My Mage Hunter Assassin is capital-T "Terrible"

[Karyle]

So, like so many others here, when the Mage Hunter Assassin was first available I scooped up two without hesitation. Her rules on paper are just so good that I couldn't resist cheesing out and going ahead with double assassins.

Since that time, I've only managed to find the time to get one of the ladies painted up, (Important note: I won't play a model unless it's painted) so she's been running solo with my Retribution games.

At first, everyone across the table from me shared the same reaction: "She WHAT!? And then she can... Broken." It was great, they were scared to death of her crazy threat range.

And then, I got her into battle.

For three straight games, she has become infamously the worst model in the gaming group. She almost always misses, even if only needing a 4 or 5 to hit, and if she DOES score a hit, she doesn't do any damage. She literally has not killed even a single trooper model.

Case-in-point: Last night, I played a Khador opponent. The MHA proceeded to run up the side of the field into some woods. She was hanging out, waiting for a moment to strike (since Narn was killed on the second turn by a crazy lucky Wardog attack) and then it came: A Devastator, which I had cast Backlash on with Kaelyssa, opened up his tin can and stood awaiting Retribution. She charged valiantly, hit his amazing defense of 10 (whew!) and limped out a roll of three 1's and a single 3. The group erupted in laughter rather than surprise, because all she does is fail.

So, anyone else have an oft-feared model that never performs? :)

[Pinegulf]

Buy new dice and keep trying. ;) P for 3x1 and 3 or lower is one in 432....

MHA is one use homing missile. Relative low mat is the arguably biggest achiles heel of MHA. Once she hits it does median of P+S23 pts damage with doubling rule I'd still hold her pretty scary model.

[Devilsquid]

I think that the negative vibes from all the players crying "CHEESE" have warped reality to make the Mage Hunter Assassin under perform.

[MetalStorm]

I love the MHA not just for the super damage, but also because like all great solo's she makes all my opponents dedicate too much to kill her. I've had whole units of Gunmages chase after her simply because RNG 10 and the only things that ignore stealth.

I pay the 2 points simply for the fear that my luck ascends to godly levels and I wreck a caster or most of a jack in a round. So my advice is to try and find something the opponent wants to keep alive and circle around that 14" Threat like a shark, he'll either leave em open or end up spending half dozen or so points trying to swat the cheap MHA.

Failing this i'll give you the advice I give all my D&D group, pre-roll the 1's out.

For my own fail-tacular model in my days as a loyal son of Khador I had the Widowmakers of fail, for RAT 7/8 Models boy they sucked at hitting Jacks. I once had two miss a Rhulic Heavy and they might have been wearing neon road worker vests for the accuracy of Pie Plate Deviations, fun times those were, fun times. All my luck seemed to ride with my Mortars, didn't matter who you were, those pair tended to get my 'Wow... exactly what i needed to roll' results.

[FranzGrenstein]

I think that the negative vibes from all the players crying "CHEESE" have warped reality to make the Mage Hunter Assassin under perform.

Quoted For Truth ;D

[Steampunk Jim]

Give it more games my friend. Mine have one shotted raeks, woldwyrds, Argii, stuff like that multiple times, and I've one shotted many a caster. Don't give up! Just knock it down, and send in the nuke.

[whats82]

Relative low mat


What ? 7 is elite stat, barring super character model or other boosts.

[Marth]

I think that the negative vibes from all the players crying "CHEESE" have warped reality to make the Mega Hunter Assassin under perform.

That was what I read first. I think it's closer to reality.

[Hemeroc]

I have only tried mine out one time but i got to admit that she is my favorite solo so far:P She hits hard(bad luck if she doesn´t honestly) and what she hits often breaks. Really if they are not feared of her any more, you can use that against them. Wait until thy do something wrong and then kill their caster:D They will never ever forget!
greetz

[Galitlan]

I played her in a tourny this last weekend and in the last game setup to make the kill run on Scorsha..... she rolls double ones and falls right on her face... I told my opponate to watch me roll again and get it... which I do like 4 times in a row after the double ones...

[Blaque]

As one of the people who've lost said Woldwyrds and Argi to werecat...

Yeah, you need new dice. Also, here's thew orld's tiniest violin for ya.

And stuff. Poor Woldwyrd. ;_;

[magi]

Yeah, I've wasted Revengers, Axers, and many a cav model or solo with these girls. They're mean. Sorry for your bad luck.

[Valech]

You must be kidding! Mage Hunter Assassin underperforming? Must have forgot to make offerings to your dice gods.

Seriously though, streak of bad rolls do happen. Hopefully not often enough to break your spirit.

[Mod_Redphantasm]

New dice? It helped me.

[Lord Hedrahil]

Like all said...

New dices are the solution, the MHA are a awesome solo, they are both a perfect killer and an inredible enemy magnet.. :)

[waspinator21]

i took out a carnivean that had full health on it with a mha. they are awesomme when they hit. granted the damage roll was 4 sixes and one could consider that obsenely lucky, but still.

[Soylent]

From what you said it just seems dumb luck. Needing 3-5s to hit is very good in your favor and it just seems that the dice failed at those times.

[possiblyarowbot]

Could be your rolling technique as well.

[chrsjxn]

If you use Rahn, you can flip her targets around with Telekinesis so she gets the back strike bonus.

Effective MAT 9 is great.

[Marth]

Could be your rolling technique as well.

Might also be true. Dice like sexy (or: six-y) handshakes. ;)

[RetributionBomb]

Yeah the MHA works wonders with Rahn with his spells and access to reliable knockdowns.

Honestly I just use the MHA as a first strike missile. I try to fire her off as soon as possible simply because of the possibility of rolling bad on the hit or damage. I try to mitigate that factor by having her be one of my Alpha Strikers instead of sitting back and waiting for a 'Key moment' that if you **** up could cost you the game.

[Rynth]

You painted the wrong one. One was the good MHA, the other the bad MHA. You chose poorly when grabbing one to paint.

[Erebos]

ive killed killed several casters, several light jacks, several solos, and occasionally infantry when i need them dead. i've even disabled heavy jacks in one swing. sounds like everyone is just having bad / good luck. you are rolling random number generators after all.

[Indy]

My Manticore keeps stealing all of my MHA's kills. Every time I finally get her into position to strike (usually just after Force Hammering something into the enemy caster), my Manticore either shoots or squishes the caster to death.

Either that, or she flails around and misses DEF12/13 lights and then gets smushed by a boosted attack roll. :/

[KainMalice]

It's called Death Sentence. Use it and abuse it. Plus, I have found that the Assassins aren't made for making the first go at something, unless it's kind of a sure thing. Such as killins Solo's. Maybe finishing off something that has already been damaged badly. Where they shine is that Warcaster/Warlock assassination. And just because they have AD, doesn't mean you have to use it. I tend to keep mine somewhere about mid-field, alongside my other units.

[hausdorff space]

...she's a 2 point model... what did you expect :p
(I don't buy into all that MHA love/hate)


As for under performing models, I always found pVlad lackluster in melee.

Though my Manticore failed me last weekend, three fully powered (p+s 20) attacks on a knocked down eButcher did a total of 7 damage, IIRC.

...most often I just get to watch models underperform. MkI Rhadiem failing to hit Karchev in the back arc, etc.

[Pickles]

she's a 2 point model... what did you expect :p
(I don't buy into all that MHA love/hate)


She is extra random - doubling the damage over armour does that - so it's likely she will overperform/underperform more than other models. Ignoring any buffs she has the possiblillty to one shot anything except some of the heavier jacks but can do nothing too.

Super random = super hard to balance.

[ar2]

I've come to expect mine to miss more often than not, even with a very decent MAT 7. In my playgroup I roll notoriously high on damage so whenever they can land a blow things are sliced into oblivion. In my opinion they work best against light 'jacks or warbeasts.

[chrisBatson]

I would blame PP. Go to the general forum and add to the doom there.

[Tips]

My MHA ran upto eVlad the other night, needed 10 to hit, rolled 11. Then proceeded to do something like 22 damage to him. Mine has been awesome.

[masleth]

I've had the same rotten luck with my MHAs. PG-Werecat schooled me on the proper use of them in another thread, and I haven't had a chance to play my Ret since. Its all been casual games where someone else has played my Ret (thankfully inheriting my terrible MHA luck) or they want to play specifically against one of my other forces. Someday MHA will earn her keep! And I have 3 of them, just in case I want to play Garreth tier.

[gdaybloke]

First four games with her, missed every attack.
Fifth game with her, hit Thorn, rolled crap for damage. Did 4 damage, iirc
Sixth game with her, one-shot kill on a full health Xerxis.

She only hits def15 41% of the time... but your opponent can't afford to take that chance, and will play around her threat.

[Emeraldw]

In the theme of the thread,

My MHA assassin first game couldn't hit anything.
Second game couldn't hit.
Todays game, One Shot (Alexandria? Khador castor, not Skorcha) doing 22 points of damage.

7 move, 4 reach charging weapon master with MAT 7 and doubles damage done ignoring bonuses to def and armor from spells? VICIOUS when it works.

[Bobby Hostile]

Buy Game Science (http://www.gamescience.com/) dice.

No. seriously. You'll be surprised at the difference. In my gaming group, that's all we use and we love'm.

[masleth]

I've gotta set of gamescience and they are quite nice. Gonna need a few more before I'm set for PP games.

[karn987]

The MHA are really over rated, its been established in many threads in the past. They are not nearly as good in play as they are on paper. For a 1 attack, alpha strike model, they don't do it very well unless you get really lucky. I don't know about you, but I dont like relying on high dice rolls to make a unit work. Ive dealt with MHA against my cryx and to be honest, I'm not afraid of them at all. A stiff breeze and they are dead and they need 6 or 7's to hit about half of our stuff. Plus we have so many AE's that are readily at our disposle, its just a joke.

MHA are really a joke in the end. It takes a lot to keep them alive to combat and even then, they require above average rolls to do any real damage. For 2 pnts, I think they aren't bad, certainly have potential. But I would take the much much much more reliable Ghost Snipers over them every time, or even a Griffon for the price of 2 of them.

[Yertle4]

...most often I just get to watch models underperform. MkI Rhadiem failing to hit Karchev in the back arc, etc.
Under Xerxis' feat turn.

The MHA is all about potential - if you fluff the rolls she will do absolutely nothing. If you get awesome rolls, 2 of them can easily dismantle the Avatar.

But if you get average rolls, she can still do way more damage from way further out than a 2 pts solo ever should. Hence the hate.

[DrunkenTiefling]

The MHA has done superbly for me, if you can get her in the rear-arc of a target to set up a charge (which isn't difficult with her movement and threat-range) it can be devastating. My MHAs have gotten a sizable number of caster-kills through doing just that. Also if you don't want to miss, pit them up against heavy armor low defense models and you can do a lot more damage than you'd expect.

Take advantage of the MHA's strengths, be patient, and don't necessarily fire her off at the first opportunity. Use her as part of a larger overarching strategy where you have failsafes, a bit of redundancy doesn't hurt. Nothing sucks more than having a game decided by a single MAT 7 attack with nothing else to back it up if that falls through.

Also, look at ways to make it easier for her to hit. The back arc, like I mentioned earlier being one of them. Using Rahn's abilities to put a target on its back. Garryth's Gallows or Mirage can help with positioning, as can the Whip Snap from a Magister. Lock down a target with the Gorgon so it can't reposition and it spends its activation dealing with that problem, so you can have a charge in its back arc set up for the subsequent turn. These are all things off the top of my head, I don't use any of the mentioned models in my Kaelyssa list and the 2x MHA have not disappointed.

[MeroTZ]

So far, I'm running about even with Assassins. I've missed a lot of attack rolls against defense 12 or 13, but when they hit, they generally do a notable amount of damage; sometimes they do a lot of damage.

All in all, they've not been nearly reliable enough to win a game all on their own, but they've been great at strategically removing threats or priming hard targets for a deadly followup from elsewhere.

[Lazoth]

I normally run two of the ladies and I've had some games where all I ended up doing is feeding them to my opponent but other games its just been, oh you had jack/warbeast there. Probably the best game I had was getting a charge on Griessel who had no fury, hitting and then doing nearly 30 points after armour so bye bye trollkin. Trolls do well to fear the ladies when they work. BTW I have 5 of them for my Garryth tiered list.

One thing to keep in mind is if you finish a charge at a little under 3" away and to the side of a model after the attack its a prime target for a boosted shot or CRA to finish the job as she no longer engages them.

[jaults]

Buy Game Science (http://www.gamescience.com/) dice.

No. seriously. You'll be surprised at the difference. In my gaming group, that's all we use and we love'm.It is very funny that you say that. Someone got me a set of GS dice for Christmas (after watching these: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bR2fxoNHIuU and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxmkWrDbn34). I used them in a gaming session.... and I have never rolled worse in my life. It was astounding! Nothing over a five on d20, nothing over a two on d6, etc.

I don't think I'll be pulling out the Game Science dice again for a very long time...

Jason