What will Khador never get?

[redwurm]

A Kossite caster or a Kossite unit attachment. I think they have become a lost cause.

[Humeriousdiscord]

I'll echo the sentiment that we will never get Lights.

Lock and load confirmed that Khador is getting light cav in the next book. It is greylord light cav. This was mentioned in the presentation by PP staff at the Friday night panel about 8:30.

[profparm]

I think he meant Light Jacks.

[HeroZero]

Mercy.
10 chars.

[Smiles]

Signs & Portents is what now? Chopped liver? Fortune also increase accuracy, though technically it's not "+X" to hit.

You seem to be the "king of semantics" What did I type? Don't bother answering, it's a rhetorical question. Is it completely necessary to dissect and, obviously wrongly, argue my point?

pIrusk has his feat that gives + to ranged and melee attacks. That is IT for straight addition to attack rolls. Signs and portents is a meagre boost to hit and damage, and is purely luck based. I like to deal in hard facts.

Non-rhetorical question for you; Would you take a +3 to hit, or an extra D6? How about a +2 to hit or an extra d6 take away the lowest?

[ralbas]

I'll echo the sentiment that we will never get Lights.

We are getting grey lord light cavalry though

[PG_Draxos]

You seem to be the "king of semantics" What did I type? Don't bother answering, it's a rhetorical question. Is it completely necessary to dissect and, obviously wrongly, argue my point?

pIrusk has his feat that gives + to ranged and melee attacks. That is IT for straight addition to attack rolls. Signs and portents is a meagre boost to hit and damage, and is purely luck based. I like to deal in hard facts.

Non-rhetorical question for you; Would you take a +3 to hit, or an extra D6? How about a +2 to hit or an extra d6 take away the lowest?

This seems similar the arguement between greylords and winter guard sprays.

[Octavius_Maximus]

Khador will never get Telekinesis, because Kayazy Exist.

[PG_ratch]

Khador will never get Telekinesis, because Kayazy Exist.

Oh how i want it.

However, i am of Wanting for a AK attachment or Kossite Attachment. they have such great potential just lack in the right spots that they are not mainstreamed very much at all. but alas, we will probably never seen them.

i would rather have a Static +3 over a D6 increase.

I honestly don't mind no Arc Node or No Light Jack. We are a Nation of Quality over Quantity. i am also not to worried about all the Bombards over a Ranged Platform. We are Khador, we don't play that ranged pansy game like our Cygnar neighbors =]

I am also quite excited for the new Light Cav. i am hoping that a Vlad3 list can support Cavalry lists =] if so, i would have a reason to buy Uhlans, Markov and maybe even Steelhead.

[Gladius]

A Kossite caster or a Kossite unit attachment. I think they have become a lost cause.

What are Kossites?

As everyone else has already said, we will never get arc nodes, light 'jacks, or a MoW UA/solo that buffs their armor or speed.

[scout's honor]

You seem to be the "king of semantics" What did I type? Don't bother answering, it's a rhetorical question. Is it completely necessary to dissect and, obviously wrongly, argue my point?

I wasn't exactly throwing down a gauntlet here, but I suppose that's an easily won title then. How am I arguing your point wrongly? We already have a spell that increases accuracy. It's not a straight +X where X is a fixed number, but it is clearly an accuracy buff. So how does that not indicate accuracy buffs for Khador are not completely out of the question?

Non-rhetorical question for you; Would you take a +3 to hit, or an extra D6? How about a +2 to hit or an extra d6 take away the lowest?

Extra d6 and +2 respectively. Extra d6 is +3.5 on average, extra d6 drop lowest is somewhere between +1.7 and +1.8 if you start with 2d6 and becomes progressively less the more dice you start with. You like to deal in hard facts, I like the long term numbers game as well as, in the case of extra dice that don't get dropped, the increased crit chance.

[LichLordVexing]

An actual widowmaker UA

I like the Widowmaker Marksman. Swift Hunter is awesome! Though, having Hunter would be better...

[Esper]

Anything better than what originated in mk. 1.

[KhaosSpectyr]

immunity to electricity. itd make nemo useless for cygnar.

[profparm]

Unless it was a UA for Assault Kommandos.

That would actually be really cool if they put out a total of 4 AK UAs (one for each element) that modified them in the manner the AK-equivalents got modded in the Borderlands Fort Knox expansion, making them immune to a certain type of element and specializing in it. (Where the Officer would give them Immunity: Whatever if they didn't have it, and the Standard would give them a special shot appropriate to that element.)

[Smiles]

I wasn't exactly throwing down a gauntlet here, but I suppose that's an easily won title then. How am I arguing your point wrongly? We already have a spell that increases accuracy. It's not a straight +X where X is a fixed number, but it is clearly an accuracy buff. So how does that not indicate accuracy buffs for Khador are not completely out of the question?

Using negatively directed comments "What is Signs and Portents, chopped liver?" Would suggest a standoff-ish manner. You could have easily said; I'm pretty sure Signs and Portents is a accuracy buff spell.

To which I would reply; I realize it is a buff spell, but that's not what I said. A straight addition.

Extra d6 and +2 respectively. Extra d6 is +3.5 on average, extra d6 drop lowest is somewhere between +1.7 and +1.8 if you start with 2d6 and becomes progressively less the more dice you start with. You like to deal in hard facts, I like the long term numbers game as well as, in the case of extra dice that don't get dropped, the increased crit chance.

So, by your mathematical equation, +2 IS better than an additional d6 drop the lowest (unless, of course, you have a boost in the mix) As for an additional d6 to +3, sure, the numbers game would state that odds are you get more out of the d6. Have you ever boosted an attack roll when you need a 6 to hit? How about a 5? Odds are you would hit that target without the boost. Why would you boost?

And Crits were never apart of the basic equation. Of course an additional die is better in the case of chance critical.

I await your Last Word.

[philipcryx]

What will Khador never get?

Any love on these Forums. LOL

[philipcryx]

Unless it was a UA for Assault Kommandos.

That would actually be really cool if they put out a total of 4 AK UAs (one for each element) that modified them in the manner the AK-equivalents got modded in the Borderlands Fort Knox expansion, making them immune to a certain type of element and specializing in it. (Where the Officer would give them Immunity: Whatever if they didn't have it, and the Standard would give them a special shot appropriate to that element.)

AK would be worth buying if they got any sort of UA...

[PG_Draxos]

What will Khador never get?

Any love on these Forums. LOL

Hey! I love my faction and proudly represent that!

[scout's honor]

Using negatively directed comments "What is Signs and Portents, chopped liver?" Would suggest a standoff-ish manner. You could have easily said; I'm pretty sure Signs and Portents is a accuracy buff spell.

To which I would reply; I realize it is a buff spell, but that's not what I said. A straight addition.

If it offended you, I'll readily apologize - it wasn't intended to be negative and, to be honest, it still doesn't seem that way to me. As for it not being a straight addition, while I'm sure it makes a difference for you to me the simple fact that an accuracy buff spell exists in Khador (and arguably it's a signature spell for the faction) is plenty of evidence PP has no absolute qualms with giving something like that to us. Why would you expect we will never ever get another accuracy buff spell? And if an accuracy buff spell is a possibility, why would a straight addition to attack rolls not be?

So, by your mathematical equation, +2 IS better than an additional d6 drop the lowest (unless, of course, you have a boost in the mix) As for an additional d6 to +3, sure, the numbers game would state that odds are you get more out of the d6. Have you ever boosted an attack roll when you need a 6 to hit? How about a 5? Odds are you would hit that target without the boost. Why would you boost?

And Crits were never apart of the basic equation. Of course an additional die is better in the case of chance critical.

We're not talking about boosts. We're talking about a buff spell. How are boosts relevant (for the record: I have boosted rolls where I only needed a 5 to hit - if missing, despite the odds, would put me in a bad position and and I don't need the focus more elsewhere I'll definitely boost)? Other than that, whether +2 is better than +1d6 drop lowest is pretty much irrelevant. If PP can live with S&P in our faction, I'm sure they can live with a straight addition accuracy buff as well. It's just a matter of making sure it can't be abused.

As for crits, you asked what I'd prefer and I told you, with reasons why. Increased crit chances matter. I'd love for the Crit Knockdown on my IFP to happen a little more often, aside from them not being quite as accurate as I'd like.

[philipcryx]

Hey! I love my faction and proudly represent that!

LOL I know it was a joke, I love Khador...my name was made when i was a cryx fan but after i bought pbutcher my love grew 10 fold..

[Revamp]

anastasia di Bray or anything else that has espionage... <=[ i want espionage on an old witch feat turn with the collossal out there!

[Smiles]

If it offended you, I'll readily apologize - it wasn't intended to be negative and, to be honest, it still doesn't seem that way to me. As for it not being a straight addition, while I'm sure it makes a difference for you to me the simple fact that an accuracy buff spell exists in Khador (and arguably it's a signature spell for the faction) is plenty of evidence PP has no absolute qualms with giving something like that to us. Why would you expect we will never ever get another accuracy buff spell? And if an accuracy buff spell is a possibility, why would a straight addition to attack rolls not be?

If that were true, why do we not have a straight addition to Rat or Mat? That's fine though. Signs and Portents on one caster will suffice.

We're not talking about boosts. We're talking about a buff spell. How are boosts relevant (for the record: I have boosted rolls where I only needed a 5 to hit - if missing, despite the odds, would put me in a bad position and and I don't need the focus more elsewhere I'll definitely boost)? Other than that, whether +2 is better than +1d6 drop lowest is pretty much irrelevant. If PP can live with S&P in our faction, I'm sure they can live with a straight addition accuracy buff as well. It's just a matter of making sure it can't be abused.

Unfortunately, Signs and Portents is, though not in spell form, making its way into Menoth. Intercessor Kreoss and his Exemplar Cav have their own version of SNP.

As for crits, you asked what I'd prefer and I told you, with reasons why. Increased crit chances matter. I'd love for the Crit Knockdown on my IFP to happen a little more often, aside from them not being quite as accurate as I'd like.[/QUOTE]

Unfortunately SnP doesn't really help with Crits. Infact it pisses me off when I throw a crit, but have to take away one of the two lowest dice. Everyone will cast a buff spell to roll an additional d6 on a unit with a crit. That was never in question.

Honestly, just keep doing what you're doing. And as I expect you to do what you do. There for I'll assume you're going to make your final statement, hopefully.

[scout's honor]

If that were true, why do we not have a straight addition to Rat or Mat?

Are you asking me to hazard a guess? All I'm saying is that we have an accuracy buff: ergo, accuracy buffs for Khador are not a no-no for PP. We've only had three completely new casters since Mk II for which we know what they do (counting Vlad3), and while they're not the same thing Zerkova has a DEF debuff and Harkevich has an attack reroll spell - two spells that make it easier to hit enemy models. The existing roster we started Mk II with had spells more or less corresponding with what they had in Mk I.

Unfortunately, Signs and Portents is, though not in spell form, making its way into Menoth. Intercessor Kreoss and his Exemplar Cav have their own version of SNP.

Sure. Still a signature spell for us though.

[Theorythmus]

If that were true, why do we not have a straight addition to Rat or Mat? That's fine though. Signs and Portents on one caster will suffice.

Not that it's a straight addition to MAT for everything, but do remember we have 2 casters with superiority and apart from other buffs it gives +2 MAT to the jack it's casted on.

On topic,
I'm pretty certain we'll not be seeing light jacks in other manners then tier lists, specific caster attachments or something akin to the league upgrade that allows Khador to take Bashers. Who's to say there won't be any leagues where we could get a merc light jack through an upgrade?
Another thing I'm quite certain we'll never see is a form of snipe, i.e. a bonus to the distance we can shoot (unless on a specific league model, just to make us angry that we can't take it all the time )

[@Kriegsspiele]

A UA of Gallowswood.

[Raff]

Also, beard-wielding colossals....

Someone photoshop this. Now.

[The Buoyancy of Water]

I agree with Snipe not being available to us. Our arcing fire threats are already high enough, we start getting silly with Snipe. Behemoth + Snipe = 25" arcing fire bombards...

Cheers,
Dave

[Tossy]

Someone photoshop this. Now.

You rang...

[profparm]

you rang...

Yes!

And now, nothing can stop us!!! Noooottttthhhhhiiiiiiiiiinnnnnngggggggg!!!!!

Edit: Except for possibly moved or deleted photos. D'OH!

[PG_Draxos]

Tossy, that's pretty damn awesome. Saving to my desktop.

[Viss]

Both our Sorcha's would love an arc node. Both Irusk's as well. Being able to buff from the node is what Khador would love. We would be able to keep our Casters further back and much safer.

we have this sort of arc node - it's called "leave one man behind" (or closer to caster than to officier) :-D

one friend of mine (i'd played most games with him) who plays cygnar called this once, in a game played, as an "khador arc node" and i like this... it's funny and true as axe2face :-D

[KhaosSpectyr]

wait what?

[Tyr852]

It's called rubber banding as well , you leave 1 model of a unit by the caster so that way when you buff that one model it buffs the entire unit it belongs too even if they are 1/2 way across the board. The reason it works is because an advance is anywhere from 0 to full so you can choose to have that model move 0" to get back in formation.

It's also very very cheesy.

[The Buoyancy of Water]

Why does the model need to be out of formation for this to work? You don't need to rubber band at all. Let's take kayazy with underboss:

Lead kayazy is within 9 of underboss, plus about an inch from the base, putting the front of the underboss about 10 inches from the front line of the unit. Then there's an inch for the underbosses base, then another 9 inches to the rearmost kayazy, who again adds another inch(ish) for the base. Finally, the caster is within 6 inches of the rearmost kayazy (assuming one of our many 6 inch buff spells). This means the front of the casters base can be up to 27 inches from the front of your lines, with no rubber band nonsense.

Cheers,
Dave

[Tyr852]

That works as well same idea but less cheesy , you just lose a second unit to maintain that chain because as in your example the underboss even with charge won't get in to combat all the time as it's near the limit of his threat range , also will quickly turn in to rubber banding if the middle link is sniped but I agree there is much less cheddar methods to it.

[toebeeone]

Snipe because of widowmakers

[Wisible]

You rang...

Someone PLEASE mod this when they get a Conquest and bring it to a tourney! And take pictures! I'd do it myself but I don't go to tournies or want a Conquest.