Caine vs Nemo - 15 pts

[Hekatonkheires]

Hi!

I've been doing my own research for the past few weeks and i think i found out which casters i would like to play with: Caine and Nemo.
From my research, i found out that Nemo really excels at supporting a lot of warjacks, which is cool because that was the main reason i got into this game Also, i really like the lightning theme, which i guess is one of our fields of expertise.
Caine...well, i guess the main reason that i want to play with him is because i really love AGTM / 13th / Trencher commandos and from what i've been reading, this is one of the casters that would benefit them the most. Ok, and being able to shoot "everybody" during one turn is also cool!
I also love Blaize but i think its an "advanced" caster and i think i should stick to the basics first

With this in mind, i built two lists

Caine
- Hunter
- Defender
- 13th
- Arlan

Defender would be with Caine and Hunter with Arlan, because he (Defender) can still make some damage while in melee and i would need those 3 focus to seriously hurt a heavy warjack. About the 13th...I know that Caine can manage single wound infantary at this level, but the 13th could help...what do you think? do you think they're relevant ?

Nemo
- Ironclad
- Lancer
- Hammersmith

Lancer allows Nemo to play from behind and two heavy are always hard to manage at 15pts. But i guess im not convering everything with this list:for instance, i think i would be in trouble if i played against mass infantry armies.
I could replace the hammersmith with 1 sentinel (protects Nemo as well with the special ability) and 1 charger or 2 chargers and have something to help dealing with it, but i wouldnt have enough focus to manage them all right? I could also throw JR (which i use in my 15 stryker list (battlegroup)) but that would leave me with 6 points to spend on something...a hunter maybe? What do you think?

Thanks for your support!

[RidetheLightning]

Are you playing Nemo1 or Nemo2? It makes a big difference IMO. I love taking advantage of ALL of Nemo1 special abilities, which means adding in a few solos that can "cast" spells like Jr. and Arlan. With that said this list could help:

Cygnar
15+6 points, 5 models

Commander Adept Nemo* +6 points
* Defender* 9 points
* Ironclad* 7 points

Journeyman Warcaster* 3 points
Captain Arlan Strangewayes* 2 points

I find that the Defender does well early and late game with Nemo. The Ironclad is there to draw heat early game and use Tremor to make attacks hit more easily. Arlan is there to give a focus to the Defender so Nemo can Supercharge the Ironclad and Jr. is there to protect models and provide a boosted POW 12 from time to time.

As for Caine, he does like units and solos more than 'jacks, and I don't think at this level you NEED a Defender so what about this list:

Cygnar
15+6 points, 9 models

Lieutenant Allister Caine* +6 points
* Hunter* 6 points

Black 13th Gun Mage Strike Team* 4 points
Captain Arlan Strangewayes* 2 points
* Grenadier* 5 points
2x Trencher Master Gunner* 2 points each

You still get the Hunter to deal with 'jacks and beasts, but the Grenadier gets a focus from Arlan, the 'jack Marshall bonus and 2 extra shots with b2b master gunners plus some fun effects from their Artillerist abilities! And it leaves Caine with 4 focus minimum on most turns after upkeeps if necessary! I hope some of this helps and more importantly you have fun! Remember, play the models you want to and you're more likely to have a better time!

[Hekatonkheires]

damn! i always forget about that! i was considering both pNemo and pCaine

I find really interesting the list you made with Nemo!
About Caine, i really like the combined effect with Grenadier / Master Gunner....but wont that anti-infantry combo reduce the importance of the 13th unit? i mean, i guess they would have the same role no?

thanks for your help

[Hekatonkheires]

damn! i always forget about that! i was considering both pNemo and pCaine

I find really interesting the list you made with Nemo!
About Caine, i really like the combined effect with Grenadier / Master Gunner....but wont that anti-infantry combo reduce the importance of the 13th unit? i mean, i guess they would have the same role no?

thanks for your help

[Hekatonkheires]

Ok, how about this

pNemo +6
- Centurion -9
- Lancer -6
- B13 -4
- Arlan -2

Centurion will be there to deliver some punch, while lancer will allow Nemo to stay hidden. B13 will deal with infantry and stealth and Arlan will grant 1 focus where needed and also repair the jacks (mostly lancer i suppose). since pnemo is all about jacks, i could replace B13 with a charger or a sentinel but i think the 13th will add a bit of flexibility to my game and at this level i think 2 jacks will be enough...at least i'll try out and see for myself

pCaine +6
- Ironclad -7
- Hunter -6
- B13 -4

I wasnt considering a heavy jack with Caine but i guess it's always reassuring to have a heavy in the game plus i dont want to use only one hunter as the only thing that can hit high ARM targets. Hunter will obviously target tougher opponents and B13 will be there to attack stealth models and infantry in general. I have 4 points left though...i was considering the following:
- 6 sword knights (as a support unit) OR
- Trencher Chain gun (creating cloud areas to prevent charges and / or attack infantry) and squire OR
- Stormcaller (hunt stealth units), Reinholdt and Trencher chain gun OR
- Leave B13 and include ATGM and UA

What do you think?

thanks

[Bloodsplatter artist]

I don't have much experience with the cains yet but I know pcain like an ironclad in his lists. Pnemo on the other hand is almost as big an infantry trasher as pcain. He has chain lightning a pow 12(I believe) hit and d6 electro leaps. At the 15 point level 1 shot of this can waste their whole infantry force. The lancer from your first list is key. The lancer can run up and let you ark both lightning and his weird magno bolt spell to lock down jack bricks. In adition I would run a Beaty heavy. Ironclads are good but with locomotion a hamersmith can be wicked fast and hit hard with the str buff. I like p nemo for low levels. He's just so versitle, and I wouldn't hesitate to run him without infantry at this level. Cut b 13 for some magic solos for his arcane acumulator. If stormsmith stormcalls can trigger it run 2 and strangeways. The callers ignore stealth fry infantry and disrupt jacks witch is how we deal with heavys.

On pcain I would run ecain at that level he can still lawnmower infantry but his new feat can crack heavys witch is what you need. Between Cain b13 and a light jack you should have plenty of infantry kill but you need more ways to stop jacks.

[Hekatonkheires]

why didn't i look to hammersmith before??...too many jack models to analyze i guess! that's great advice! and for 8 pts!

must definitely try something like this

pNemo
Hammersmith
Lancer
Charger
Arlan
Stormcaller

thanks man!