Damiano and Warpath

[Arkio]

Hey Guys,
I have been playing a lot of Damiano lately. I started off with the tier list. After playing a couple of games at 35 and 50 I quickly found that it had several weaknesses. Im not a fan of steelhead riflemen, if they get a UA in the future Ill look at them again with fresh eyes. Range 10 is just short enough to not be effective. The tier list also has limited ways of dealing with stealth models and has no way of granting pathfinder.

After moving away from the tier list I looked at the highborn contract. As it stands I have found units, jacks and solos that I love with him. I like the gun mages, the steelhead cavalry and halberdiers. Rocinante and the mule are both fantastic. I think Wyshnalyrr really helps him out. Rhupert went in right away.

I still want to try Alexia (both prime and epic) and see how she does. I'm curious if anyone has had luck with eAlexia in the middle of halberdiers with her having surefoot getting up in the business making thralls. It might just be a pipe dream.....

The one real question I have is designing a list that makes use of Warpath. In every game that I have played I have yet to cast Warpath. Between deadeye, allocation, and upkeeping I rarely have the FOCUS to cast warpath. Additionally, I usually just take one jack in Damiano's Battlegroup (rocinante). The mule is always marshalled to the gun mages (shocking I know). Is there a build that makes use of Warpath? I see Gun mages as a good tool to trigger it but what jacks do u take? Do you still want the Halberdier tar pit?

Im just hoping someone has a warpath list at 35 or 50 and can explain how it works. Warpath has been the spell I have "crossed off" his spell card until now.

[canadianone]

I think the problem here is that Damiano doesn't really like jacks. He typically has rockey, and maybe another jack. So, with 1 or 2 jacks, it typically isn't worth it, unless you really need to get a jack into a certain place. For contrast, look at another warnoun with warpath, Kromac. Kromac likes beasts, and he will typically have 3+. so, 2 (out of an available 7) fury isn't that much to pay to be able to move 3-4 beasts up the field into better charge lanes and what not. To be honest, i don't think that that spell really fits him, at least, not in the typically jack light lists i see him with.

[pattison]

Well I run a single Mangler with Damiano in most of the cases.
By upkeeping all of his upkeeps he can still alocate 3 focus to the Mangler, and the effective SPD8 on it is huge not just because it's a lot, but because you can move in 2 sections allowing you a couple of good angles for a thresher attack or just a good charge.
I agree that sometimes you don't need Warpath, but in most of the cases it's fantastic.
One of the things to trigger it is the Riflemen.
You write that they're underwhelming, but I think that with the proper support they're crazy good.
Part of that support is a coin and Deadeye from Damiano. They never really have to go for the aiming bonus with all this goodness (coin, rerolled CRA and Deadeye), so your threat range is 16". Add in A&H and they're dishing out super precise POW17 CRAs. In my world that's just great.

[PG_Caecus Scius]

If you run the ATGM and they marshall a mule, they will be effective.

Then just run rocky on Dom.

[LiamPiver]

I've had a lot of success with having Alexia2 in the middle of a group of Steelheads with Surefoot on her and Dirge on them. It's great at absorbing a charge or just discouraging one. 18 Def is incredibly legit.

I run Wishnailer with Damiano so I normaly have all of his upkeeps out. The Warpath move I normally use to move his personal Mule into position to aim and shoot. I run one on him and one on the gun mages.

I find the Riflemen with Dougal are great. His mini feat makes all the difference with them when you pop it and drop a coin on them. I also found that I like a min unit better than max due to the better point usage.

[Mael]

I find Deadeye isn't something I cast all that often, I'm usually just cycling upkeeps around the table Magnus style. Normally I get Warpath up turn 2 (if that), and I find the best use of it is to either move Rocinante into position for a charge / aimed shot or moving Rocinante BACK into position within 2" of Damiano for the guard dog bonus. The reality is that it's not going to net you a kill 4/5 games, but since Damiano is a grind caster in the first place having the defensive option is much better.

When it comes to ATGM vs Riflemen, read this: http://gk-workbench.com/?p=3324

[Mael]

Accidental double post. DELETE ME!

[Arkio]

The Mangler interests me. I don't think that I can ever fit in a 35 point list but at 50 it seems like an interesting idea. Typically my lists do not have heavy hitters. The feat in combination with the halberdiers and flanking Cavalry usually get the job done. Since by side of the board is so clogged with steelheads Stannis usually helps with the Tactician ability.
Its interesting that you said that you cycle upkeeps; I rarely, if ever, do that. Death March may be the exception, not sure if Surefoot ever needs to be cycled.
I have also been thinking about minion lesser warlocks. With the feat they seem interesting. Too bad Warpath cant work on them T-T.

[MagnustheJust]

I have also been thinking about minion lesser warlocks. With the feat they seem interesting. Too bad Warpath cant work on them T-T.

It will work on Wrong Eye & Snackjaw, as they become Mercenaries when used in a Four-Star Syndicate list..

[LiamPiver]

Warpath is a battlegroup spell Magnus so it'll only work on the jacks Damiano is controlling.

[rydiafan]

Well, the lessers warlock and/or beast can still trigger it, they just can move from it.

[MagnustheJust]

Well, the lessers warlock and/or beast can still trigger it, they just can move from it.

Dis ams whut I are to for to be meanting to haz sed...

[Keeler]

I haven't ever really used a caster with Warpath yet, but I had at one time purchased a small gator force that I sold to a new player before I ever put it on the table - Anyway, I was thinking about what warpath could do for me and I think this is how I would get the most from it.

Since Most of the jacks that Damiano has access to have reach, it is even more beneficial.

There is really no restriction on who can trigger warpath, so for instance, if you charge/move in your jack as normal (maybe even thresher) and kill something (likely) you can trigger your own warpath and dig deeper into a unit or towards a caster / key piece and still use remaining initials + whatever focus remains to hurt something that you might not otherwise have access too.

Basically using it like Doomshaper / Sturm & Drang, who can Goad warbeasts into your face.

Like I said, never actually tried it, but I am fairly certain that interpretation was ruled on as okay. I know that I can definately make use of Goad, so I don't see why an extra inch (3") that doesn't require being forced/using focus (from allocation) wouldn't also be very handy. Obviously as mentioned you can just use it to extend your initial threat range without the 'model x must kill something first' caveat that goad requires.

[NEoJoe]

Well I run a single Mangler with Damiano in most of the cases.
By upkeeping all of his upkeeps he can still alocate 3 focus to the Mangler, and the effective SPD8 on it is huge not just because it's a lot, but because you can move in 2 sections allowing you a couple of good angles for a thresher attack or just a good charge.
I agree that sometimes you don't need Warpath, but in most of the cases it's fantastic.
One of the things to trigger it is the Riflemen.
You write that they're underwhelming, but I think that with the proper support they're crazy good.
Part of that support is a coin and Deadeye from Damiano. They never really have to go for the aiming bonus with all this goodness (coin, rerolled CRA and Deadeye), so your threat range is 16". Add in A&H and they're dishing out super precise POW17 CRAs. In my world that's just great.

This.

I upkeep all three spells and allocate the the Mangler more often than not. Turns before the Mangler gets into a scrap I probably shoot a the handcannon or many cast Deadeye. All in all though, every game Warpath has been triggered and got the Mangler into a much better position. And on feat turn it beats crap up.

[Tahoth]

Also, if rocinante can get his hands on some easily killable infantry, you could always use Warpath for some fun. Engage one model, kill it, take your free shot, warpath to the next, kill it and get another free shot.

[rydiafan]

Also, if rocinante can get his hands on some easily killable infantry, you could always use Warpath for some fun. Engage one model, kill it, take your free shot, warpath to the next, kill it and get another free shot.

This only works if that first ranged attack kills something to trigger Warpath. After you shoot it's too late to trigger Warpath off of the melee attack.

[hamsandwich50]

I've been focusing on Damiano lately and this really illustrates my list debates i've been having with myself. I started running him in tier (4th tier) so I got to start with all the upkeeps out and other benefits. But I decided to drop tier for a while so I could throw the piper in there and get access to pathfinder, the main motivator was the pathfinder but I realized that since I'm only running rocinante I don't really need to start with the upkeeps out since I can just cast two of them first turn.

On the subject of this thread, I find myself only casting death march and sure foot first turn since I decided that both were more useful first turn of a game. But with only having one jack Damiano is not really struggling to cast warpath if needed, and with my games lately I've won two of them thanks to warpath. Both times it was because Rocinante needed that extra 3'' to get the charge and the caster kill. So what I'm trying to say is that with the right builds Damiano won't be focused starved and warpath can be cast when needed.

I'm not sure about building a list around it since that would probably mean having a few more jacks and at that point Damiano could be wanting focus elsewhere and you lose out on deathmarch and paymaster if you focus on jacks (deathmarch not so much since you'll probably have at least one unit to cast it on).

[PG_Norton]

Actually I am OK with Warpath being an occasional spell. Your opponents get used to seeing Dead Eye, Sure foot, Death March, and start responding accordingly. Casting warpath spell changes the way Damiano is played for that round, and might give you the edge you need. (Surprise is still one of best).

[Tahoth]

This only works if that first ranged attack kills something to trigger Warpath. After you shoot it's too late to trigger Warpath off of the melee attack.

I was under the impression that since they both trigger at the same time (immediately after the attack is resolved) you as the active player got to choose which goes off first, so you trigger the shot first, then the warpath. Is that incorrect?

[rydiafan]

Triggered effects which do not grant an attack (such as Warpath) must occur before triggered effects which grant an attack (such as Quick Work).

See 12B and 12D of the timing chart on page 245 of Prime.

[lastspartacus]

I have never played a nontier Damiano list because the advantages are just so great, and its my most successful merc list I have ever played.
I run Rosie, a Mule, and a Mangler, and I never drop warpath. Giving the jacks a non-linear threat range equal to the cavalry is nothing to be snuffed at, or using it to manouver an aimed Mule shot with deadeye when you really need it. Riflemen, with their rat9 pow15 CRAs are excellent enablers for this, moving forward and letting the front line pass beyond them once they are done, with Stannis. Its a perfect machine with many moving parts, can duke it out with top tier lists and players and win.

[hamsandwich50]

While I like his tier and use it as the starting point for the current build I use it does have a widely acknowledged hole, lack of pathfinder. Maybe it's just my meta by with how often we use walls (linear objects) the inability to charge over something really hinders my force. So while the tier is good and has some great benefits I think it can run into some serious trouble depending on your battlefield.

[pattison]

Mentioning Pathfinder: you also have the chance to stand behind a wall with your jack, enjoy cover and with good positioning make it impossible to get charged by a non-reach model. Then you trigger Warpath, step forward and then charge from there. This is a huge thing because sometimes your only option to avoid being charged is to stand behind a wall.