maxwell fin

[shahryar]

does he work well on his own or does he really need trenchers?

[raincaller]

since he has to stand in his smoke his survivability went way down, I am personally not a fan. since he buffs trenchers its best to take him with them.

[phreaker187]

He's really a quasi trencher UA. A solo that buffs trenchers.

[thesavage]

Yes.








Look, if you want to field him on his own, you can do that. He can kill stuff. Maybe. But you can find three point solos that are better suited to the task. Such as Eyriss. If you want him to be worth his three points, get some trenchers. No, get a lot of them.

He's a nifty little partial army list.

Trenchers (max unit)
Trencher UA
Any other trencher upgrades you want
Finn
Rangers
Journeyman Warcaster

Turn 1, the journeyman drops arcane shield on the trencher unit. They do a cautious advance moving up the field. Since they are considered to be in cover, their defense is a 17, which makes them very hard to hit. The 16 armor makes them tough to kill. Speaking of tough, it would also be fun to have Rhupert Carvolo to give them tough. Your opponent will be so frustrated.

Meanwhile, as long as Finn is slightly up in front, your trenchers can see him and gain the +2 to their attack rolls. The if the rangers are in . . . range, they can mark a target giving the trenchers an additional +2 to attack rolls (I think this is legal, since it is not the same ability for both). Your trenchers will hit just about everything even without the combined ranged attack, and your trenchers won't die.

This is not theory machine. I played with a list similar to this in a resurgence tournament yesterday. I didn't have Finn, but my trenchers had a lot of staying power, which is especially great when you are trying to capture objectives. I think the word is tarpit?

[Arkady]

Just as an addendum, when you are not charging, it's not necessary to keep Finn "slightly up in front" of the trenchers. You can very easily keep him somewhat behind them, and position their front arcs so they can just see Finn, and still have a good view of the target.

[Mutton]

Right now, I'd probably run him with the Commandos to give them a nasty threat range

[whats82]

Which is still an expensive threat range, but at least it sounds viable.

[TsavongLah]

Turn 1, the journeyman drops arcane shield on the trencher unit. They do a cautious advance moving up the field. Since they are considered to be in cover, their defense is a 17, which makes them very hard to hit. The 16 armor makes them tough to kill.

Why would you waste AS on Trenchers? If a weapon gets past DEF17, it's going to paste a single-wound ARM16 model, period. The only thing that boosting their ARM would help against is blast damage... which is already covered by Dig In.

[thesavage]

Why would you waste AS on Trenchers? If a weapon gets past DEF17, it's going to paste a single-wound ARM16 model, period. The only thing that boosting their ARM would help against is blast damage... which is already covered by Dig In.

Not necessarily true. My first opponent had gun mages. When he actually did hit me, he just couldn't get that average 7 roll on two dice. With weapons that have power 10 or 11 you have a good chance, especially since your opponent will have to roll well twice (once for attack, once for damage). This is also why it's nice to have a bunch of trenchers.

I still ended up losing because he had more points though.

But if you are facing something with a lot of power and strength like warjacks or something, yeah it might be better to use arcane shield on something else.

[MadJack]

Not necessarily true. My first opponent had gun mages. When he actually did hit me, he just couldn't get that average 7 roll on two dice. With weapons that have power 10 or 11 you have a good chance, especially since your opponent will have to roll well twice (once for attack, once for damage). This is also why it's nice to have a bunch of trenchers.
If you've got access to it, I think Blur works better on the Trenchers than AS. At DEF 20 they won't have to worry about whether those Gun Mages will manage to get average damage rolls, because they won't hit them in the first place. The usual answer to high DEF low ARM models (AOE spam) won't work either due to Dig In, meaning that your opponent will have to engage your trenchers to get rid of them (and that will take time if you keep backing up using Cautious Advance).

[thesavage]

You're right. That is a good idea. But since I was playing Siege, I didn't have blur. So I improvised, and in this case it worked. If I'm using Stryker or Caine however, I will be sure to do this.

[TimBuckToo]

POW 7 or higher blast damage will still kill them, even with Dig In. AS would be very helpful against a Madhammer or Kay-dor list

[Professor Lust]

POW 7 or higher blast damage will still kill them, even with Dig In. AS would be very helpful against a Madhammer or Kay-dor list

Actually, dig in prevents blast damage. Only thing it doesn't prevent from blasts is continuous effects such as fire.

Think the difference of being safe from 105mm Howitzer shots but dying to napalm.

[FearLord]

POW 7 or higher blast damage will still kill them, even with Dig In. AS would be very helpful against a Madhammer or Kay-dor list

Dig in makes you immune to blast damage...

Sprays are the main think to watch out for since they ignore cover...

[Bobby Hostile]

Which at DEF 20 with Dig In and Blur, you can afford to relax a little when they come at you with Sprays. :)

[FearLord]

Which at DEF 20 with Dig In and Blur, you can afford to relax a little when they come at you with Sprays. :)

DEF 16 - Dig gives you cover, which sprays ignore...

[TimBuckToo]

Dig in makes you immune to blast damage...

Sprays are the main think to watch out for since they ignore cover...

Oh good lord, it would help if I read it first before talking out my arse

[MoonFever]

I'm liking the idea of using him with a minimum unit of commandoes with 3 WA. he gives them a further threat range, and can buff the spray attacks to a reasonable level....

[Bobby Hostile]

I keep forgetting that sprays ignore cover now... it's hard habit to quit thinking about MK I.