35 point Hardcore - which caster should I be looking at?

[PG_DaveZee]

I am trying to prep for a 35 point Hardcore tournament in September. Because I have some painting to do, and not a ton of time to do it, I would like to get my list set before I start filling in the painting gaps. I own the following casters:
Gorten
Durgen
Damiano
MacBain
Shae
Bart

What order would you put these casters, in terms of Hardcore tournament effectiveness?

[baronvonchaos]

Hardcore tournament with timed turns yes?

If No, take whomever you want. All our casters do well with the right lists. Damiano with full steelhead compliment. Macbain with an assault force. Fiona with a couple tricksy models/units. Bart with Galleon(s). Shae and the Pirate's Life Tier list. Magnus and whatever... eMagnus Bad seeds.

If Yes, 1) train with timed turns. It's amazing how fast 10 minutes goes. Sometimes you dilly dally over things like shae's feat turn (me) and take forever to move everything. etc. 2) Take as few troops as you're comfortable with. Avoid mass amounts of AOE's (Ogrun Assault Corps unless you CRA). Straight foward face smashing will get you further than if you try and run 2-3 units and a bunch of solos (Shae's Pirate's Life). I tend to lose these tournaments only because I run out of time and bugger my activations with models/units that don't even get to activate.

[PG_DaveZee]

Yep, it's timed turns.

Shae would be tough doing timed turns, and Durgen, between primed and a ton of aoes, would be tough, too.

I like MacBain with Kayazy and Nyss, Sylys and a couple jacks, along with a few other support solos.

Damiano could work, too, although I have only played him at 50. He definitely runs more unit heavy, tho.

Gorten, with thor and a bunch of jacks might work.

Bart? prolly not.

[PG_Salix060907]

Bart with Galleon??? That could work. Add in Wrong Eye for a second heavy. That would be my choice if it were up to me.

[PG_DaveZee]

I don't think Galleon will be out before I need it, and no proxying in an official event.

[LiamPiver]

Gorten works well in Hardcore. He's one of the few casters that can actually win by scenario or threaten the opponent with killbox so he forces a certain type of play.

I've had really good luck with this:

Gorten
Basher 7
Blaster 3
Rorsch 9
-Brine
Aiyanna and Holt 4
Max Nyss 10
Thor 2
-Basher 7

You're not using a ton of infantry to kill time. You can CRA if you need too in order to really maximize time. You're always threatening with feat. The Bashers allow focus camping so Gorten doesn't have to do much a turn but charge/run for positioning. The Nyss can take zones, threaten some big damage on charges, and even do good damage with single shots if you Kiss something with Aiyanna. She also has an answer for incorp models with giving the Nyss all Magic Weapons. The Nyss also make it so you're not reliant on Saxon or Rhupert for Pathfinder. Thor is just fantastic in this list as he can affect all the jacks and if he dies the Basher is still somewhat effective all by itself.

This list can even do significant damage to a Collosal. A tuned up, SoG Basher with Kiss on the Collosal is doing a PS 21 punch for 3d6 and he can make 4 of these attacks, plus you could get lucky on the flack field for a few damage. That's likely going to cripple most systems and potentially save him from being wrecked in the retaliation. Gorten can also hose a colossal's movement with both his feat and his rock wall since they can't charge past the thing (from lack of movement, they have built in pathfinder so that's not a problem).

Shae's feat isn't that bad if you use a lot of jacks with him.

Durgen's fine in Hardcore too. I actually think he's the best at 50.

I wouldn't run Bad Seeds at 35, but Magnus1's feat can actually do some good stuff for CPs at 35.

Damiano is fine but you should run him with Gun Mages to make sure you can deal with stealth if you're doing hardcore or you'll have some issues with Banes.

[MagnustheJust]

This MacBain!! list was one that I used to great effect, and we were using 10-minute timed turn. It's relatively low on the model count, almost no AoE's, fast, and can bring the pain that the Mustache Express is known for!! Feel free to use or abuse it as you see fit...


MacBain!! {+6}
~Nomad - 0{6}
Mangler - 8

Reinholdt - 1
Saxon Orrik - 2
Eiryss1 - 3
Stannis - 4

min Kayazy Assassins - 5
~ Underboss - 2
max Nyss Hunters - 10

[PG_DaveZee]

This MacBain!! list was one that I used to great effect, and we were using 10-minute timed turn. It's relatively low on the model count, almost no AoE's, fast, and can bring the pain that the Mustache Express is known for!! Feel free to use or abuse it as you see fit...


MacBain!! {+6}
~Nomad - 0{6}
Mangler - 8

Reinholdt - 1
Saxon Orrik - 2
Eiryss1 - 3
Stannis - 4

min Kayazy Assassins - 5
~ Underboss - 2
max Nyss Hunters - 10

I am liking this list alot, except for Stannis. While he is great with Damiano and a compliment of Steelheads, I am not sure he is worth the points by himself. Maybe A&H, or Rhupert and Ragman, or even drop Reinholdt and add Thor and a Gunner or Blaster?

[MagnustheJust]

I have had crazy good results using him alone as a flanker and zone taker, as well as a solo hunter or character trio remover.

Your results may vary. See your doctor if headache or nausea persists.

[mikethefish]

I'd almost even want to take Bull & Blythe in that list, personally. They could perhaps shine in that environment.

[MagnustheJust]

Well... like I said, feel free to use or abuse it how you want, if you want to.

Oh, added caveat - this was my anti-Hordes list for the last tourney I won back in December.

[moorg]

Damiano double Cavalry Assualt abusing shenanigans!

[PG_DaveZee]

Damiano double Cavalry Assualt abusing shenanigans!

While fun, I think that is too great of a financial hit for me.

[moorg]

While fun, I think that is too great of a financial hit for me.

Awwww.... Guess I don't have a second unit of Steelhead Cavalry either.

Bart Batten Jack Brick! Mangler's for anti infantry Thresher fun, and Nomads for being cheap and effective. Spam Batten until stuff is in charge range, then go for the kill!

[mosez]

a while ago i had fun and even some success with the following list. it has a low model count, so all models can be activated reasonable fast:

drake (+6)
* nomad (6)
* mule (8)
* vanguard (5)
thor (2)
* basher (7)
wronge eye (9)
* snapjaw
aiyanna & holt (4)

it uses macbain!!! as toolbox caster, but uses other tools than many other lists. my main spells were usually
* failsafe, often on the vanguard to run him into the fray. with failsafe up he's def15/arm21 against charges, which is often quite a pita... and takes a while to get rid of him
* energizer and jackhammer, gives all battlegroup jacks something like a second activation. either before or after the proper activation.

the fun of this list is that it is rather fast and has several interesting angles it can come from.

kill condition was often like that: slam something with the basher over the caster, activate aiyanna to cast kiss on him, run the nomad in. jackhammer caster to death. often the opponent does not see that coming, as it has quite a threat range.

the list can also deal reasonable well with infantry, with almost everything having reach, the mule's aoe4 cannon, the crocs eating warriors for breakfast and the basher's flakfield. holt can also plink off a few annoying low arm models - either leftovers from units or solos...

drake's feat can be used in the turn of the pushforward to protect wrongeye, a&h and thor. it's not even enough models that you would need focus on him, as all of them can be toughed anyway, so focus can be given freely to the jacks that turn... but most often also used for energizer to increase my range...

maybe the list does not look that good on paper, but on the table its incredibly fun and hits quite hard

[PG_DaveZee]

Verified last night that I lack the ability to play Tier 3 Shae under Hardcore time restraints. The list worked great, and I tabled 3mo, but was over time on the first two turns.

[baronvonchaos]

Love Shae. Quite competitive. Sucks on timed turns... 12 min turns I can do. I am learning his synergies though.