What have i missed. (Its a party in here and your invited)

[PG_BloodRath]

Hey every one Rath here. i was a every day poster in the legion forums a few months ago but i took a sebatical from Legion to show every one that by playing legion im actually being nice. its much worse if i play cryx lol. but it sparked a huge cryxian revival in my metta and so now that eyes are off my legion im back in the saddle again (PARTY!). my metta is back to being very little legion and its time to make my strike. so in the mean time while im plotting to overthrow caen i would love to discuss what i have missed in our faction? how is the battle engine? how is proteus? they were just stats on paper when i walked away from everblight. tell me about whats new. also who is new in our legion community. feel free to say hi.

second order of buisness I NEED A NEW SIG BANNER obi made this one and i love it but im hanging up cryx for a few months and i could really use something a little more LEGION. i am extreamly computer retarted and couldent make a sig banner if i tried so i would love someone who could volenteer their services and make me a legion banner. preferably with thags 2 or kalls on it.

thanks every one for the warm welcome back lets party! and talk some legion. im pretty sure i came to the right place for that

[Obeisance]

What? I made you that banner like a week ago.

Totally not making you a new one. =p

[PG_BloodRath]

i clould always steal the one you have now that thing is awesome. simply awesome. i love this one and it will be saved for all time and in the fall when i pick my cryx back up ill be using the one you made me again. but my Warmahoards armies are seasonal. and if i dont take breaks i burn out. but its great to see you obi. i always love your inpuit on my threads. catch me up on legion. you always present things in a diffrent light which i like.

[FeralJim]

Hey Rath.

I just joined the Legion and PPs games a months ago. Everyone here has been really welcoming and awesome. Though Neutralyze seems content to drop small nuggets of one-liner wisdom throughout the boards. (I wish he would go into more detail!!).

Consensus on the Throne seems to be that it's not Wraith Engine bad or Troll Wagon good, but it's decent. It does a good job of tarpitting and eating infantry.

People are still making their minds up about Proteus but I'm strongly of the opinion his worthless. Pow16s on an 11 point character Beast is pretty disgustingly bad. It doesn't get any more pillow-fisted for your points.

I'm sure I'll see you around the place brother.

[PG_BloodRath]

Hey Rath.

I just joined the Legion and PPs games a months ago. Everyone here has been really welcoming and awesome. Though Neutralyze seems content to drop small nuggets of one-liner wisdom throughout the boards. (I wish he would go into more detail!!).

Consensus on the Throne seems to be that it's not Wraith Engine bad or Troll Wagon good, but it's decent. It does a good job of tarpitting and eating infantry.

People are still making their minds up about Proteus but I'm strongly of the opinion his worthless. Pow16s on an 11 point character Beast is pretty disgustingly bad. It doesn't get any more pillow-fisted for your points.

I'm sure I'll see you around the place brother.

thats cool i apricate you saying hey. The reson i would guess Neutralyze drops mostly one liners is becuse if you are looking on his spacific opnion on a topic he has probobally already given it 50 times. i think he just needs his own stickies. i was over at cryx for a while and man their stickies are awesome. i just love it. im glad to be back over in legion for a bit. im actually doing a diffrent spin from the winter legion i did last year. im doing a Legion of Orboros theam this year with lots of mods to make the army more nature and "green dragon" oriented as possible. its already turning out promising. my modded Valy1 looks very druidic and i made Thagrosh2 much more draconic putting him on the body of a carnivean and giving him much bigger wings.

[Pudgeinabowl]

You missed the Farilor discussion (two sides were 'he looks constipated' and 'he looks badass midfight', there may or may not have also been discussion as towards his rules). Also Mr. Whargbllll (proteus) had 2 threads, not sure what the concensus from that was, probably that we got more tentacles than we'll ever need.

[Omnus]

I have felt like the Battle Engine performs well in all my games but never great. I mostly played it with eVayl. I feel like Icy Grip and Battle Wizard go great together. I realized very quickly to use the BE as a second wave to clean up after Hex Hunter are the first wave. I found slipstreaming to advance it further so it could strike earlier was a waste of time. I prefered hex hunters charge into the center and battle wizard away. If the situation allows, I would also advance the BE, toss a spine burst and then refuge back. Possibly stick occultation on it. Then next turn have it charge up and kill 4-8 models or so. Possibly get some charge damage on a heavy. At this point it becomes a huge target that can't be pushed out of the control areas. Which gave my angels more time to play dancing refuge games while maintaining a scenario presence. I am not convinced that the list is better with a Battle engine than without. You can use the BE in her tier lit but with heavies costing one less it feels even worse of a bargain than normal. Outside of the tier, I feel like raptors, gatorman or swordsmen would probably be better with Occulation.

It did provide a nice Oc-node target.

I haven't tried it in the more defensive lists like ethags or pthags yet. seems fine but eEyriss is used against me almost every game, so I rarely benefit from spiny growth.

[alchahest]

new (to you) casters:
Kallus: a boss. he's tough (but not too tough, don't get cocky), and makes infantry tough, and has some seriously solid methods of boosting either infantry /or/ beasts.
Epic Vayl: amazing trick caster with a spell bazooka. takes a little bit to get the hang of, but she's actually got a pretty easy learning curve, I've found.

New Beasts:
Naga Nightlurker: another toolbox light. decent range, decent melee, excellent animus, serpentine.(not released yet)
Proteus: some few of us have had a very good time with him, most people think pow 16s is pillows, overriding all of the other advantages he has, and he's not worth the points

UA:
Farilor: nice little addition that makes a unit of legionnaires a little tougher, and makes it harder to spell them to death. (Not Released Yet)

Solo:
Succubus: fantastic caster attachment that helps with fury expenditures (Not Released Yet)

Battle Engine:
The Throne of Everblight (aka, nightmare pillar, hentai chair, tentacle tower, etc etc etc): good to very good infantry clearing, can heal itself, and can offer a surprising amount of damage to even a heavy (though don't send it after them expecting miracles - it hits like a light, not like a heavy)

[PG_vengence88]

Proteus-Zoidberg, is interesting I'm trying to withhold totals judgement,but leaning towards poop, the throne is ok. I need to play it more.

[PG_BloodRath]

new (to you) casters:
Kallus: a boss. he's tough (but not too tough, don't get cocky), and makes infantry tough, and has some seriously solid methods of boosting either infantry /or/ beasts.
Epic Vayl: amazing trick caster with a spell bazooka. takes a little bit to get the hang of, but she's actually got a pretty easy learning curve, I've found.

New Beasts:
Naga Nightlurker: another toolbox light. decent range, decent melee, excellent animus, serpentine.(not released yet)
Proteus: some few of us have had a very good time with him, most people think pow 16s is pillows, overriding all of the other advantages he has, and he's not worth the points

UA:
Farilor: nice little addition that makes a unit of legionnaires a little tougher, and makes it harder to spell them to death. (Not Released Yet)

Solo:
Succubus: fantastic caster attachment that helps with fury expenditures (Not Released Yet)

Battle Engine:
The Throne of Everblight (aka, nightmare pillar, hentai chair, tentacle tower, etc etc etc): good to very good infantry clearing, can heal itself, and can offer a surprising amount of damage to even a heavy (though don't send it after them expecting miracles - it hits like a light, not like a heavy)

i got kallus at gencon played about 10 games with him he is good. i proxied failor and the succubus with him a few times both make him a more viable choice. i got evayl at the prerelease she works great and i love every thing about her. no complaints. however i dont see her bumping vayl 1 out of my line up. (maybe)

never played the throne but it seems really good with bethayne

i proxied the naga night lurker several times with lylyth2 using my belphagore mod. great addtion. was really happy with it. great anti cryx tool. great anti menoth tool

proteus i never tried but i will be playing absolina again soon and i really want to get some time in with proteus with her i really feel he was desighned spacifically for her to help replace the use of typhon in future steamrollers becuase of charter restrictions

[HOLDENISME]

Hey Rath I just joined legion got 19pts and 1 game under my belt I won it I really LOVE the deathstalker.

Welcome back looking forward to reading your posts and learning.

[Caldera02]

Proteus is amazing with any caster who boosts his damage. Which we have quite a few of.

[PG_BloodRath]

Proteus is amazing with any caster who boosts his damage. Which we have quite a few of.

who do you reccomend? is proteus a better choice than any other option that caster brings. are the tools he offers useful for that caster?

has any one done the math for proteus and legion casters? if so can you link it or repost. i will say after playing cryx i have deffinatly learned the value of modles that can drag.

im going to play proteus a bunch in the coming months and i will try to write about him my self once i have some table time with him.

[JosephKerr]

Proteus is nice with his master, Abby. I find him very useful when not running Scytheans.
Absylonia t4
Carnivean
Proteus
Ravagore
Ravagore
Nephillim Protector*
Stinger
Harrier
Shredder
Forsaken
Forsaken
Forsaken
*(Been debating a Raek and Shepherd over the Protector but so far they haven't play tested as well and make the army more aggression focused as opposed to being an attrition list.)
I've found it to be a pretty useful list with lots of strength at range while relying on Forced Evolution to own up in melee. It's proved to be pretty versatile and Proteus is really the keystone. With that bonus strength Proteus can trash even an ARM 21 30 box model on average dice. Snacking lets you pop your feat early and still be able to heal up. It's also nice to let your models RFP when necessary. A bit overcosted at 2 fury, and not an animus you'll use every game which does suck, but it still has uses. I wouldn't really feel comfortable running the Carny and 2 Ravagores w/o Proteus for board control and the occasional om nom nom! Also, the extended control area is very nice, though situational. Really, he seems a bit lacking for 11 points in that he isn't something that will be worth it over a Scythean and Forsaken in most lists, but I like him none the less.

[Caldera02]

pVayl makes him amazing, as our other beasts. Dragging a Jack or beast into incite range? Priceless. Not to mention a spell martyr + rampager into drag range lol.

Kallus has incite and dark guidance for him.

Abby has Forced Evo for him.

pLylyth has Parasite.

pthag and eThag both output his damage quite nicely.

Saeryn and eVayl debuff defense so makes hitting with drag easier but other than that, not much on actual damage output.

All and all, I think he plays in such a different way that most people don't like him but I do.

[PG_BloodRath]

i think trying him with Vayl1 and Abby seem like a great place to start

[Cannotcope]

People are still making their minds up about Proteus but I'm strongly of the opinion his worthless. Pow16s on an 11 point character Beast is pretty disgustingly bad. It doesn't get any more pillow-fisted for your points.

Actually it does:
Thunderhead -> P+S 16, no 3rd attack, maxes out at 3 focus, except with pNemo, and cost 12pts...

Yeah yeah, T-head has a decent gun.

[Neutralyze]

Pvayl can run proteus bit he still isn't anything comparable to a Scythean. proteus is passable with Pvayl but not amazing.

[PG_BloodRath]

what about Proteus with lylyth1 herding seems like it would be great with her small controll area and her feat seems like a awesome way to make that 5 fury beast a monster on feat turn against a parasited caster...anything

[FeralJim]

Pvayl can run proteus bit he still isn't anything comparable to a Scythean. proteus is passable with Pvayl but not amazing.

Hazah! Confirmation he isn't great =)

Certainly not anywhere near the same ballpark as Tiberion or Ghetorix.

[OminousAfro]

Oh man, I can't wait for this thread to evolve into YAPT. (Yet Another Proteus Thread)

I would have to say that the biggest change to our faction in 2012 thus far has been the continued enabling of attrition play. Not that it didn't exist previously, but the addition of Farilor, eVayl, and to a lesser extent, the Succubus, we gained a large quantity of staying power as a faction.

[VOLK]

Grammar. It's the difference between knowing your **** and knowing you're ****.

[Caldera02]

Grammar. It's the difference between knowing your **** and knowing you're ****.

Haha, I see what ya did thar!

@FeralJim - Just because Neut hates on proteus doesn't mean he's bad. It just means Neut is racist, that's all. He obviously looked at the Chutulu tentacles and went , "Ahhhhhh!!!!! gross!"

[Neutralyze]

I am almost done playing all my games with proteus. With pvayl he has a little more damage but he still lacks for 11 PTS. A Scythean in all 5 games would of done better without the pt sink

[Neutralyze]

Double post

[PG_BloodRath]

Oh man, I can't wait for this thread to evolve into YAPT. (Yet Another Proteus Thread)

I would have to say that the biggest change to our faction in 2012 thus far has been the continued enabling of attrition play. Not that it didn't exist previously, but the addition of Farilor, eVayl, and to a lesser extent, the Succubus, we gained a large quantity of staying power as a faction.

i think we have always had a section of legion that could break the glass cannon mold. i feel the same about cryx and legion. from mark I to mark II both armies have taken a huge leap from one deminisional glass cannons into well rounded factions who can play attrition. (htis however is a universal truth because every faction since the most recent expansion are well rounded and can play any playstyle)

Grammar. It's the difference between knowing your **** and knowing you're ****.

im terribly dyslexic and im lucky if i can spell let alone type a cohearent line

I am almost done playing all my games with proteus. With pvayl he has a little more damage but he still lacks for 11 PTS. A Scythean in all 5 games would of done better without the pt sink

i often found the carniviean to be overcosted and lacking at 11 pts. do you feel he is better or worse then the carni? that would give me a good scale to judge it by. (Disclaimer before the nerd rage begins flaming me for hating on the carni. i love the guy. i just wish he was slightly better or 1 pt less

[PG_BloodRath]

Now for my 800th post ever lets talk the Legionair UA CPT awesome sauce and the poor legionair carrying his flag.
i proxied these guys alot when domination first came out. he was pure win. he just won me games. he made the legionairs a really viable tarpit and weaponmaster CMA is wacky good.

Last two orders of buisness can i beg barrow plead bribe some one to make me a sig banner with Kallus. for real dirty deads done dirt cheap lets do this.

lastly lets talk some kallus. he is really the main reason i came back to legion after playing cryx for so long.

[Neutralyze]

Proteus is worse than the carny.

[Omnus]

Now for my 800th post ever lets talk the Legionair UA CPT awesome sauce and the poor legionair carrying his flag.
i proxied these guys alot when domination first came out. he was pure win. he just won me games. he made the legionairs a really viable tarpit and weaponmaster CMA is wacky good.

Last two orders of buisness can i beg barrow plead bribe some one to make me a sig banner with Kallus. for real dirty deads done dirt cheap lets do this.

lastly lets talk some kallus. he is really the main reason i came back to legion after playing cryx for so long.

I think Farilor is solid but not as amazing as some think. Often the unit for 9 points would be better replaced by a 10 man unit for 8. But I think eThags, pThags or Kallus can really push them over the top with 2 more effective armor.

Kallus is awesome. He has real potential to be an A caster when the succubus comes out. His options and survivability are really assisted by 1 more fury. I believe one of the key aspects of Kallus is to remember 2-3 heavies at 50 points.

[PG_BloodRath]

thats pretty solid advice. back when i was playing kallus every chance i got i used swordsmen +UA, gatormen, legionairs +UA and warmongers. i have played him with all medium base infantry and all small base infantry. i think he really benifits from a unit of each. i played him with typhon, scytheans, ravagors, and the carni. i think that ravagoes are a must to keep people from backing up and generally a mix of ravagor and scythean are the best combo with my thrid pick being the carni simply for its animus. how do you guys feel about a spawning vessel with him and maybe only one heavyat 35 pts?

i cant belive that proteus is all bad but i do see him being sub optimal. i think to include is point investment you have to have a list that excentuates his skills and shores up his weaknesses. you have to build a list for proteus to use him right it seems. i really love the convept of him with 1vayl and lylyth1 i think this beast seems to led it self to the non epic casters.

[JosephKerr]

I've found Proteus to be occasionally useful in pThags if you also run a Stinger. That's 13 points though....

[FeralJim]

Rath,

I think the thing that stinks most about the Proteus is just the fact that we got him at a time when the other three factions had all just received incredible Character Heavies (one of which is a Mat7/Rat5 Carnivean for 11 points!). Rok is probably only a B+ but Tiberion and Ghetorix are both mind bogglingly good... and Proteus is just horrible lol.

[alchahest]

holy cow, someone got a pow 18, two pow 16s, spd 6 pathfinder, eyeless sight and a 10" assault-capable pow 14, with Mat 7?

[PG_Vynde]

holy cow, someone got a pow 18, two pow 16s, spd 6 pathfinder, eyeless sight and a 10" assault-capable pow 14, with Mat 7?

and rat 5

[alchahest]

nice, which faction was that?

[FeralJim]

Haven't you seen Rok Alcahest? His the Winter-Troll Character Heavy from Domination.

He trades 1 SPD for +1 ARM, Pathfinder/Eyeless for Snacking/Regeneration. Spiny Growth for Primal and Crit Freeze for -4RNG on the Spray.

Then he gets MAT7, RAT5 and POW18 on all 7 attacks for free! wooooooo! He also gets Berserk!

He basically just proves what we already knew, that the Carnivean should have been MAT7/RAT5 all along. Ah well.

[Omnus]

I think the carnivean's arm attacks just should have been pow 17 and is probably good enough. Of course rat 5 would have been lovely.

[FeralJim]

The best part is that Rok isnt even that well regarded, Tiberion and Ghetorix are much better again! So not only did we score a completely useless Character in Proteus but one of our other cornerstone Heavies was given to Trolls with a bunch of free bonuses. :-/

We did get Kallas, eVayl, the Succubus and the Nightlurker though. Those are all awesome and good times.

[alchahest]

he has 7 pow 18 attacks? or is that 6 pow 18 and a pow15 or 16? without overtake and reach, does berserk grant it the ability to get as far downfield as a carnivean?
does snacking/regeneration let him charge through trees/clouds etc?
can he two handed throw?

when you say "Traded" you mean traded, right? not "got these gigantic bonuses and didn't lose a whole lot of very valuable things?

[Neutralyze]

even with Pvayl proteus is pretty horrible