Which warlock would you bring against...

[blueskin]

In league play where one would be able to change list entirely between games, which of our warlocks is best against:

a - Khador

b - Cryx

c - The Protectorate of Menoth

d - Trollbloods

e - Cygnar

If you could bring two lists against each one of these opponents, what casters/lists would you choose? What is most important to consider when playing against them?

[LEJKaya]

Cryx has to be Kromac. You can go Mohsar but for sheer competitivness Kromac. In both cases because they can shut down channeling (Kromac also shuts down magic, Mohsar needs druids for that).

I like pKaya beating down on the tough Khador stuff and also for some cygnar, a lot of cygnar casters are squishy.

[Jotun]

Our best Warlocks (in my opinion) versus the following are:

a) Khador - Baldur
b) Cryx - Kromac
c) Menoth - Kromac
d) Trollbloods - Pkaya
e) Cygnar - Stormwrath

[Faradon]

e) Cygnar - Stormwrath

I find that with the popularity of stormNouns that Krueger has a slightly harder time with Cygnar now. In the last few games I've played pretty much the only things not immune to electricity for cygnar have been Jacks and B13 (which are fun to kill)

[LEJKaya]

Yeah, I think Stormwrath is very much a second tier caster now and cygnar are possibly his worst match up... Unless I suppose you have krueger and druids+UA and wayfarers against a cygnar lightning list :)

[blueskin]

How about tactics then?

[Blaque]

Stormlord I'm finding does pretty okay against Cygnar actually. I guess it depends on meta and how people play, but Stormwall helps a lot in that department. Last Friday the Black 13th kind of killed itself save for Ryan for being a half-inch too close to Krueger when they tried to Magestorm. Quite hillarious.

Moonhunter can run an all-Stealth force pretty nicely and Bloodweavers cause the non-shooty Cygnar stuff to explode pretty satisfactory if you go that route. Always worth a look into, although he rlack of real good end-game would be the main issue.

Mohsar I also think would do pretty good, if anything because Pillar of Salt > their shooty a lot of the time unless its a Defender or Siege.

And stuff.

[Mosstooth]

I don't think Baldur is a bad match against trollbloods. Though pkaya would give you the extra attacks to get around their locks toughing on you :)

[Jotun]

True enough about the Cygnar immunity to electricity but I still find him rather effective against them. I also find Baldur equally so, and as another person pointed out eKaya.

[Blaque]

Kaya the Moonhunter is also, random note, good against Retribution for that same reason. That faction packs a lot of firearms I notice and about the only thing they don't really ignore is Stealth. So worth to think about.

ANd stuff.

[blueskin]

Is it important to bring something fast, flanking to pick of support solos against Menoth?

[Der Dexter]

stealth against pointy ears is a definite go, but also fast units work, since they are almost as fragile as circle stuff, axcept dawnguard.

also Krueger grants immunity to electricity as well, lo lightning based swansongs also have a part of their own tactics neutered.

[krom71]

In league play where one would be able to change list entirely between games, which of our warlocks is best against:

a - Khador

b - Cryx

c - The Protectorate of Menoth

d - Trollbloods

e - Cygnar

If you could bring two lists against each one of these opponents, what casters/lists would you choose? What is most important to consider when playing against them?

Khador - I prefer pKaya, eKaya and Baldur. Its all about either out-manuevering or slowing them down even further.

Cryx - I like Mohsar and Kromac for reasons others have stated. 3 rounds of Sunhammer on bonejacks tends to push your opponent into mistakes.

Protectorate - I like pKrueger and Mohsar. Mohsar's RFP is great for stopping soul collecting and no one kills support models like the lightning man. "Let the hate flow through you."

Trollbloods - I like pKaya and Baldur against them. I liked both Kaya's in MK I but the loss of double strike and against the odds makes eKaya a little short in the damage area.

Cygnar - Stormlord, eKaya, Mohsar and Baldur have all worked well for me.

[blueskin]

So what do you think about the scenarios in SR2010? What caster do you think is best suited to handle each scenario?

[Faradon]

Ekrueger can actually do well in control point scenarios... especially when it is "hold this circle and win the game." kind of thing.

I think one of circle's biggest weaknesses is how fragile everything is across the board. When you are playing games where you are forced into a mosh pit or small control areas you become big targets that still can't take hits.

I find in playing circle for mosh pit is to get something in to contest as best you can and then go for the assassination as quickly as possible.

[Jotun]

I'm still debating and applying theorymachine to the new Steamroller scenarios. I don't like to speculate until I test, but I'll do it in the spirit of this conversation. From a casual look at them, I'd lean toward Kromac or Baldur.

[blueskin]

I see the point in bringing eKrueger to certain scenarios but I wonder if his feat is strong enough. Pushing a maximum of 3" during the feat turn isn't really that impressive. I'd guess Baldur and Kromac are better at limiting movement.

[blueskin]

Ok, another angle here. If you're playing Circle vs Circle (pKaya) - which of our warlocks is best against her? I've zero ideas, I haven't met her...

What would you use and why?

[Menoth's Gambit]

For the most part, I agree with everyones selections.

Will add a couple more for consideration.

Versus Cryx: Absolutely agree Kromac is a good choice. Add in Druids to just seal the deal.

Versus Khador: I prefer manueverability. eKaya, and Epic Krueger. For me, its all about isolating the target models one at time.

Versus Menoth: Kromac is a good choice and I agree with Mohsar. However, Baldur is also very strong versus Menoth, as his spell solid ground gives some protection versus Menoth AOE madness. Gotta watch out for AMPs (Or whatever the heck it is called these days) I would also add that Morvhana has some strength versus Menoth. Her + ARM spell helps versus AOEs, and EoL usually is going to have a number of good candidates.

[Bloodwind]

who are going to be bunched together if they brought TFG or Zealots. Makes a great target for any of our anti-infantry spells.

[Blackraine]

My thoughts:

Khador: Baldur or Kromac. They're the only casters with enough damage to get the jobs done themselves, and Khadoran casters tend to run closer to the front due to the lack of arc nodes, making it more likely that you'll get to them. I think Khador is actually one of Kromac's better matchups, and one of Baldur's best matchups, where we really need that +2 Str. I'd also consider eKaya for the job for this reason.

Cryx: Morvhana or Krueger. I wouldn't have said that prior to the Jan 29th update, but I'm super happy to say it now. Now that Eruption of Life works on undead, it makes an excellent counter to the undead swarm armies. Additionally, her synergy with infantry allows Reeves and Bloodtrackers to operate more effectively, both of which excel at taking down Cryx 'jacks moreso than any other type of warjack. Krueger goes here because he also excels at taking down infantry, and because Cryx has nothing that's immune to lightning.

Cygnar: Morvhana and eKaya. Morvhana is, as always, a great anti-infantry caster, and Regrowth on a non-stealth unit can help win the shoot-out vs. Cygnar. eKaya is also good against Cygnar, primarily for her ability to give out stealth to her battlegroup, but also because the charge ranges her beasts are capable of (between dogpile and other stacked buffs) allows her to deal with certain threats (Black 13th) early in the game.

Menoth: Krueger, Morvhana, and Mohsar. Mohsar removes models from play and prevents channelling, both of which are invaluable against the Protectorate. Additionally, his Sunhammer spell is, perhaps, at its most effective against the Protectorate, as they're slower, and will thus spend more time moving in his control area (also, they have high armor, so anything that does straight damage is that much more valuable). Morvhana might as well be a protectorate caster... she kills infantry well, she resurrects her own stuff, and she punishes you for daring to attack her. Doing what the Protectorate does, only better (in some cases) makes her a good choice to take against them. Lastly, Krueger kills infantry. Protectorate has infantry, i.e. Krueger kills protectorate.

Retribution: No clue... no one plays Retribution where I live.

[blueskin]

druids+ua against Protectorate must be playable. Immunity to fire and the ablility to push around jacks is schweet! Kromac is a lock I really need to play more to say anything about but in theory he seems real solid against them. Hrm... I must try to make an anti-menoth list!