The Winter Guard Death Star

[Col_Festus]

The Winter Guard Death Star (WGDS)

General Overview
I was browsing the Khador tacitca section and was amazing to find no one has done a write up on the Winter Guard. I decide it must be done!

So the first question you may have when getting into Khador is “What is the Winter Guard Death Star”?

It consists of the following:

10 man unit of Winter Guard Infantry

Winter Guard Officer and Standard Bearer

3x Winter Guard Infantry Rocketeers

Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich

This combination together leads to one of the most potent and versatile infantry units you can possible field in Khador. It in fact will be the start of almost all of your lists. It’s almost an auto include with any caster that has Iron Flesh. This is the final icing on the cake that will give them their well deserved infamous reputation. That being said no matter what caster you take they will have a use, and a massive influence on the game. So let’s take a closure look at how they work.

Stats/Abilities

Winter Guard Infantry
The Infantry themselves are extremely average straight across the board. Nothing immediately jumps out at you, and you in fact will probably scratch your head saying, “what’s the big deal”? They come with a RNG 8 PS 12 gun and CRA. This is our foundation to build upon.

Winter Guard Rocketeer
This little guy brings a stick mounted rocket launcher to the party. It’s a nice RNG 14 PS 12 3” AOE that is very handy for shooting on the way in. This will help give the Death Star some long range offensive punch as it moves across the board. Don’t forget he also has a blunderbuss. He can make CRA’s with the blunderbuss and fill all the roles a normal infantryman can. In fact when I purchase these guys I just think of them as filling out my Winter Guard to max size. They also have the nifty ability pick up, allowing them to pass off their rocket launcher as they fall dead in the dirt.

Winter Guard Officer and Standard Bearer
This is where things start to get interesting. The officer herself grants the order Bob & Weave. This is the first step in raising our DEF to astronomical levels. This states that when you make a full advance, you will gain +2 DEF. Take note that this is an order. There for you cannot run and bob & weave. This is a common mistake I see people that are using it for the first time. While the officer brings the defensive boosts, the standard brings the offensive boost. Enter Grapeshot. This ability allows Winter Guard infantry to fire an 8”, POW 10 spray instead of their normal blunderbuss shot. You now have a unit that can advance and fire 15, POW 10 8” sprays, a multitude of CRA’s or one big “Death Star” CRA. Sit back and think at all the situations this unit can now deal with.

Kovnik Josef Grigorovich
This man is the final piece of the puzzle. He buffs the heck out of the Winter Guard and really sends the unit over the top. He has 3 speeches that he can issue, and each will have a different effect on the unit. They can be issued in his control area which is pretty large. Thus he doesn’t need to be very close to the front lines at all. He also only needs to be in range of 1 member of the unit to buff them.

The Bear’s Strength: +3 to the Winter Guard’s attack melee damage rolls. You will find that you will almost never use this speech.

Courage of our Forefathers: Tough + Fearless. You can make the entire 15 man unit tough and fearless.

For the Motherland!: Boosted Attack Rolls.

Ok hold the phone. You can now take a unit that has 15 sprays in it, and boost the attack rolls. That means on average you will be hitting defense 15. Need to clear off an objective? Call in the Winter Guard plowing service. Something important to remember is that Jozef benefits from his own speeches. Also be sure to activate Joe first to get the benefit of boosted attack rolls if you need them.
Jozef also brings a hand cannon to the party. With boosted attack rolls he can hit Def 17 on average. Not too shabby. It’s very useful for shooting enemy officers. His final ability is what makes Joe really hated among the enemies of the Motherland. He has sacrificial pawn. Keep him close to your Winter Guard when you get dug in and he can pass off hits he takes to other winter guard keeping him around much longer.
Also Iron Flesh deserves a special mention here. When you cast Iron Flesh on the Death Star you get a monster of a unit. It’s capable of dishing out highly accurate attacks, while being well out of the ability for unboosted infantry to hit. You will need a MAT of 10 to hit a Winter Guard 50% of the time. How many infantry units are bringing MAT 10? Not many. Now tie in the fact that they are probably tough and fearless to boot. So 1/3rd of those attacks that do land are going to bounce off. This is how Khador play’s attrition for real. Forget the high arm façade.

Using the Death Star
It’s well known or learned very quickly by Khador players that our ‘jacks need serious help to get the alpha strike on anything. They are also easily bogged down by enemy tar pits. The Death Star solves both these problems. Being almost impossible to shift outside of some feats, and a few casters, the Death Star will be where you want it. With their high def and tough they can screen your jacks perfectly right up until the time they will be charging and crumping whatever needs an axe in the face. The whole time they are doing it they can be clearing off the enemies screen of infantry as well without even breaking a sweat.
The Death Star is a master of midrange board control. With the ability to advance then spray they can clear off almost anything that tries to get into the middle of the board early and pressure you back. They are extremely handy against “jam” lists that attempt to jam you out of a control area. Let the enemy try and jam you all they want, when they get 15 sprays in the face they will realize what a horrible mistake they have just made.The other common use is to simply run over everything on your way in and do a big POW 27 CRA on the enemy warlock/warcaster. Most often you will lose some guys going in, but you can easily still manage a 20+ POW CRA.

Synergies
So we already know Iron Flesh is amazing on them for the reason’s stated above. Let’s take a look at what else casters do for them. I’ll detail some of the better casters to take them with.

The Old Witch
The Old Witch loves her some Winter Guard. Their ability to clear off control points with their vast array of sprays, combined with the Old Witch’s feat can mean unparalleled board control. People serious about the Old Witch tend to start their list by taking the Death Star.

pIrusk
This man does a lot for the Winter Guard. Of course he brings Iron Flesh to the table but his feat is huge with them. He can make the entire unit tough on a 4+ and immune to KD. 15 models, needing MAT or RAT 10 to hit, followed by 4+ tough roll and immune to KD. That is simply crazy. Many people when they first come up against this simply won’t know what to do. They will charge head long at it and get obliterated. The flip side of this feat is that now because his feat is making them tough, you can use Joe to boost their attack rolls making for a nice round of shooting right before you crash into each other.

eSorscha
eSorscha is made to run the Death Star. Not only can she give them Iron Flesh, but she can remove the biggest drawback, the hindrance of their speed. She can * action desperate pace the Death Star to get its speed back to normal and then some. She also gives them the ability to reroll missed CRA’s. Seriously if you love Winter Guard, eSorscha is the girl to run them with. Their PS 14 CRA’s can reroll to miss and under her feat turn will do double damage, just gross. A common win condition for her is to simply move the Death Star into range of the enemy warlock/caster, feat and do one big CRA. We’ve all see Star Wars.

pButcher
This bad man also loves the Death Star and is one of my personal favorites when it comes to casters to run them under. The reason is when combined together they will annihilate most anything that is in the midfield. You can get 15 boosted to hit AND damage sprays under the Butchers feat. It’s quite the site to see, usually very little remains to retaliate. The other half of equation here is that because they are one of the best tar pits in the game they can act as a great set up for the multiple jacks usually running behind them. Just be sure to notice places enemy jacks could trample too and you can almost always get the charge off if played correctly.

Harkovich
I think Harkovich will end up taking the Death Star a lot more as people bring him to the table more. The ability to give the Death Star fortune combined with their sprays is extremely good and will clear out almost any infantry that I can think of in the game including the dreaded Satyxis Raiders. They also allow Harkvich to maneuver his jack’s into range behind a nice big blob of bodies. Just remember they won’t be as durable as they are with Iron Flesh casters

pVlad
Signs & Portents boosts ranged attacks. I think we can just leave it at that.

So there you have it. That’s my run down on one of Khador’s most amazing units. I know I haven’t quite covered everything that it can do, but that’s because the unit is amazing. It can almost do everything. Feel free to post up other fun uses of the Death Star!

[SilverSoB]

Great writeup! In the middle of painting up my own unit and you answered some questions I didn't know I even had yet.

I know Iron Flesh figures prominently into running them, but if you have a caster without that spell in their list, would you be better off going with something like IFP?

[PG_Draxos]

@SilverSob you are correct that IFP are a better choice in those situations. IFP are for when you need a mobile melee unit that doesn't get caster help.

@Col_Festus there are some write ups in WGI floating around somewhere

[PG_mongre36]

One of the benefits of the WGI is how many models you get. The old "Quantity is a Quality all of its own". The other is their threat range, 14" WGI vs IFP 11". That is not to say that having IFP+UA as your center is not a good idea, but the WGI just have amazing throughput.

[mostholycerebus]

Nice writeup. Id like to see some math on using CRAs, sprays, rockets, or blunderbus vs the DEF/ARM combos we are likely to see. With and without eSorcha's Elite Cadre ability, of course. I think that would really help n00bs like me.

[Digilante]

I can add some tips based on my experience:

1. Sacrificial Pawn on Joe is not worth it. There are too many ways your enemy can get around it so you're better off just keeping him in the back. He can give a speech to any unit with a model in his command range, so he can be 9" away from the back of the deathstar and still buff them without issue. Combine that with the fact that the standard bearer is usually hanging out in the back of the unit (to stay safe) and Joe can be safely away from the front lines.

2. Bear Strength doesn't see a lot of use while the deathstar is alive, but once their numbers are dwindling and Joe moves up to help it can be pretty useful. I had a game where Joe under Bear's Strength finished off an Ironcald to open a charge lane to the enemy caster. He can actually hit pretty hard when he needs to.

3. A common mistake to watch out for is on the resolution of take-up with the rocketeers. Read the card carefully: the rocketeer model stays where it is and the grunt within 1" is removed. This can be pretty useful if the rocketeer is holding a flag or contesting a zone.

4. There are other support pieces that work well with the deathstar that merit mention:
4a. Epic Eyriss. Did you enemy manage to land crippling grasp or icy grip or some other nasty spell on you Winter Guard? Have everyone's favorite elf shoot the officer in the back for one point and bye-bye upkeep. You'll want to drop iron flesh the turn you need to do this.
4b. Saxton Orrick can give them pathfinder. This isn't always necessary, but in some matchups/boards it is a godsend.
4c. Aiyana and Holt can help them both with harm (boosting their already scary damage output) and with touch. In a faction that is short on magical attacks, a 15-man unit with multiple magical ranged options can ruin some people's day.

[Erifnogarddloc]

As for synergistic casters:
Don't forget EIrusk!
Hhe can field 2 full WGDS's! ( He can take one toward one objective and Joe can take the other. )
Tactical Supremacy spell to get in to threat range faster.
Battle Lust spell + joes speech: bear STR + CMA = Kill anything !
Martial Discipline and Total Obedience are great!
(not to mention taking 2 cheep mortars and hot swapping FFE on them)
Just can't see how he is overlooked so far !

[Shyeel]

This may sound stupid but I have to ask: What if you only use 2 Rocketeers? Would that still qualify your Winterguard as the Death Star?

[Tyr852]

Yes it would still be a deathstar

[Seoh]

How about death star counters?

Whenever i have come up against the death star i find it difficult, the only tactic i've seen work is to blast the crap out of them with high range AOE like mortars, as you probably won't hit them but might take some out in deviations.

How about using Kayazy assasins or eliminators to take out the UA?

[Joasht]

Great writeup! IMO though I think you should also mention about positioning, e.g. placing your models far apart, placing your standard right at the back (along with Joe), etc.
It seems kinda logical, but there are many out there with the 40k mentality of sticking stuff together in bunches.

I think the counter to them is mostly AoE stuff, but there are some cornercase possibilities. For example, eEiryss with the standing still bonus is effectively RAT 11, which will hit a DEF 17 WG on a 6, stripping them of IF and bringing them down to a pretty manageable DEF 14. Or spells that get rid of upkeeps, or things like Rebuke/Fear of God (can't Bob and Weave) or DEF reducing abilities (e.g. Crippling Grasp). Or things that just don't care, like Chain Lightning.

Or when all else fails, slam your own stuff through them :P

[dkvoe]

You should revisit this statement ...

"While the officer brings the defensive boosts, the officer brings the offensive boost."

Also the blunderbuss is just power 12 not P+S 12

[digitalrob]

Great writeup! IMO though I think you should also mention about positioning, e.g. placing your models far apart, placing your standard right at the back (along with Joe), etc.
It seems kinda logical, but there are many out there with the 40k mentality of sticking stuff together in bunches.

I think the counter to them is mostly AoE stuff, but there are some cornercase possibilities. For example, eEiryss with the standing still bonus is effectively RAT 11, which will hit a DEF 17 WG on a 6, stripping them of IF and bringing them down to a pretty manageable DEF 14. Or spells that get rid of upkeeps, or things like Rebuke/Fear of God (can't Bob and Weave) or DEF reducing abilities (e.g. Crippling Grasp). Or things that just don't care, like Chain Lightning.

Or when all else fails, slam your own stuff through them :P

How far can you space them without breaking formation? Also - how far back can the standard bearer be from the unit and with Joe?

[Tyr852]

You can be 18" I want to say off the top of my head , 9 from the officer with the Standard Bearer and then another 9 from him with Joe.

As for dealing with the deathstar , I find AoE and AoE with fire (dam joo flame belchers) works well or things that auto hit like Rain of Death , Minute Men and I'm sure there is more I just don't see them as often.

[dkvoe]

You can be 18" I want to say off the top of my head , 9 from the officer with the Standard Bearer and then another 9 from him with Joe.

As for dealing with the deathstar , I find AoE and AoE with fire (dam joo flame belchers) works well or things that auto hit like Rain of Death , Minute Men and I'm sure there is more I just don't see them as often.

To make everything clearer, all members of the unit must be within 9 inches of the officer. Joe must be within 9 inches of any member of the unit.

[digitalrob]

Thanks Tyr and DK - that cleared things up for me

[PG_Caecus Scius]

I want to point out a strategy that I have often used. Models can spray targeting other models in their same unit to better cover more enemy models. Even with the boosted hit rolls, you probably won't kill your own guy, but a lot of times it can really help to choose your own model for the target of the attack that way you can get the enemies you want to hit, or get more enemies. Also you can move in such a way as to not give backstrike on your guys (so you don't actually hit). Hopscotch your second line ahead of your first...

p.s. you don't always want to do this... this is just another thing you CAN do, when the time is right, just remember that you can do it.

[Havock]

Good writeup, although with SR2012 we can kick off another sub-topic: if you take 2+ casters, which one should get the DS? (Considering Joe is what seals the deal really)

[Natetehaggresar]

Good writeup, although with SR2012 we can kick off another sub-topic: if you take 2+ casters, which one should get the DS? (Considering Joe is what seals the deal really)

Thats the thing, they work well with almost all our casters. The Vlads make each blunderbuss hit like a mack truck under signs and portents or Hand of Fate, and further increases their accuracy.

eSorcha has Iron Flesh which sets off the unit, and gives them an elite cadre, and can desperate pace them.

pIrusk has Iron Flesh, and his feat makes them even more resilient. Also with bears strength and battle lust they charge at ps 11 + 4d6.

pButcher has Iron Flesh, and his feat turns them into ranged weapon masters. Fury and bears strength makes them pow 14, and if you haven't used the feat yet they will totally wreck a def 10 heavy.

Old Witch has Iron Flesh, and lots of control that can help them out.

These would be my top choices, but they are so complete as a package even casters that offer less support can still make alot of use of them.

[Joasht]

I thought I'd bring this up for discussion:
Would you still bring the Deathstar when your caster doesn't have Iron Flesh?

Personally I see myself more inclined towards Kayazy (good natural survivability) and IFP (good stats all around) in the absence of IF.

[OrsusSmash]

I thought I'd bring this up for discussion:
Would you still bring the Deathstar when your caster doesn't have Iron Flesh?

Personally I see myself more inclined towards Kayazy (good natural survivability) and IFP (good stats all around) in the absence of IF.

Deathstar? No.

Smaller unit w/UA + Joe? Certainly.

Boosted sprays are still extremely potent anti-infantry tools, and there's no better module for it than the WGI.

[Col_Festus]

Deathstar? No.

Smaller unit w/UA + Joe? Certainly.

Boosted sprays are still extremely potent anti-infantry tools, and there's no better module for it than the WGI.

QFT

The death star maybe the best mid range infantry unit in the game simply because of all the boosted sprays it can lay down.

[Digilante]

Smaller unit w/UA + Joe? Certainly.

Though I wouldn't do this in a Steamroller list. Joe is just too valuable a solo to not take full advantage of in a character restricted environment.

On the subject which caster to run them under, I go for Epic Sorscha personally because desperate pace helps make up for the fact that using both Iron Flesh and Bob & Weave makes them pretty slow.

Ironically, she may need Joe less than other casters though as her Elite Cadre (reroll missed CRAs) means they are still pretty accurate when shooting. The sprays don't hit quite as hard without a boost, but they can make up for it in volume. I still use Joe in my eSorscha list, but have no problem giving out tough instead of boosts when the need arises.

[Wisible]

You should revisit this statement ...

"While the officer brings the defensive boosts, the officer brings the offensive boost."

Yeah doesn't the officer also grant CMA?

[Octavius_Maximus]

Would you ever take just 10 Winter Guard? Nothing else. I mean their stats are still alright for 6 points.

[philipcryx]

hard to say, i think you could find something that fits better for 6 points OR be able to drop some points to add the UA and joe or just UA/joe.

[Hoc Est Bellum]

hard to say, i think you could find something that fits better for 6 points OR be able to drop some points to add the UA and joe or just UA/joe.

QFT. Taking a min unit with the UA is better thatn taking a vanilla full unit. However, I would not recommend a min unit with joe for 6pts. You really need the UA to make them shine.

[Tudes]

pVlad
Signs & Portents boosts ranged attacks. I think we can just leave it at that.

!

Sorry to kick up the dust and nitpick on such an old thread, but there might be new people reading through it after a quick search and this can't stay the way it is. First of all, it's attacks and damage rolls (and not only ranged, but that's another story); secondly, they're not boosted as you always have to drop the last die... so if you roll 3 fives [WOW!!], you're not getting 15 (as you would with a boost), just 10... which don't get me wrong, it's still great.. but it's no boost.. not being a boost, it also means that you can go ahead and boost stuff under signs and portents (as it isn't already boosted){not for the deathstar though, obviously}, giving you a very handsome P+S+4D6 - smallest die roll .. the semantics make a pretty big difference here, just wanted to clarify..

[enma]

Sorry to kick up the dust and nitpick on such an old thread, but there might be new people reading through it after a quick search and this can't stay the way it is. First of all, it's attacks and damage rolls (and not only ranged, but that's another story); secondly, they're not boosted as you always have to drop the last die... so if you roll 3 fives [WOW!!], you're not getting 15 (as you would with a boost), just 10... which don't get me wrong, it's still great.. but it's no boost.. not being a boost, it also means that you can go ahead and boost stuff under signs and portents (as it isn't already boosted){not for the deathstar though, obviously}, giving you a very handsome P+S+4D6 - smallest die roll .. the semantics make a pretty big difference here, just wanted to clarify..

Statistic wise S+P gives a +2 boost to your rolls and I'm pretty sure this is what he is referring to by stating it "boosts"

[Col_Festus]

It should read "gives a boost" to ranged attacks. Ill fix it when I'm not on my phone.

[Tias]

Any advice for the newbie WGI player who finds it very hard to maneuver? I can never quite get my winter guard set up so that enough of them have LoS to do proper damage. Either I'm a clutz, or my group runs too much terrain (i suspect the last, since most of my friends run jack/beat bricks and thus aren't used to movement that is not just one model nipping about).

I thought about an advancing V-formation with Joe and UA in the back, but I'm not quite sure if it'll work.

[TheLewtz]

Any advice for the newbie WGI player who finds it very hard to maneuver? I can never quite get my winter guard set up so that enough of them have LoS to do proper damage. Either I'm a clutz, or my group runs too much terrain (i suspect the last, since most of my friends run jack/beat bricks and thus aren't used to movement that is not just one model nipping about).

I thought about an advancing V-formation with Joe and UA in the back, but I'm not quite sure if it'll work.

Good question, I am fairly new and have the same issue.