New Cards - too dark with art too small to recognize during gaming?

[NightMoor]

Well I got my MKII Cryx deck (and a Merc deck...for about three cards I needed) and something I'm a little disappointed about is how hard it is to make out what anything is due to the small, darkish artwork. At arm's length I can hardly recognize any of the warjacks and solos at all, and the infantry aren't much easier to guage. Are other people finding the same problem or am I totally alone in having trouble making anything out? It's a little depressing that I'm already contemplating putting my own stickers on everything just so that I can tell what's what when I'm reaching to write down damage/check stats...

[Typhael]

A friend of mine has similar complaints, and although I don't like the mkII cards nearly as much as I like the homebrew ones made during the FT, I don't have a huge problem with them.

[McCryx]

My problem is that I saw some of the new cards which come with the models and they were glossy and slick. These feel llike they were cut from cheap paper and the finish is lack luster. Not too impressed. I'm also not a fan of the price tag. $10. That's what it should have cost. You get the same amont of cards in a magic booster (more or less irc.)

Secondly, why don't all the casters have flavor text. I'm browse'n through them and get to Skarre and .... nadda. Sigh.

I was also hoping for an easter egg or two, mainly an adjusted point cost here, a modified ability there. Nope. We're pretty much 100% as expected. Poor goreshade. What a piece of crap. At least you're in the fluff right?

/rant

-Cheers-

[draxius]

Poor goreshade. What a piece of crap. At least you're in the fluff right?

Normal? Epic? All of the Above?

Goreshade was never really my thing - I don't think I've ever actually fielded either version...

But I don't like feeling he shouldn't be played because he's not viable.

[McCryx]

He's boring and doesn't really do much for your troops. He's not offensive, not defensive, just bleh.

Sure, at 15 points pGoreshade is good thanks to feat. But.... He's no where near as cool as in his fluff. (Terminus is, Gaspy is, Skarre is, Denny is, Shall I go on?)

-Cheers-

[GaspysInhaler]

That's why I refer to him as Snoreshade.

Soulgate is a shadow of what it used to be. Skarlock is more or less useless with him unless you plan on Hexblasting and then getting vaporized the next turn.

I hate how the latest incarnation of Circle casters have both of his "money" spells, but a cheaper/upkeepable version of them. Kaya has "Shadowpack" which is an upkeep of Shadowmancer (minus dark shroud....but who honestly casts that spell to get +2 PS?...you do it for the Stealth). Kromac has "Bestial" which, IMO, is ten times better than Mage Blight. Stopping spells from being channeled is huge, especially against armies like Cryx. All for a whopping 3 Fury, compared to Mage Blight which is 5 focus and you can't cast any of his other good spells if you do it.

People will say "Yea but mage blight stops feats!". Do you guys know how many times I've had Mage Blight up and my opponent simply walked out of my control range and proceeded to channel spells or pop their feat? More times than I'd like to remember.

Before this gets too winded, I'll just say I do enjoy using Snoreshade against Hordes. Deathwalker doesnt have to be within 3" of him anymore, but in his command of 7". This hurts beasts a lot, not to mention HexBlast is great against certain beasts with OP animi. His feat is still solid. He could have been so much more though...

[Charbok]

Sadly, we've known that the cards as previewed last April were kind of crappy, and lo; here we are with crappy cards. :( The Powers That Be liked them, and anything said now is decried as whining.

Goreshade has never been my cuppa- he was an easy button in MKI, and he's dull as dirt in Mark II. Perhaps he'll get errata'd at some point, or, hold out hope, get some kind of new shiny tactic with our upcoming releases. I still remember the tepid reception to EVlad when Apotheosis dropped, so all's never lost.:)

On the upside, the Coven are actually interesting to me now, and they were an even more egregious Easy Button in MKI. :D

[Arkady]

Well I got my MKII Cryx deck (and a Merc deck...for about three cards I needed) and something I'm a little disappointed about is how hard it is to make out what anything is due to the small, darkish artwork. At arm's length I can hardly recognize any of the warjacks and solos at all, and the infantry aren't much easier to guage. Are other people finding the same problem or am I totally alone in having trouble making anything out? It's a little depressing that I'm already contemplating putting my own stickers on everything just so that I can tell what's what when I'm reaching to write down damage/check stats...
I agree with you completely. When I first saw the new Cryx solo that was previewed in the newsletter, at first glance I thought it was Mortenebra.

The new cards are hideous. They are cluttered with a bunch of useless crap, and completely fail to take advantage of their beautiful art. Any of the homebrew variants that were available on the forum were far superior. In fact, I'm surprised they stuck with their crappy design. They must have given the job to an employee's kid or nephew or something, and didn't want to make them feel bad. :rolleyes:

[blakeh1]

The only complaint I have with the new cards is the small picture and uniformity of the picture. it makes it hard when scanning through the cards quickly to find the one your looking for. I don't see why they couldn't have had larger artwork like the old color card designs. Everything else could have stayed and it would still have worked. So I'd give it an C- on design.

[Beavertron]

I think the models that are missing the little quote box dont have one as it wouldnt fit due to that model/unit have lots of weapon stats its the same with the the other decks aswell, I like that the Retribution casters are getting some quotes in though (on the gorshade/deathwalker cards). Anyone else noticed a difference between the cards from the plastic jack kits and those from the decks im not sure if its just the batch my lgs got but they seem to be less coloured and more coarse is anyone else finding this?

[blakeh1]

The small ppictures of cropped faces makes it even harder to distingush at a glance anything Exemplar related for those Protectorate players

[sanj]

Anyone else noticed a difference between the cards from the plastic jack kits and those from the decks im not sure if its just the batch my lgs got but they seem to be less coloured and more coarse is anyone else finding this?


I was reading this and thought "ah someone else has noticed it too", then I realised it was you posting and we had this conversation on Tuesday!

So has anyone else noticed this or is it just the batch shipped Portsmouth?

I found it very hard to identify cards by the image window alone when I wanted to quickly check my opponent's cryx cards during a game.

[DemonCalibre]

The Art window is kind of small...

It would be totally awesome, if Privateer put the name of the model on the top of the card, so I could just read it when I needed to identify it....oh wait...

[n0signal]

The cards are very expensive, especially if they're printed cheaply. Unfortunately PP have got me by the balls - I'm just too damn lazy to make my own cards nowdays; despite having all the templates still from the Field Test. So, I'll no doubt end up buying a Cryx deck at some point, when I feel like properly playing Warmachine again.

[NightMoor]

It would be totally awesome, if Privateer put the name of the model on the top of the card, so I could just read it when I needed to identify it....oh wait...
You can actually read the tiny model names easily, at arms length, when you're gaming? I think you might be in the minority...

[Defenstrator]

You can actually read the tiny model names easily, at arms length, when you're gaming? I think you might be in the minority...
I can, but then I've had lasic eye surgery. :)

But yes, the new cards are ok, but I wouldn't rate them higher than that. They'll do the job but certainly don't have much "wow" factor. (Bananchuck cards for MKIII for the win!)

[2LiveIs2Die]

IIRC privateer press is a business. Correct me if I'm wrong, but if they do not make money, they can't continue. And as far as I'm concerned as long as they are not paper thin, and have the abilities listed, I don't care. They were innovative with using cards back in the time they came out with them, and it made the game simple. And if (lets pretend) there are 1,000 warmachine players and 1,000 hordes player, and 10% of the community are fanatics, and 90% of the comunity will purchase the merc cards if they play any merc (even cross-over for hordes) Then you can imagine that you would need 100 of each deck to sell to the fanatics, 1000 of each for the individual players, a ton more merc decks, etc.
Obviously the numbers are more, so if they made them cheaply, fine, they have to provide them for everyone, it's not like the optional ones that came out in the past, where you didn't have to buy them, so plenty of people chose not to. That's a lot of cards, I do not blame them for making them cheap if they did.

Also, refering to MtG cards, in the past 3 years they went up 35% in price and down in quality tremendously. Don't compare the PP cards to them.

[Temoinlanuit]

Sadly, we've known that the cards as previewed last April were kind of crappy, and lo; here we are with crappy cards. :( The Powers That Be liked them, and anything said now is decried as whining.
Heh. My thoughts exactly.

But don't tell the General forums that - obviously, the new cards were preferred by the vast majority of players.

Edit: /sarcasm

[blakeh1]

I don't think so, I remember quite a lot of threads in the forums amounting to how the new card design just wasn't as good as some of the homebrewed or even the old card designs

[Ghyrrshyld]

I don't think so, I remember quite a lot of threads in the forums amounting to how the new card design just wasn't as good as some of the homebrewed or even the old card designs
Can someone point me to some homebrews? Because looking at the cards to figure out which card is which is impossible.

[Gorbad]

All the homebrew cards have been taken down, you are not going to find them on this site at all.

Honestly I fine with them. The jacks are going to take a bit of practice to learn to tell apart, but for anything else I got no problem. And I actually like the look of them. I was a bit disappointed there was no quote for Skarre but she got too many weapons to fit it all in! I'll take and additional weapon over a quote :p

They were not the most amazing looking design ever, but PP have some 'mechanical' considerations that needed to be meet too and eh, whatever. They are a game aid, I just need to see the stats and special rules, and they will certainly give me that. I'll get the fluff and art from the book anyway.

[DemonCalibre]

I have never had problems reading cards(neither has my play group), Also there are more visual ques on a Card then simply the picture.

If you have One Reaper, The card with the Lancer shaped Grid is most likely it, If you have a Death Ripper and a Defiler, The card with the two weapon entries is most likely your defiler. The same can be said for units.

I really feel this is much ado about nothing.

[Winged_Human]

I was reading this and thought "ah someone else has noticed it too", then I realised it was you posting and we had this conversation on Tuesday!

So has anyone else noticed this or is it just the batch shipped Portsmouth?

I found it very hard to identify cards by the image window alone when I wanted to quickly check my opponent's cryx cards during a game.


I have had NUMEROUS complaints from people who purchased the cygnarian plastic jacks, and apparently it IS different. The card stock is very near to what business cards are made of, they're much thinner, and there is no gloss. Ontop of that the color does seem to be dulled down a bit. I had planned on contacting PP in regards to this to see if it was just a batch fluke or what. Glad to hear It's not only happening here.

[mellchia]

It is different. I picked up the Helljack kit and the cards are a lower quality type. It's thinner, flimsier, and actually lighter (not duller) in coloration.

If anything's a positive, it's that the cards being lighter in coloration (not sure if it was an error), but it actually makes it easier to see and read the thing.

Alas though, these are the cards that life has dealt to us.

[DemonCalibre]

As for the Cryx jack box cards, I will point out the thing that did bother me, the Cards are cut unevenly, It's not a huge deal but my Nerotic OCD nature is going to spaz about them till I get them in a plastic cover, so I can't feel the differances in the edges.

[RuneGrey]

While they're not terrible, I hope the next set of cards helps to showcase the wonderful art that PP has created for a lot of these units, rather than just trying to have a 'faction background' that is being emphasized now. Overall, these cards are workable - I'll hope another set of cards comes out in the future that look like some of the homebrews, as I'll be willing to drop another $20 on them to see more of the art, and less of the mechanical guts of the card.

So, can easily make do until later. Hope the next set is different.

[BilesyBelcher]

The set of cards I got out of the deck box were SUPER dark. However, the cards I got out of the plastic Helljack kit are very light and a lot thinner. Im not too happy about the cards, but thankfully I have a system as to what order my cards are in (or else I would not be able to notice the differences between them).

Also, the casters that have more weapons, dont have enough room for a little blurb about them. Both Skarres have what, 3 weapons... leaves a bit of room for a sentence or two.

[NightMoor]

Well I'm encouraged to see I'm not the only one struggling to recognize these things, I was starting to worry my eyes were failing me!

I think what bothers me most is that we waited an entire year for MKII to come out and the new cards are already highly suspect in quality/design.

Whatever, I'm excited the official version of the game is out and ready to play, it's just that I'm already going to have to make my own system, probably involving bright stickers stuck to the cards, to be able to discern them, despite the fact that I just blew a good chunk of money on them.

[2LiveIs2Die]

...I'm excited ... despite the fact that I just blew a good chunk of money on them.
Me too... c:

[69Lazarus]

I think that they are ok. Picked up all the faction decks as well as jacks (ouch) on release day. I see how some of the cards could be confused at a glance.....I usually place my cardholders oriented to where my jacks are on the table.

[blakeh1]

Whatever, I'm excited the official version of the game is out and ready to play, it's just that I'm already going to have to make my own system, probably involving bright stickers stuck to the cards, to be able to discern them, despite the fact that I just blew a good chunk of money on them.

Yeah regardless of quality, I am glad no more printouts to drag around.

[69Lazarus]

Yeah regardless of quality, I am glad no more printouts to drag around.


+1


It's soo nice to actually have the cards.

[sanj]

Yeah regardless of quality, I am glad no more printouts to drag around.


+1


It's soo nice to actually have the cards.

100% agree

I need to ritually burn all my old print outs to expel all the grief they've put me through.

I would recycle them but I don't want any of their evil to re-enter our paper supplies.

[lastspartacus]

Its been a common complaint, one I share. Tiny window art and little fluff test.
Oh well, I bought my deck.

[fuzzypants]

what do people use these things for with the whole arms length thing. now when building the army a big picture would be more useful but after that preliminary step i have do not care about the picture at all(game playing wise not ascetic wise) sure i can read the name of the modal at arms length but oddly enough when i need to be reminded of a modals abilities that is not how i read them. i may not like them as the large pictured versions but they do the same utilitarian job (reference) and in my opinion they do it better as they info boxes are slightly larger do to not being afraid of crowding the art.

as far as cost it doesn't seem to much more when compared to the old mk2 deck. and i think their may be more cards. is it expensive when compared to a magic theme deck, sure but i do not think the same pricing stands.

they are about whet i expected both price and quality wise and i am no more disappointed then i was when i saw the new card layout half a year ago.

[Sabin]

Maybe I just have good vision but I have not had a problem with them at all, the art work is roughly the same size as the monster tokens I used to play D&D with.

[Vondell]

While I do not have any real complaints about the cards, I was slightly saddened to not see a quote on Skarre as well. They could've used the following with the limited space:


"She has a Great Rack."

'nuff said.

[2LiveIs2Die]

Got them today, I see how the cards in the plastic jacks seems a little lightened or washed out. But I see no problem what so ever with the faction deck cards
o.o

[Lich Lord]

I have to say the new cards in the box are just OK - not great. The layout is too over done and there is too much negative space given that the type is so small. Don't get me wrong - they are nice to look at, but I think they could have done a better job.
PP designs a great set of games but this they should hand off to a different designer than the one they used.
But it's nice to have the cards. I'm just disappointed.

[Kaptain Von]

Its been a common complaint, one I share. Tiny window art and little fluff test.
Oh well, I bought my deck.

They're play aids. What does flavour text add to their function?

I'll grant that bigger art would help by making it easier to distinguish the cards at a glance.

That said, the layout is the way it is for the designers' benefit, so they can use one template for all the cards, regardless of whether it has a damage track or damage grid, regardless of how many weapons it has. Given that PP and templates aren't always a harmonious union (anyone else remember how Alexia's preview rules laid her out as a warcaster, or how the Demo Corps were presented as a 6-10 man unit?), that starts to seem like a good idea. It's one less thing that can go wrong at the company's end.

For the record, I liked n0signal's cards more (they had elegance, they had style, and they were a lovely shade of green) but I've had the rationale for the new official cards explained and it makes sense, so I'm not going to grouse about that.

On the other hand, if the actual card quality is intermittent/rubbish, that's a whole different matter.

[Lexington]

So has anyone else noticed this or is it just the batch shipped Portsmouth?
Nope, same here - my Cygnar Heavy cards were all of a different, much lower-quality stock than my Faction Deck set, with much lighter printing.

As someone else noted, they're also a tad wider to the left than the Faction Deck cards. Not a big problem, normally, but they don't fit in my card sleeves, which is a tad annoying. Guess I'll have to cut 'em down to size.

[DemonCalibre]

I bought a Decimator/Corruptor on release day.

I don't know about them being washed out(I didn't look that hard)

I did notice right away, that the cards from the Plastic boxes weren't cut evenly, Not like a miscut, but just not evenly, I believe my Corruptor card was larger then the Slayer card that came in the same box.

Over all I am infinitely pleased with the faction deck, The Cryx one had the right amount of goodies for everything pretty much(Except I was 3 cards short of having 1 for all six of my night wretches so if you have some spares hit me with a PM). My Khador deck on the other hand left me scratching my head a little bit.

Why in heaven's name would I need 5 Juggernaut Cards, and 5 Destroyer Cards, I am a loyal son of the Motherland, but I have only ever topped out at 3 of either of those guys.

[Jobble]

I picked up my Corruptor and the cards inside were terrible. Completely washed out. My buddies thought I had printed them out on some old printer that was running out of ink. I don't have the faction deck yet, hopefully it is better.

[Typhael]

Well, playing in the recent Resurgence tourney convinced me that the art on the cards is way too small. I spent way too much time fumbling through cards to find the appropriate jack, etc.

[2LiveIs2Die]

I had no problem at the resurgence event noticing cards for what they were. :X

[Jyggdrasil]

When I play I have my cards in individual sleeves. I position them in my deployment zone roughly behind the relevant models. I shift them around during play as needed to maintain this relative positioning.

It makes it very easy to find the right card(s) quickly. In the case of multiples in the same area (eg 4 Stalkers up a flank) I write a big 'A' 'B' 'C' and 'D' over the picture on the card (the base of my models has the same) again, making it very easy to find the right card quickly.

[YabaBaga]

In the case of multiples in the same area (eg 4 Stalkers up a flank) I write a big 'A' 'B' 'C' and 'D' over the picture on the card (the base of my models has the same) again, making it very easy to find the right card quickly.
That is a good point. I imagine most people put their cards in sleeves so there should be no issue with writing symbols and markings on them. Also, there are other ways of identifying the models other than the picture: if there's a large damage track on the bottom, that's probably your warcaster; if there are several rows in the bottom left, that's a heavy infantry unit. Also, look at the different weapon groupings and grids for warjacks. Honestly, it's not hard.

[Blaque]

I can, but then I've had lasic eye surgery. :)
This is a case where I"m annoyed at the cards myself. I have a slight-detached retina. So really nothing short of new eyeballs will fix that. And unlike some of the MkI cards, I at least could read things without the use of a doom magnifier. There was all this talk about minimum font size, but that doesn't mean it should be the only font size and I still feel there 's a lot fo wasted space on teh card when the stat numbers could of been a tad better.

Most gamers i know wear glasses or have some eyesight issue. You'd think a bump in font face would be soemthing to cross their mind.


But yes, the new cards are ok, but I wouldn't rate them higher than that. They'll do the job but certainly don't have much "wow" factor. (Bananchuck cards for MKIII for the win!)
The "wow" factor is the problem. There's too much going on when they needed to keep it simple so the art could be seen and numbers read. Its busy for busy's sake and I would rate them much lower then the previous cards.

Here's hoping the Hordes ones learn some lessons, but I frankly am a bit skeptical of such things from the guys with PPS in front of their name sometimes.

ANd stuff.

[Typhael]

My issue was more along the lines of flipping through my multiple single-wound units, all with dark artwork, to try and show my opponent the specifics of (say) Bane Thralls, Bile Thralls, Mechanithralls...

Jygg's suggestion (of spacing the cards) is a good one, and one I often used, but I've recently tended to run my troops in waves, so their relative location on the table was the same. At 75 points, cards and identification became a killer. :(

[galonso]

I think they're great.