Overall opinion on the field test...

[MagnustheJust]

Greetings all...

I know I've been super quiet around here the past few months, but all the "pregame speculations" were driving me batty!!

Anywho, here's my thoughts on the subject :

I like almost everything they have done personally. Seeing shard lost from the catapults hurt a bit, but the increased ranged and POW helped.
They took away some of the beat-down factor from Xerxes, but I am looking forward to playing him this Sunday.

Overall, I like what the changes to the beasts were, and I am anxious to start to put the hurting on stuff!

I am not surprized by what they changed on the units, but some of the solos made me kind of scratch my head a bit... Some of those changes were more of a sidestep than a positive or negative change.

I will post a battle report Sunday evening to let you all know how things faired...

[Nurgle_84]

I can agree with most of your points, except:


Greetings all...
They took away some of the beat-down factor from Xerxes, but I am looking forward to playing him this Sunday.


They took away his beat down? Please? They put a wagonload of butcher goodness into him. He is more beatdown then ever. I love him :D

[strangedane]

I can live with the change in generel that MK II brought, but I REALLY don't like our many spd 4 warbeast (only eMakeda can give them enough speed), and I hate that I can't seem to find a good reason to bring our Alpha, haven't even bought him yet:S

[TheOrange]

pMakeda has savagry which can help one warbeast, and while a bit situational eMorgouls Death Warrant helps warbeasts in his group too.

[Junn Khan]

I was happier until I looked at how everyone else did.

[Dolomyte]

I was happier until I looked at how everyone else did.

Like who? Don't get me wrong, I'm stoked about an all argus swarm as much as the next guy, but Im hard pressed at this moment to say any faction came out significantly ahead of another (Trolls are rabidly angry, but I think thats just a character trait of being a troll player)

[MagnustheJust]

I can agree with most of your points, except:



They took away his beat down? Please? They put a wagonload of butcher goodness into him. He is more beatdown then ever. I love him :D

What I meant by this, was the loss of the spell 'Merciless Assault'. I carved up many an opponents' forces with that spell on my Swordsmen!

But as I stated above, I will leave a detaileed battle report from Sunday's games. If I can get a game in sooner, I will do so, but Sunday i the day my local group is getting together...

[Junn Khan]

Like who? Don't get me wrong, I'm stoked about an all argus swarm as much as the next guy, but Im hard pressed at this moment to say any faction came out significantly ahead of another (Trolls are rabidly angry, but I think thats just a character trait of being a troll player)


Personally I thought trolls did better than they're saying on the boards, but I was also referring to some casters and as it seems in many cases a "Grass is greener" seeing strengths but not that familiar with weaknesses.

Specific Examples: Madrak is pretty damn good, as good as an of our casters, Doomshapers feat got a buff for no reason, Auto riming for the Wintertroll, The Dire trolls are pretty much all around better than Titans on every level and at the same cost (Better MAT, RAT, and utility), Kriels are amazing, and their mage unit got hit points, Fellcaller is great at buffing and killing, and I like the Thumper crew.

Circle: Better Pack hunter, Lighting tendrils, free and better forest walk, a great buff to Morvanha's feat, double arcane killer on the wyrd, the new geomancy, in house buffs on the Tharn, and Lord of the Feast.

Haven't looked to much to legion but I'll probably have envy there as well.

[Zenassassin]

Overall? Love it. I was not happy at all w/ the Warmachine test and basically hated Cryx so bad I didn't look at the faction till they changed them a lot and released the final card for them.

I have 0 of this dread and dismay with Hordes mkII so far. Sure there are a few dropped ***** (round objects that bounce, used in sports) here and there, but that's to be expected. If they DIDN'T have a few highly questionable units, it would just tell me that they didn't really change much or really take stock of things.

All in all, the game is basically where I want it to be.

[strangedane]

I think that this field test is a way for PP to throughbly test those ideas that they are doubtfull about-ie those they think might no work but think "hey, let's toss it out to the nerds, perhaps it'll actually work, and if it don't then we change it, make a better game and the customers get the feeling that they are a part of it, a win win!".

Therefor I have a small hope that some of the things I personally think should obviosly change such as either 1 more spd and/or MAT for the titans or a point reduction, a POW increase or weapon master to the AG etc, WILL change in the final editon at the 2/1/10.

[strangedane]

Why does people think Xercis is so great??

[Keegantir]

Why does people think Xercis is so great??
Xerxis is great because:

Reach: Enough said.

Feat: It not affects all damage rolls for all friendlies instead of just warriors on charges. Stuff is going to die on his feat turn.

Fury: On Praets this spell makes opponents cry.

That being said, things that I don't like about him:

Chain Attack: Smite: really PP, really? Just what he needed, to be beating on something and then to slam it out of range so that he cant finish it off. PP seems to think that Skorne is the slam factions, when any slam without follow through is near useless.

Eliminator: 3 fury offensive spell on a 5 fury caster is a waste of card space. It is not going to get used more than once in a blue moon.

Merciless Assault gone: This hurts but there was so much potential for future abuse in this spell that they had to get rid of it now or be forced into a limited range for creating future models.

[Cronix]

Xerxis is great because:
That being said, things that I don't like about him:

Chain Attack: Smite: really PP, really? Just what he needed, to be beating on something and then to slam it out of range so that he cant finish it off. PP seems to think that Skorne is the slam factions, when any slam without follow through is near useless.

Eliminator: 3 fury offensive spell on a 5 fury caster is a waste of card space. It is not going to get used more than once in a blue moon.

Merciless Assault gone: This hurts but there was so much potential for future abuse in this spell that they had to get rid of it now or be forced into a limited range for creating future models.

If they give him Chain Attack - Combo Strike instead it will be fun.

I still don't know what kind of offensive spell works for him.... he is low fury warlock, with an expensive spell.

Merciless Assault hurts for sure, it was his way for crowd control, maybe give him Killing Spree, it fits his fighting style.

[Zenassassin]

You vastly underestimate Slamming. Which is fine, it's great to win so often because people underestimated slams (and throws).

Seriously though, a warlock with slam is outrageous. Yeah, on a very basic, elementary level, no you can't keep beating on that thing. Who cares. First of all, it's optional. You can just NOT slam, and keep wailing on it. So if you think you can kill it, great, you have that option, and without needing to follow-up (or the associated risks of doing so). Or, if you either A) want to keep Xerx safe from retaliation by slamming something away and knocking it down or B) have stuff nearby to seal the deal on the knocked-down, dogmeat model...then you choose to slam it.

There is no more easymode superKrea that lets you just put a debuff wherever you want anymore (thank the Ancestors). Now you have to earn it...and this chain attack is a primo way of doing so. You slam that punk, then your pals the Cataphracts with Martial Dicipline move up and butcher it, autohitting. Or you slam that stupid warjack into that water *ppppppssssshhhhhhhhhhh*. Or, as is very commonly the case, you just want a lot of guys dead, so you slam that big thing through all those poor little squishies (bye bye repair crew).

To say nothing of all those high DEF models which can be totally trumped by slamming something into them. Shake-off makes it less than it might have been, but there is a LOT in Hordes worth slamming that can't Shake-off.

And here is one of those facts that people never think about on paper but which is a dealbreaker in actual play- you can get close and not use the Reach at all (I mean he didn't even have it before so it's not like he has to now). Slam them. 1/3 of the time, they are now knocked down, yet still in range for more Pillar of Halaak in the teeth. More than 1/3, if they hit something big behind them. Like a beast, or a wall. And let's not forget Super Slam...hit...hit...combo...after boosting (and maybe feating before) well a follow-up move is pretty redundant.

[strangedane]

I just want him to have thresher-yes it would be insane BUT IT'S XERCIS!! THE MEANEST FACE BEATER OF THEM ALL!

[Khador247]

I echo the opinion of chain attack smite. I want him to be able to stay in melee with his target especially if that target happens to be the enemy caster. I don't want to slam them away, have them shake off, then come back and kill me.

I was pumped about his feat at first but then I saw the dreaded "while in" language. His 10 inch control area limits the effectiveness of the feat quite a bit. The "while in" language has become pretty common for the more powerful feats and spells though (see Butcher's feat and Signs & Portents as examples). There are still some like EVlad's feat that use the "currently in" language but they've nerfed his feat pretty hard. At least Xerxis has Martial Discipline though. He can move through his troops, pop the feat and cast Fury on something, then hopefully his troops will get the charge.

[TheOrange]

Another options is to throw a sacrificial model behind that you plan to slam. Extra D6 damage and you can keep beating on them.

[DeathnGlory]

My overall opinion is quite gloomy, but the majority of my gloom is from the nerf to Hordes in general and not the hit that we took. We can be happy with the cheap light warbeasts and the fact that Molik remained great but solos-wise and warlocks-wise we took the heaviest beating and I feel that we are once more left without a tournament level warlock (both epics being shadows of their former selves).

The only solace I get is that in further weakening the entire game of Hordes against a game (WM) that it was already weaker against will mean that the field test will require a massive amount of changes and we should get back some of the Skorne stuff in those changes.

[kantoboy]

If it weren't for the all the penalties for our heavies, I'd think they're almost there. But the cost, rules, and nerfs for heavies were soooo bad it was just upsetting how the rules designers felt that beasts needed to be nerfed. AND they decided to keep Alten.

[Razhem]

Well, I'm pretty satisfied with the lights, although the shaman needs something and the krea's gun would be very appreciated if it debuffed more than beasts. Our heavies are all a tad on the expensive side (specially the bronzeback who is very expensive) except for Molik Karn who is still a monster.

Our solos are a mixed bag, the extoller needs to be tried out as a ranged battery, but I'm not really seeing it with range 8. The ancestral needs a power tap up and maybe a way to help immortals hit and he is good to go. Master Tormentor excels at his new job and void spirit is just plain different.

Unit wise we made out pretty damn well, my only real nagging feeling are venators being sooo expensive, unless skorne is expected to pay premium for ranged, they should either get another gimmick or be taken down to 5-8, not like they are any better than hoseguard riflemen to justify the 2 extra points.

Warlockwise... it hurt us a lot, mostly for Hexeris and Mordikaar who took a beating. Morghoul took a step up, but I'm still missing a battlegroup spell in their, the lord assassin needs to be have his spells rethought out, specially if it is planned for him to now be a one man assassin brigade. Both Makeda's are still good at what they do, Emakeda giving stupoid huge mobility and normal makeda giving some of it with accuracy. Xerxis is now a beast, definitely the warlock I'm most happy about after the changes. Zaal is still confused about what the hell he is doing, but he is still seems good and I still like him.

So, it's pretty much a mixed bag. Very different feeling from the protectorate session where it felt damn good from the start and we made out like bandits with the final rules.

[isaacch]

I agree with most of the points concerning warlocks.

Light beasts look fine to me so far. After testing, the savage, shaman, brute, drake felt alright to me. the krea, however, could've been better. Despite having flank, i feel she's purely a support beasts who's not supposed to run up front and mix it up. Her gun needs to be retooled, or changed entirely.

Did anyone notice that you can't gain souls from beasts anymore?