Vlad3 and Kreoss3 feat?

[x3tsniper]

Kreoss3's feat expires all enemy upkeeps and animi, then he gets to cast all his upkeeps for free
Vlad3's feat spoiled. Cavalry and warjacks in his control get sidestep and sprint. It's called Charge of the Horse Lords.

This is from someone on vassal. Apparently we will know every single model by the end of the week though.

[Nebo]

That was me. Who are you on Vassal?

The fact that his feat says 'Warjacks and Cavalry' leads me to believe that he doesn't have Iron Horse, which is a shame.

[rivenwyrm]

must... restrain... moaning about doom...

Apparently when horse-lords charge they also... retreat afterwards? Sidestep seems kinda... random. Sprint could be useful. Not sure I believe that's his feat though. "Someone on vassal" is a bit vague, and Kreoss3s' seems like copy-paste with a typo from Vayl2, although I suppose it makes sense with purification being in his spell list.

[Nebo]

Apparently Vlad3 also has Infernal Machine. This could be fun.

Source was ambiguous. That might be for Asphyxious3.

[x3tsniper]

I am Evan on Vassal. Yes I got it from you sir. Oo

[MediumYellow]

must... restrain... moaning about doom...

Apparently when horse-lords charge they also... retreat afterwards? Sidestep seems kinda... random. Sprint could be useful. Not sure I believe that's his feat though. "Someone on vassal" is a bit vague, and Kreoss3s' seems like copy-paste with a typo from Vayl2, although I suppose it makes sense with purification being in his spell list.

If this is true, it makes sense. Sprint isn't just used to retreat, you can also kill things then get in more things faces. I think it could be used many ways.

[StefDa]

Sprint and Sidestep sure are nice. Uhlans can charge then move 10", which is more than your standard SPD 6 non-Reach infantry model can reach.

[John of Arc]

I posted this in the Menite version of the thread, but I am very amused by the fact that they printed that feat and Conquest in the same book. Hope you weren't planning on using both of your new toys at the same time!

[x3tsniper]

I posted this in the Menite version of the thread, but I am very amused by the fact that they printed that feat and Conquest in the same book. Hope you weren't planning on using both of your new toys at the same time!

What do you mean? Oo

[John of Arc]

Just that Conquest gets literally nothing out of Vlad3's feat. He may still be good with him, but not benefitting from a feat designed for Warjacks leaves a bad taste in my mouth =/

[Herudaio]

Just that Conquest gets literally nothing out of Vlad3's feat. He may still be good with him, but not benefitting from a feat designed for Warjacks leaves a bad taste in my mouth =/

Really?
Both happen during activation so it means he gets +4" of move and sprint afterwards. Last time I played WM it sounded really good. Sort of reversed Strakhov feat.

[Nebo]

I was under the impression that colossals can't move apart from during their normal movement, rather than just their activation. Depends on how that restriction is worded as to whether this feat will be of any benefit. It does look like Fenris is going to be an auto include with 3Vlad, though.

[x3tsniper]

I thought they just couldn't be slammed placed and what not. I didn't realize they all had the built in rule of immovable object or whatever it is called. I never looked at the NQ. Only thing that gets me to crack open one of those bad boys is a full spoiler for one of my own models.

[Herudaio]

Funny thing:
Side Step works with: special attacks and initials. Not an even single word about melee attacks

Gun Carriage - 4 side steps (trample is special attack)
Torch! - 3 side steps

[x3tsniper]

When a model with Side Step hits an enemy model with an initial melee attack or a non-power attack special attack, after the attack is resolved it can advance 2˝. A model with Side Step cannot be targeted by free strikes during this movement.


Side step has been eratted forever.

[Herudaio]

Where did you find it?

"When this model hits an enemy model with an initial attack or a
special attack that is not a power attack, it can advance 2˝ after
the attack is resolved."

This text is from Errata Jan 2012 and no word on melee attack.

[x3tsniper]

Vladimir Tzepesci, Great Prince of Umbrey
- Feat: Charge of the Horse Lords // While in Vladimirʼs control area, friendly Faction warjacks and cavalry models gain Side Step and Sprint. Charge of the Horse Lords lasts for one turn. (When a model with Side Step hits an enemy model with an initial melee attack or a non-power attack special attack, after the attack is resolved it can advance 2˝. A model with Side Step cannot be targeted by free strikes during this movement.) (At the end of its activation, if it destroyed one or more enemy models with melee attacks during its activation, a model with Sprint can make a full advance.)


I was mainly referring to the errata for the trample portion. You cannot trample and side step from it.
The wording under the feat does specifically say melee though, and I am assuming he got it from the book word for word.

They have all the feats up on tg.

[Raktra]

Hmm, before seeing his spells/static rules, I'm a tad let down. Reserving judgement until I know more.

[markya]

Given that Vlad1 has boundless charge and Vlad2 has Assail, I'm guessing he'll have at least a spell which gives +2" MOV charges + free charge. Add sidestep to this and a potentially nice interaction with Drago's imprint and there's some serious threat range on both Drago and Beast09.

I'd not be at all surprised if he had some other way of speeding up 'jacks - they're going to struggle to keep up with a caster who's likely to be either SPD 7 or 8.

[Nebo]

Given that Vlad1 has boundless charge and Vlad2 has Assail, I'm guessing he'll have at least a spell which gives +2" MOV charges + free charge. Add sidestep to this and a potentially nice interaction with Drago's imprint and there's some serious threat range on both Drago and Beast09.

I'd not be at all surprised if he had some other way of speeding up 'jacks - they're going to struggle to keep up with a caster who's likely to be either SPD 7 or 8.

The spoiler was ambiguous, but it looks like he has Infernal Machine. And why would a jack have trouble keeping up with a fast caster? Why would you be running 14"+ ahead of your jacks? That makes no sense.

[x3tsniper]

You think we could be stealing full tilt from kraye? Oo It would be pretty cool for about half our jacks. Here is to praying for a speed buff.

I can't decide if I am more excited to learn Conquest's S rules or more about Vlad3.

[markya]

The spoiler was ambiguous, but it looks like he has Infernal Machine. And why would a jack have trouble keeping up with a fast caster? Why would you be running 14"+ ahead of your jacks? That makes no sense.

You wouldn't, but why would you have a caster (who's looking like a Jack caster from the feat) with a potential SPD of 7/8 running jacks with SPD 4 and no way of speeding them up? It seems unlikely to me that he won't have a way of speeding up at least part of his battlegroup.

Infernal machine would be nice, but it's a bit Cryxian for my liking... Previous Vlads had Boundless Charge and Assail. Just sayin'.

You think we could be stealing full tilt from kraye?

THIS! This is what I'm hoping....

[OrsusSmash]

You wouldn't, but why would you have a caster (who's looking like a Jack caster from the feat) with a potential SPD of 7/8 running jacks with SPD 4 and no way of speeding them up? It seems unlikely to me that he won't have a way of speeding up at least part of his battlegroup.

Infernal machine would be nice, but it's a bit Cryxian for my liking... Previous Vlads had Boundless Charge and Assail. Just sayin'.

I wouldn't say Vlad3 looks any more "'jack caster-y" than his second incarnation. While his feat has a caveat for warjacks, that's just PP trying to be inclusive. We won't really know what kind of battlegroup he wants until we see more of his spell list and abilities. Based on Infernal Machine, I'm leaning towards him wanting a smaller battlegroup (single target, short range upkeeps aren't efficient to swap around to make your battlegroup hum.) But I'm definitely interested in finding out!

The possibilities of Vlad3's feat (if it turns out this is legit) are very interesting.

Fenris + Sidestep + Sprint = slippery lawnmower

Drakun + Sidestep + Sprint = Super jammer

Also, Infernal Machine on Drago will be very fun. MAT 9 with the affinity bonus. And sidestep/sprint on the feat turn. Should lead to some nice shenanigans.

[x3tsniper]

I always forget, is sprint immune to free strikes? If it isn't then waahhh.

[OrsusSmash]

I always forget, is sprint immune to free strikes? If it isn't then waahhh.

Negative sir.

I know this for two reasons:

1) It's why I always keep an eye on where I put Strakov's War Dog.

2) It's yet another rule that Finn can't really use well.

That said, Vlad3 could have something deliciously absurd like Dash, and then all bets are off!

[quindraco]

I don't have the exact wording of impact attacks in front of me. Can a cavalry model with Side Step side-step from impact attacks, effectively using them to make their charge longer?

I hope his spell list has something to make Uhlans better, because his feat screams for them.

[Esper]

Sidestep only triggers from initial attacks, which impact attacks aren't. I'd say no.

[PG_Draxos]

Why the hell do we get Infernal Machine? That is a cryxian patent right there. I'm sorry but this seems fishy.

[epyonliu]

Oh man, I don't know. I hope this is not his feat or there is a really good spell list to synergy with it. The biggest problem is that warjacks do not benefit from side step as much as warbeasts do, due to the limited amount of initial attacks and focus mechanism, not to mention the natural low speed of Khador heavies. They are not gonna trigger side step easily without reach and we have to somehow deal with their average MAT. In terms of cavalry to be honest I only see Fenris to be the one enjoying it. Drakhun and Uhlans have just one initial attack, and uhlans need to charge to be actually useful.

It does look like a feat for a horse lord, somehow. Charge the cav in and sprint out might be useful but again most of cavalry unit/models are better doing heavy lifting job so that will limit the number of models who can sprint back. It looks weird as a feat for Khador... Or will there be new cavalry units for us?

It's not Skorne who has beast handlers and rush to hand out. What do you expect warjacks with side steps do? They will not be able to dance around like Molik and still wreck enemy heavies/kill mass amount of infantry and sprint miles away. Again, IMO there must be some really good ability/spell to help out to make this feat actually usable.

[x3tsniper]

One way to look at it for the cavalry, is that they use the side step to disengage. The side step is a 2" move that is immune to free strikes, followed by the full advance from sprint, assuming you killed your target. This means that you are advancing away almost as far as you charged.

[OrsusSmash]

One way to look at it for the cavalry, is that they use the side step to disengage. The side step is a 2" move that is immune to free strikes, followed by the full advance from sprint, assuming you killed your target. This means that you are advancing away almost as far as you charged.

Yeah, I think this is more how you'd use it for something like Uhlans. You can use it to either dig deeper in, or hit and fade. Between the sidestep and sprint, that's a 10" move, which should keep you very safe from any retaliation.

The bigger issue is that Uhlans aren't really suited to charge in and stab infantry to death (terrible ROI in points,) but hopefully Vlad3 has something that helps them out here? Markov would be really boss though: run in, drop that template, then get the heck out of dodge.

[Ohmen76]

I think the Gun Carriage is valid though, could charge a unit model (kill or kd hopefully kill) sidestep back 2", then blast-blast-shoot, and sprint back out. Leaving ruff terrain behind to make it even harder to hit it back. Will also be 9" away from what it just hit.

[OrsusSmash]

I think the Gun Carriage is valid though, could charge a unit model (kill or kd hopefully kill) sidestep back 2", then blast-blast-shoot, and sprint back out. Leaving ruff terrain behind to make it even harder to hit it back. Will also be 9" away from what it just hit.

Good call on the Gun Carriage!

I'm not sure about Side Step (Trampling Hooves is strange because it essentially gives you an initial attack when you wouldn't otherwise have one, and I don't have the card to scrutinize it,) but you'd definitely be able to pull off Sprint. That'd make for a very fun turn: charge in, stomp something to death, shoot the rest, then flee to safety.

[x3tsniper]

The way I am reading it, the mount attack is an initial. Could be way of there, but that is how I am reading it. I still don't think I will ever pick up a gun carriage.

[quindraco]

What would make his feat incredible would be a kind of improved, specialised Transference that lets large-based friendly Faction warrior models in his CTL spend his focus not only on boosting melee attack and damage, but also on buying swings. Naturally this would be awful on Uhlans, but Fenris would adore it, and it would give the Drakhun an excellent excuse to join in on the fun.

[Ohmen76]

What is silly is the Steelhead Cav will be better under his feat with our unit attachment, because they have assault/backswing. Put Zephyr on them and now they are charging for 15", plus have a high chance of hitting with their natural ability of being by each other. Then side step "2, but have to read Zephyr to see if it is just normal movement, because if not they can retreat after "12. Also went back and read the card for Gun Carriage a few times now seems like it will work, since it states on the card that on a charge it can make attacks with it's trampling hooves.

[PG_LunarSol]

My initial response was to be pretty underwhelmed and disappointed, but I think the important thing to consider will be how well Vlad can use it himself. What's really unfortunate is that Vlad can't activate after the rest of his army. I could see the feat being really nasty if the Cavalry could charge, get out of the way, and open up a hole for Vlad to finish the job. Side step/Sprint on high cost single attack models is definitely a little disappointing though.

[Ohmen76]

Vlad could be his own Karne bullet. Pop feat, sitting on 7 focus, two initial attacks. Assume he is speed 8" with reach on one weapon. So 11" inch charge, 13" threat hit, side step, now 15" up the field, swing second attack hit side step 17" up the board, if the enemy caster is with 19" can buy attacks and assasinate with bigger ps weapon.

[Invaderzahn]

What is silly is the Steelhead Cav will be better under his feat with our unit attachment...

Pretty sure Ranking officers can only attach to small or medium based units. No Faction Friendly Steelhead Cav.

[Steamwitch]

dosent vlad "technicaly" use dark magic? Or some nonsense to do with the old witch causeing that? In that light i can see infernal machine in his spell list no problem.