I'm Disappointed.

[bouncymischa]

I think this might be a core difference between you and I then.

Particularly with Khador, new models is what keeps me coming back, New puzzles to solve new models to evaluate. 2-5 games a week, and after years and years playing Khador most things are old hat, so new models really get me going again.

Nothing wrong with different people enjoying different aspects of the game. :3 It was quite interesting to get some insight into how that aspect of the game gives you some enjoyment.

You should have assumed there would be no releases for your faction in the book, so 2 would have been a pleasant surprise.

Admittedly, there are certain advantages to that approach... :P

[J. Beatnik]

I'm a new player as of March of this year. I'm still catching up on old stuff, so having less rules and models is great for me to keep learning. Also, I love to see all the great paint jobs around my local shop, so the Colossals will be super cool to see.

[allistorpreist]

I will admit, even as a dedicated fanboy spaz, I am dissapointed. I was hoping that we would at least see alt unit upgrades like the Iron Dragons for each faction. Honestly, one of my factions needs some infantry love.

But it is a small dissapointment. I still want the book for the fluff/story (honestly, if War Room ever releases, that is all I really want the books for) but I was hoping for more. That does not mean PP failed, or gave a weak release. They turned out great work and, compared to Gargantuans, Colossals suffered quantity wise. It may mean I am not buying anything new for one or more of my factions this year, but it is a long way from catastrophic.

That said, the reason people are dissapointed is because they are passionate about this game. Not because they hate PP, not because they are mean, but because the game really excites us, and we want more. I would murder to put out something that people were that passionate about. Not to bring up "that other game" but Warhammer 40K didn't lose my money when I was dissapointed in a release, they lost my money when I didn't care.

[PG_aterdaeus]

That said, the reason people are dissapointed is because they are passionate about this game. Not because they hate PP, not because they are mean, but because the game really excites us, and we want more. I would murder to put out something that people were that passionate about. Not to bring up "that other game" but Warhammer 40K didn't lose my money when I was dissapointed in a release, they lost my money when I didn't care.

This. x100

[bouncymischa]

That said, the reason people are dissapointed is because they are passionate about this game. Not because they hate PP, not because they are mean, but because the game really excites us, and we want more.

A valid point. I think my concern just comes from when it looks like people are starting to blame Privateer for their disappointment. Privateer chose to release a limited number of models in the book for their reasons (which will be at least somewhat explained later today). They'll be on the hook for whatever consequences occur from that, whether it's limited book sales, or people dropping the game in favor of others, or whatever. But they're not on the hook for anyone's personal feelings.

[Khador247]

...the reason people are dissapointed is because they are passionate about this game. Not because they hate PP, not because they are mean, but because the game really excites us, and we want more.

Precisely. One of the things that disturbs me a bit I guess is the silence from PP. They've been around us long enough to know that this was definitely going to be an issue once it finally became known. There have been people posting almost daily saying "Huh, I wonder whey we haven't seen spoilers online or in No Quarter?" PP has known for a while now that this book would only have two releases for each faction. Pre-orders for the book have already been bought and paid for. Since it is such a deviation from the norm it would have been nice to have known sooner. Is PP obligated to tell us this? No, as has been pointed out numerous times in numerous threads. However, it is something I would have expected and am a bit disappointed that it didn't happen.

Oh well. Moving on...

[watchgeorgerock]

As the OP i wish to elaborate. I WANT TO BUY THE BOOK!!!! I just can't justify it. I am still mad about buying Domination and getting shafted in the fluff department ( I play Piggies ). I didnt expect 6 releases but I figure PP could easily put in an ALT UA and or another UA for each of the factions. I also figured they would put in an upgrade Character Kit for all of the new Plastic Jack kits.

i don't want this to be all negative so I will justify the lack of releases in Colossals made it possible for the IKRPG to come out this year.

[Drzombieface]

You're going to get more releases, just not in this book. QQ'ing and DOOOOOMing Colossals, which is just one book, is silly.

Have patience and you'll get more. Colossals is just a mode of transporting a new model type into the game, with double epic casters sprinkled on top. Not even all of the Wrath releases are out yet, and I'm pretty sure the next book for Warmachine will be filled to the brim with stuff like a normal book.

I just can't seem to understand why this is such a huge problem for some people. I can only see it as you're demanding everything right now, instead of having patience and getting more stuff later on.

i don't want this to be all negative so I will justify the lack of releases in Colossals made it possible for the IKRPG to come out this year.

Sort of... from looking at their release schedule, they had stuff on their plate that wasn't Warmachine/Hordes. IK is kind of related, but it's a separate entity. This is why I didn't expect to have more than 2-3 releases per faction right off the bat. PP does have games other than Warmahordes...

This just seems like it was made a bigger deal than it needs to be by people going "Gimme, gimme, gimme new things, all the things... RIGHT NAO"

[Vex]

A valid point. I think my concern just comes from when it looks like people are starting to blame Privateer for their disappointment.

That is because PP is to blame. Disappointment results from reality not meeting expectations. PP had the opportunity to properly set expectations prior to all the data being released. Instead, they let us have the bad news cold. Disappointment was inevitable at that point.

[bouncymischa]

That is because PP is to blame. Disappointment results from reality not meeting expectations. PP had the opportunity to properly set expectations prior to all the data being released. Instead, they let us have the bad news cold. Disappointment was inevitable at that point.

They're still not responsible for the expectations you chose to make. Did a lot of people make bad assumptions based on a lack of data? Yes. Is Privateer responsible for them choosing to do so? No.

Ugh. I can't even begin to imagine how a mature adult would blame someone else for their own bad choices.

[Vex]

They're still not responsible for the expectations you chose to make. Did a lot of people make bad assumptions based on a lack of data? Yes. Is Privateer responsible for them choosing to do so? No.

False. PP has set expectations with all of their previous books. The fact that his book would vary significantly from all of their previous books should have been noted well in advance. This is known as "level setting", and is something that businesses should be doing to ensure maximum customer satisfaction. The fact that PP failed to do this resulted in their new book being perceived by many as a disappointment.

[HeadHunter]

False. PP has set expectations with all of their previous books.

So, you're saying that everything has to be done the way it was in previous books? It sounds like you're imposing an obligation to justify your expectation.

See, that's the problem with this whole process - customers dream about what they hope to see, and they discuss it on the forums. Those dreams become wishes, wishes become expectations, and somewhere along the line, those morph into unspoken "promises" that were never made. Then, when what's delivered doesn't measure up to what was never promised in the first place, people act alienated.

It's no wonder game companies play it close to the vest - the last thing they need is to give such people any ammo.

[DemonCalibre]

So, you're saying that everything has to be done the way it was in previous books? It sounds like you're imposing an obligation to justify your expectation.

This statement is a tad unfair. If you go to your favorite restaurant ordered your favorite meal, then find out they have totally changed the recipe, and it isn't as good.

You would be disappointed, if you liked that particular dish a lot you might be unhappy.

This is a similar situation, an expectation was set through a pattern of behavior, a sudden, negative, and surprising change to that behavior is going to reasonably inspire negative feelings.

The excuse "Privateer Press never said it wouldn't be different" doesn't give them a pass from people being disappointed.

There is nothing wrong in presuming the Status Quo, and being disappointed with the Status Quo doesn't happen(particularly as a surprise), this is what we do all the time in real life.

[Vex]

So, you're saying that everything has to be done the way it was in previous books? It sounds like you're imposing an obligation to justify your expectation.

No, I am saying that if they plan to do something radically different that could easily been seen as being "worse" than their previous works, then it behooves them to warn people in advance, and to properly set expectations. Failing to do so helps nobody, and PP failed to do this.

It's no wonder game companies play it close to the vest.

This is actually the worst possible thing that you could do, and is pretty much what PP did. That's why we are having this discussion.

[gunslingerpro]

After reading how Collossals were a culmination of years of work and focus and testing throughout all the panels and blog posts, I honestly have only one thought.

Congrats on getting them to table, PP. Enjoy a bit of extra time with your loved ones in celebration (though as all of us know how long your pre-production phase lasts, it's unlikely to be possible. But good luck with playtesting the next WM book releases on Monday morning.)

Perspective, folks. Perspective.

[HeadHunter]

This statement is a tad unfair. If you go to your favorite restaurant ordered your favorite meal, then find out they have totally changed the recipe, and it isn't as good.

That's a poor analogy - they're not redoing the same offering, they're adding a new one.

They're not responsible for expectations you set based on previous books. Again, they're under no obligation to do it the same way every time, and your disappointment results only from your expectation that they should. It's unrealistic to bind them to a release format based solely on previous books - especially because this cannot compare to a Forces book, which adds models for a single faction. Since the only other comparable release for MkII has been Wrath, you're honestly basing your expectations on one previous release. That's hardly insufficient data upon which to establish any expectations.

There is nothing wrong in presuming the Status Quo, and being disappointed with the Status Quo doesn't happen(particularly as a surprise), this is what we do all the time in real life.

If that's honestly your philosophy, I can bet that disappointment is a frequent factor in your life. First of all, the only constant factor in life is change- get used to that. Second, the status quo doesn't last very often - not only in the business world but in many aspects of life. If you expect things will always be this way because "they have always been this way", you're going to be disappointed more often than not! The reality is, things haven't "always been this way", nor will they always remain this way.

As bouncymischa has already tried to point out, the primary factor that defines adulthood is the ability to accept responsibility for the consqeuences of our choices. Blaming others because things are not as we expect accomplishes nothing.

[SteampunkWino]

^ +1 to HeadHunter

Another +1 gunslingerpro. We have all watched the videos time and again of just how long PP has poured into this project. Kudos!

[PG_petegrrrr]

As bouncymischa has already tried to point out, the primary factor that defines adulthood is the ability to accept responsibility for the consqeuences of our choices. Blaming others because things are not as we expect accomplishes nothing.

Even though I am on your side of this argument, I have to say, I absolutely disagree with that line of reasoning, as A) you can argue that the consequence of PP deviating from a well established pattern means they should be prepared for the consequences (forum unhappiness) and B) Blaming others because things are not the way we expect is the catalyst for every positive change the world has ever seen.

So while I am on your side, I cannot follow that logic at all.

[ColinT]

What? 2 models per faction? Thats really lame, now a book's gonna get shelled out every time they come up with a few new models?

[PG_machine007]

I am glad PP did this to catch up a little bit. People were complaining that they still haven't seen their models from an entire book ago. This gives PP the proper time to not only release all the models, but also do any recasts as well as playtest and design the next book. Just because there isn't much from this book, doesn't mean there will be very little from the next book. They don't have to release all their models a month or two within the realm of a book. The next's books releases could start as soon as early next year. We already have some hints of possible future releases that they now can have more time to work on.

It's impossible to please everyone. Some people are looking at this way too shortsighted and not of what potential there could be in the future. I will gladly take 2 models in this one book to allow for more progression in others.

I can see where people are coming from, but looking towards whats after the next step may help cope. Heck, the book isn't even officially out yet.

[HeadHunter]

Even though I am on your side of this argument, I have to say, I absolutely disagree with that line of reasoning, as A) you can argue that the consequence of PP deviating from a well established pattern means they should be prepared for the consequences (forum unhappiness) and B) Blaming others because things are not the way we expect is the catalyst for every positive change the world has ever seen.

So while I am on your side, I cannot follow that logic at all.

How can it be a "well-established pattern"? There's been precisely ONE non-Forces book release for MkII... and that was Wrath. One book does not a "pattern" make.

I'm sure PP is prepared for the consequences of their decision to publish and release as they have. It doesn't mean that will change.

And I must point out that blaming others has never been a catalyst for change. "What are you going to do about my problem?" has never changed anything. What has been a catalyst are people who take the responsibility upon themselves to effect that change. Change comes from a willingness to take action, not from passing the buck.

I appreciate that you are on my side and that you can see what I'm trying to get at. I hope this makes my position all the more clear.

[BigHoot]

I go to Red Robin because I really like their burgers. I like the bacon mushroom burger. I get it a lot. I like the royale burger. I get it a lot. Now they have a new COLOSSAL burger. I bought it. But it's a kiddie-sized burger at the adult-sized price. Nowhere on the menu does it say it's a kiddie-sized burger. But the waiter delivered it to me and it's so tiny that it makes the sliders look big. Oh, but hey, it comes with a ton of extra fries. I am disappointed. I have a right to be disappointed. Does it mean I'm never coming back to Red Robin? Of course not. But you can damn sure bet I will ask the waiter how big their next new burger is _before_ I buy it. I feel I have the right to voice my displeasure to the manager regarding the way this burger was sold without other patrons getting in my face and telling me to shut up, eat the burger, and love it.

[PG_machine007]

I go to Red Robin because I really like their burgers. I like the bacon mushroom burger. I get it a lot. I like the royale burger. I get it a lot. Now they have a new COLOSSAL burger. I bought it. But it's a kiddie-sized burger at the adult-sized price. Nowhere on the menu does it say it's a kiddie-sized burger. But the waiter delivered it to me and it's so tiny that it makes the sliders look big. Oh, but hey, it comes with a ton of extra fries. I am disappointed. I have a right to be disappointed. Does it mean I'm never coming back to Red Robin? Of course not. But you can damn sure bet I will ask the waiter how big their next new burger is _before_ I buy it. I feel I have the right to voice my displeasure to the manager regarding the way this burger was sold without other patrons getting in my face and telling me to shut up, eat the burger, and love it.

You do know how many models are being released. Normally, most LGSs I've been to allow you to look through books before purchasing. Worst case scenario you can ask someone else if you can't see it at a LGS. You generally will know what you will be getting into when buying a PP product.

[BigHoot]

Sure, I could have asked the waiter how big the burger was before I bought it. I also could have asked whether it was made from goat intestines or ground beef. I could have asked if it had rusty broken syringes from homeless drug users randomly mixed in with it. I could have asked if purchasing the burger gave Red Robin permission to kick my dog. I didn't do any of those things because I have purchased the PRIME burger, the EXCEPTIONAL burger, the SUPER burger, the LEGENDAIRY(filter) burger, and the WRATHFUL burger and they were all very consistently good and very consistently sized. It was not a poor assumption of mine to think that the COLOSSAL burger would be similar in size, price, form, and function to all of these other burgers that I have liked.

[HeadHunter]

Wow, you're really reaching.

First of all, you haven't even bought it yet, and no one's forcing you to buy it. You know exactly what's in it before it's even released in stores. You have a right to voice your displeasure to the management - but what you're doing here is yelling at the manager in front of all the other patrons. So yes, you can expect that they'd tell you to pipe down.

I'm not saying people don't have a right to be disappointed, or even to voice that disappointment. I'm merely saying that all the complaining here isn't going to change anything, it's only going to annoy the rest of us. Feel free to write an angry letter to Privateer Press expressing your displeasure and articulating the ways in which they failed to meet the expectations that you established for them. But if you're going to talk about it here, we're going to talk about it too. Welcome to a discussion forum, where we're just as free to tell you what we think of what you said. Funny how that works.

To hear people carry on, you'd think that PP held them down, took the $35 out of their wallet and forced them to take a book that they didn't even want. If you want more than empty words, exercise the only power you have as a consumer - it's called voting with your wallet.

[BigHoot]

I'm not telling you to stop loving their kiddie-sized burgers or to stop proclaiming your love for their kiddie-sized burgers. So maybe it's ok if I don't love their kiddies-sized burger and maybe it's ok if I proclaim my distaste for their kiddie-sized burgers.

[HeadHunter]

I have purchased the PRIME burger, the EXCEPTIONAL burger, the SUPER burger, the LEGENDAIRY(filter) burger, and the WRATHFUL burger and they were all very consistently good and very consistently sized. It was not a poor assumption of mine to think that the COLOSSAL burger would be similar in size, price, form, and function to all of these other burgers that I have liked.

First of all, the first four burgers you mention were on the old menu, before the place was completely remodeled and reopened with an all-new menu. They haven't served those burgers in years.

You know, if we're going to use your really shoddy analogy, I used to love the Pot Roast burger at Red Robin. Best sandwich I ever had. They don't serve it any more, their menu changed years ago. Did I stop going to Red Robin? No. Would I like to see it return? Of course? Do I mention that to the server? Sometimes. Do I carry on in front of all the other patrons about how Red Robin has wronged me? certainly not - I'm not an idiot.

By the way, have you seen it on the menu recently. Of course not - so what should that tell you?

If this book has really been such a horrible thing and offended you so greatly, then for crying out loud, don't buy it! But give it a rest already, would you?

I'm not telling you to stop loving their kiddie-sized burgers or to stop proclaiming your love for their kiddie-sized burgers. So maybe it's ok if I don't love their kiddies-sized burger and maybe it's ok if I proclaim my distaste for their kiddie-sized burgers.

So, you're the guy who tells the people in the next booth how much you hate what they ordered through the whole meal? And can't get the hint that all you need to do is shut up and not order it? Please tell me you're not really like that in the outside world (in which case, why are you like that here?)...

[PG_machine007]

Nothing says that this "burger" is not good. It still has all the same stuff, just different proportions of ingrediants. It's a different flavor. Not everyone likes the flavor. If you don't like it, then don't buy it. But for those that like this combination, then they will enjoy it. The reason they could have made this "burger" the way it is is to allow more time to make different types of foodstuffs and let them catch up on some types of food that they have promised, but have yet to do in a "quick" faction. Some ingrediants need more of a balance before they are sold as well. Some combinations of flavor need to be tested to make sure it is competetive.

If you want to continue the food analogy...

[Drzombieface]

Can we stop using burger analogies, I'm on a diet and you're making me hungry.

[BigHoot]

Some people will eat any old lump of meat that gets served to them. I am a tad more picky than that. I am entitled to my opinion just as you are entitled to eat your kiddie-sized burger at the adult-sized price. I'm not "yelling at the manager" in any way. Of course I can "vote with my wallet". But yeah, actually I _have_ already paid for this burger under the pretense that it was at least as big as all of their other burgers. I feel I have been misled, and no, I don't have to shut up and eat it anyway.

[Drzombieface]

Some people will eat any old lump of meat that gets served to them. I am a tad more picky than that. I am entitled to my opinion just as you are entitled to eat your kiddie-sized burger at the adult-sized price. I'm not "yelling at the manager" in any way. Of course I can "vote with my wallet". But yeah, actually I _have_ already paid for this burger under the pretense that it was at least as big as all of their other burgers. I feel I have been misled, and no, I don't have to shut up and eat it anyway.

I still don't get why we're comparing food to a book.

[Billingsly]

First of all, the first four burgers you mention were on the old menu, before the place was completely remodeled and reopened with an all-new menu. They haven't served those burgers in years.

You know, if we're going to use your really shoddy analogy, I used to love the Pot Roast burger at Red Robin. Best sandwich I ever had. They don't serve it any more, their menu changed years ago. Did I stop going to Red Robin? No. Would I like to see it return? Of course? Do I mention that to the server? Sometimes. Do I carry on in front of all the other patrons about how Red Robin has wronged me? certainly not - I'm not an idiot.

By the way, have you seen it on the menu recently. Of course not - so what should that tell you?

If this book has really been such a horrible thing and offended you so greatly, then for crying out loud, don't buy it! But give it a rest already, would you?

Why do peoples complaints bother you so much? You seem quite aggravated by people who are upset or otherwise displeased. I mean its not like you went into this topic not knowing what it was going to be about. It says literally "I'm Disappointed" and we're on page 3 now are you surprised that people are commenting on their disappointment in this thread? If it bothers you don't read the thread. Instead perhaps read the one two or three down that says "thanks PP colossals is the awesome", unless of course you wanted to argue. Its not a fantastic release, IMO. It seems a little small and while the collasals are cool, I'm hardly wowed by them. I'm also not thrilled about evyros but I had a sneaking suspicion I wouldn't the moment I saw he was going to be on a horse. I am still excited for the next eiryss and other things that are down the road. Colossals, though, has no draw for me. I'm glad you're excited for the release. I'm not.

[HeadHunter]

Machine007, posts like yours make me wish there was a +rep button.

We could say that a 6 ounce filet mignon is smaller than a 12 ounce strip, so why is the price the same?
Some people don't mind what the new book contains, some people think it's fine, others expected something different and are trying to make it what it's not.
Perhaps they could have given us something new and flavorful that's just as big as the last thing we ordered here, but it would take a lot longer to cook. Some people may be willing to wait, but it wouldn't be fair to make everyone wait on their order until "yours" is prepared to "your" expecation, right?

[Drzombieface]

Why do peoples complaints bother you so much? You seem quite aggravated by people who are upset or otherwise displeased. I mean its not like you went into this topic not knowing what it was going to be about. It says literally "I'm Disappointed" and we're on page 3 now are you surprised that people are commenting on their disappointment in this thread? If it bothers you don't read the thread. Instead perhaps read the one two or three down that says "thanks PP colossals is the awesome", unless of course you wanted to argue. Its not a fantastic release, IMO. It seems a little small and while the collasals are cool, I'm hardly wowed by them. I'm also not thrilled about evyros but I had a sneaking suspicion I wouldn't the moment I saw he was going to be on a horse. I am still excited for the next eiryss and other things that are down the road. Colossals, though, has no draw for me. I'm glad you're excited for the release. I'm not.

What's bothering him(me/us/people who aren't QQ'ing) isn't the fact that people are QQ'ing in a QQ thread, it's that the QQ thread even exists in the first place, when all of the disappointment came purely from people's speculations and raised expectations about models that were almost certain to not be in the book. They chose to speculate, got their hopes up, and were disappointed. How that's PP's fault is beyond my level of thinking.

[Billingsly]

Machine007, posts like yours make me wish there was a +rep button.

We could say that a 6 ounce filet mignon is smaller than a 12 ounce strip, so why is the price the same?
Some people don't mind what the new book contains, some people think it's fine, others expected something different and are trying to make it what it's not.
Perhaps they could have given us something new and flavorful that's just as big as the last thing we ordered here, but it would take a lot longer to cook. Some people may be willing to wait, but it wouldn't be fair to make everyone wait on their order until "yours" is prepared to "your" expecation, right?

That analogy only works if you buy that colossals is of higher quality. I don't so now what? Ultimately this is an opinion so why are you so bent on arguing with people who don't share your own? Its not like poorly thought out analogies are going to sway people to your side. It just fuels the fire. If you're happy with the release be happy pre-order your colossal and 3rd lvl caster and post about how sweet they'll be in your upcoming games. Insisting that people should be as pleased as you are is just as obnoxious as people proclaiming the sky is falling.

[BigHoot]

For the record, I don't think the sky is falling. I just don't like the burger I got. I said I would keep coming back to Red Robin to get burgers in the future. It's just a burger, after all. But I don't have to like it.

[HeadHunter]

Why do peoples complaints bother you so much? You seem quite aggravated by people who are upset or otherwise displeased.

Not at all - I am simply astonished at the people who cannot grasp reason, and continue to bark up the wrong tree.
There's one of two things people can do here - buy the book, or don't. What is anyone hoping to accomplish with all the complaining?

Personally, I'm indifferent to the book - I don't plan on purchasing a Colossal any time soon, as the next $400-500 of my Warmachine spending is already planned. My issue is with the way complainers go about the whole thing.

I don't mind constructive criticism, I don't mind rational disagreement. But I'll remind you that this is a discussion forum. If people in this thread are just looking for a bunch of yes-men to stroke them, they've come to the wrong place. I'll continue to feel free to point out where their complaints ae founded on shakyt (or altogether absent) reasoning and remind them that no one else is responsible for meeting their expectations, however justified they may think them to be.

This whole thing has brought the crazies out of the woodwork. I've seen threads where people act like Colossals are going to kill the game, how there's not an army that could possibly stand up against them, and all variety of DOOOOM. If they put as much effort into finding ways to adapt, they'd be happier.

I suspect that this is a lot like life - the people who expect others to be responsible for providing happiness and satisfaction are those who tend to find life most unhappy and dissatisfying.

Fine, so people don't like the book. What are you going to DO about it?
Up to this point, the only thing I've seen is a lot of gum-flapping. What's that intended to accomplish?

That analogy only works if you buy that colossals is of higher quality. I don't so now what?

So don't buy it - or if you've prepaid, return it for a refund. What else would you do?

Its not like poorly thought out analogies are going to sway people to your side. It just fuels the fire.

I'm not the one who decided to make an analogy to burgers, but it looks like I've succeeded in pointing out how ridiculous the comparison is.

Insisting that people should be as pleased as you are is just as obnoxious as people proclaiming the sky is falling.

I'm insisting nothing of the sort. See what I mean about people who can't comprehend reason? I've already stated that you're free not to like it. What's "obnoxious" is that those people feel they have to complain to the rest of us. I'm not Privateer Press, take it up with them.

[Billingsly]

What's bothering him(me/us/people who aren't QQ'ing) isn't the fact that people are QQ'ing in a QQ thread, it's that the QQ thread even exists in the first place, when all of the disappointment came purely from people's speculations and raised expectations about models that were almost certain to not be in the book. They chose to speculate, got their hopes up, and were disappointed. How that's PP's fault is beyond my level of thinking.

I think thats fair. Except I will say that I'm not really impressed with Ret's colossal or Epic Vyros. So with PP generating all this excitement about their next big thing, I naturally got caught up in that excitement (I mean thats why they do it right?). When I found out what they were so excited about I felt a little let down. Now thats clearly partially my fault. I got caught up in the hype. Then again PP built a lot of hype for this book and for colossals so its not exactly an unforseen consequence. I think that is what people are upset about. You build up expectations with cool art a video introduction, sneak peaks at models and snippets of rules, but when you see the full picture and it doesn't live up to that hype its a bummer. Thats it. The sky isn't falling.

[BigHoot]

I can't tell what you're advocating? It sounds like you're saying that unless I'm willing to drive to Matt Wilson's house, slap him in the face, and take a whiz in his Wheaties that I'm not really entitled to my own opinions.

[In this post, pretend that Matt Wilson is the CEO of Red Robin. I would hate to break my analogy.]

[Vicomte Athos]

. . . beyond my level of thinking.

Here's your problem. You only care about your way of thinking and to others be damned.

If you don't like hearing people complain then don't read the thread. We are allowed to be unhappy and to voice that opinion. Whether you agree, understand or sympathize is irrelevant. If you don't like the complaints get out of the thread.