caster charges and casting mid-charge

[Bumpasses]

So im still awaiting my "OFFICIAL" copy of rules but I don't remember anything about casters being able to cast mid-charge and then not have to finish/complete the charge.

Played against Cygnar....Lord Stryker

Charged his own model, then cast velocity mid charge i think it was, ran around the charged model and made a separate/new attack against another.
Never having finished the actual charge....
This legal????

It was a game ender for me, killed Fiona with the 3 dice of death (pow 27), im not familiar with every "trick" but ive never seen this.

j

[Mod_Faultie]

Ummm...hmmm.
I'd suggest the rules forum, but this is interesting. I believe you can cast before making your charge attack...but...hmmm.

[EnternalVoid]

Here is the jist of what I have gotten from reading similar threads and from the rule thread. The order of operation is such:

1) Model declares charge and the charge target.
2) Measure then move the model for the charge.
3) If model is in Melee range, the charge is completed. If the model is not in melee range it is a fail charge and the activation ends.
4) Models can now cast spells and use feats in the gap between the charge movement having completed and the actually charge attack. So in this case Stryker can use Velocity.
5) If the model is no longer in combat with the original model it charged, rather than made a charge attack it may make a normal melee attack if a model is in its melee range. It can then continue its turn from there.

This makes certain casters very tricky as they can use charges to increase their movement while worming through your line to get to their real target.

[Kavuking]

Prime Mk2 says in more words that if a model charges its first melee attack has to be against the charge target, so no it was not legal.

This is the first line of the right colum of page 47 in prime mk2 for those with the book.

[masleth]

Yes. You have to give up your initial attack to the charge. Make the attack then continue your activation. So he'd have to swing on the original target, then he could proceed with casting spells and additional attacks. If Stryker couldn't swing on his charge target, it would be a failed charge and his activation would end. Its similar to the eCaine gatecrasher charge. You should find lots of threads about that :rolleyes:.

[Pariah]

Actually, from the mk2 pdf (don't have the book yet the book owners can correct me if it's changed, last paragraph regarding Charge attacks)

"If the charging model cannot make its frst melee attack
against the charge target, the charging model can make its
frst melee attack against another eligible target but it is not
a charge attack. It does not lose its frst attack."

and from "Casting Spells"

"A model can cast spells at any time during its activation but
cannot interrupt its movement or attack to cast a spell. It can
cast a spell before moving, after moving, before an attack, or
after an attack, but not while moving or attacking. A model
cannot cast spells during an activation it ran."

[EnternalVoid]

Pariah is correct. I did not have my book at the time of my first post but I have it now. I also have Mark I prime to highlight the sentence that is missing from Mark II.

Page 66, under Casting Spells it says "A warcaster may cast spells before or after moving, but not in the middle of his movement. Likewises he may cast spells before and after each attack, but he cannont interrupt un unresolved attack, nor can he cast spells between the movement and attack portions of a charge."

In Mark II the working is all pretty much the same save for that last part of the last sentence. It also in Mark II says a charge is successful if you get in melee range with your target, it says nothing about you having to stay there till you swing, just you have to be in melee range after your movement is complete.

So in Mark I this was illegal, Mark II it is fair game. Be mindful of any caster that has a way to move themselves with magic or abilities.

Quick add: Due to this change, it also has changed eCaine's gatecrasher so he can charge, cast it, and get both his initial attacks on his true target.

[CrimsonGuard]

I assumed a charge attack is a combination of movement and action and therefore could not be interrupted by casting spells or anything else.

[EnternalVoid]

I assumed a charge attack is a combination of movement and action and therefore could not be interrupted by casting spells or anything else.

It the case in Mark I, leading to casters needing to get certain spells off before they charged. This changed in Mark II, several Infernals had ruled on it before and stated the change had been intentional. Sadly when I went looking for them again I noticed that much of the Rule section had vanished after the Forum problem they had not to long ago. As it stands though, the ability to interrupt a charge with magic leaves some interesting abilities for some casters.

[vintersbastard]

Sadly when I went looking for them again I noticed that much of the Rule section had vanished after the Forum problem they had not to long ago. As it stands though, the ability to interrupt a charge with magic leaves some interesting abilities for some casters.

The rules section is still completely there. If you're looking for thread from before Nov 24th 2009, you have to look here (http://old.privateerpressforums.com/index.php?showforum=123), but the link to the old forums is also on the forums main page, directly below the Terrain and Table Building forum.

[EnternalVoid]

The rules section is still completely there. If you're looking for thread from before Nov 24th 2009, you have to look here (http://old.privateerpressforums.com/index.php?showforum=123), but the link to the old forums is also on the forums main page, directly below the Terrain and Table Building forum.

I am talking about posts disappearing when they had the forum trouble not that long ago. I noticed quite a few posts had completely vanished after that *two of my own posts I had started had*. I am well aware of the older forums and that they are still acessable.

[masleth]

Thanks for clarifying that. I missed the alternate target ruling.

[Lanz]

Unless it's changed, you can cast spells before or after an action, but not in the middle of it. You can charge something, move, then cast before you make your charge attack, but you definitely can't stop in the middle of a charge movement to cast a spell, then continue moving.

"The charging model
then advances its current SPD plus 3˝
in that direction, in a
straight line. The charging model cannot voluntarily stop its


movement until its target is in its melee range, then it can end
this movement at any point."


It should be noted that Ashlynn can pull similar manuvers using Gallows, charging a friendly model, casting gallows on the intended just-out-of-reach target, and pulling them into range.

Also though the new charge rules, you can charge something and are not obligated to attack it, so could charge a friendly model in almost any case, but if you want to attack, you have to start with the charge attack, which must be on the charged model.