would already be over.

I really just find it off that her rifle is more powerful than a freaking rocket launcher, I guess she just no-scopes.

[Ghyrrshyld]

I don't see why folks are adverse to RAT 8 myself. We have a lot of warcasters and warlocks that when their primary weapon comes into play get the stat at 8, such as the Butcher(both), Kromac, Caine(both), eLylyth, Xerxis, Morghoul(both) and eMadrak. and Ashynn. ELylyth has similar threat range, similar damage output and doesn't need a gobber to get the second shot. An dhas Eyeless Sight, Arcane Archer adn other chikanary.
I have any number of magic wielding Warcasters who beg to differ. Cryx can kill things at that distance with a Warcaster, it just costs way too much to do.

[Dino-Czar]

First off, Connery. I don't care in what kind of contest, but Connery. And if we got him as a 'caster, the war would already be over.

I really just find it off that her rifle is more powerful than a freaking rocket launcher, I guess she just no-scopes.

She has an aimbot. You can totally tell.

[bouncymischa]

See, the problem with giving her RAT 7 is that that's bog-standard ATGM RAT. Apart from Caine1, the Dude, the GMCA, and the B13 all have RAT 8. If she's going to be a gun mage warcaster, it's not that she needs to be as good as Caine1, but rather that she should be better than an (admittedly elite) infantryman.

If that's true, then why does Stryker (either version) have the same MAT as a bog-standard Stormblade?


I don't see why folks are adverse to RAT 8 myself. We have a lot of warcasters and warlocks that when their primary weapon comes into play get the stat at 8, such as the Butcher(both), Kromac, Caine(both), eLylyth, Xerxis, Morghoul(both) and eMadrak. and Ashynn. ELylyth has similar threat range, similar damage output and doesn't need a gobber to get the second shot. An dhas Eyeless Sight, Arcane Archer adn other chikanary.

Sow ith all that, I really think folks underestimate what Sloan can do there. As for her abilities, I'm also doubting rune bullets. As far as I ever saw it, those getting the Range Amplification are his Rune Bullets. Sloan may simply ahve that same rule as well.

And stuff.

I think the main concern is that all of those MAT 8 casters actually need to get into melee to use that accuracy. The other thing is that a ranged caster can simply stand still to give themselves an effect +2 bonus to their RAT, so a RAT 8 caster standing still is actually a RAT 10 caster.

All in all, in terms of game balance, it'll probably come down to a variety of factors. RAT 8 already exists in Warmachine and Hordes, so there's a precedent, but there's also several RAT 7 casters (just not in Cygnar, so far). I suspect it's due to the number of buffs they have available -- so it'll likely depend on how her spell list and other abilities play out.

It'll probably also depend on how Privateer sees her playstyle working out. Cygnar already has a "Oh I got LOS you're dead" caster in Caine. If Sloane is more of a support caster than an assassination caster, then I can see her having less RAT than Caine.

Oh... and Firing Squad does sound awesome if it's her feat, but I wonder how it'd differ from Blitz...

[Top]

Oh... and Firing Squad does sound awesome if it's her feat, but I wonder how it'd differ from Blitz...

Make a 100 point list with Kara and Captain Haley, then Kara can do whatever it is she does again. :D

[Blaque]

I have any number of magic wielding Warcasters who beg to differ. Cryx can kill things at that distance with a Warcaster, it just costs way too much to do.
That Cryx can't do something is not an arguement that it is impossible. I already noted casters who have 8 on thier primary attack stat. CIrcle can't really assassinate beyond 10" if we choose range and we don't have good range to do it with really. Also note that most Cryx casters are mages and meleers first. Their lack of a true ranged caster is duet o PP deciding nto to give them a true ranged caster, nothing more.

All that said, I wonder what it has to do wtih the arguement of whether a model can have RAT 8 or not and a good gun, since as far as I can see, precedent says "Yes".

And stuff.