Bomber with "Hoof It"

[Arden]

I'm running the pGrissel list below at 25pts and now it's time to take it to 50pts. I would really like some kind of a ranged threat. I absolutely love the Bomber. The only downside to the Bomber, that I see, is his lackluster range of 8. My first thought was to add an Impaler for the +4 range but I'm not to excited about sacrificing any other model on the list to make room for him. I'm thinking that the Bomber would be great with Grissels fell call "Hoof It" as it would give him some much needed range. Well, artificial range anyway. I would activate Grissel and during her activation put "Hoof It" on the Bomber. During the Bombers activation I would walk him towards the target his normal 5" throw a few bombs down range then at the end of my turn retreat the Bomber back 5" to where he started from effectively giving the Bomber a range of 13". Am I missing something here because this tactic seems as though this would work without a hitch... Is "Hoof It" a good enough substitution for the Impaler??? Thoughts please, Thanks

25points

Grissel (+5)
Earthborn Dire Troll (10)
Dire Troll Mauler (9)
*MIN*Kriel Warriors- 1 leader & 5 grunts (4)
Caber Throwers x2 (2)
Janissa Stonetide (3)
Minion Solo (2)
a) against Circle and Legion: Lanyssa Ryssyll
b) against all other factions: Viktor Pendrake



50 points

Grissel (+5)
Earthborn Dire Troll (10)
Dire Troll Bomber (10)
Dire Troll Mauler (9)
*MIN*Kriel Warriors- 1 leader & 5 grunts (4)
Caber Throwers x3 (3)
Janissa Stonetide (3)
Horthol Long Rider Hero (5)
*MIN* Long Riders (7)
Lanyssa Ryssyll (2)
Viktor Pendrake (2)

[PG_thegreatblah]

IN case you didn't already have it above 'though it appears you do' Hoof it triggers after 'everything' has activated so Grissel can put it on the Bomber after he has moved, but the Bomber can't move back until everything else in your army has finished activating.

Also if this tactic is good with a Bomber RNG of 8, it is only that much better at a RNG of 12

[Grim Wingus]

Yeah. That makes sense. The only things I'd say would be
1) you'll miss out on the standing still to aim bonus, which the bomber could really do with sometimes, and
2) those Kriel Warriors might get jealous if Ms Griss is buffing just the beast (not a problem in feat turn, of course)

[Arden]

Thanks Grim both of your points are legit. I think it's worth the K.W.'s getting their feelings hurt to send some Bomber nastiness down range! HAHA

[Beckman]

Yeah. That makes sense. The only things I'd say would be
1) you'll miss out on the standing still to aim bonus, which the bomber could really do with sometimes

If you have a 12" shooting range with Snipe and your enemy walks into it, you can surely aim, shoot, then hoof-it backwards with a little help from Grissel.

[Arden]

What would you sacrifice from my list to fit an Impaler in?

50 points

Grissel (+5)
Earthborn Dire Troll (10)
Dire Troll Bomber (10)
Dire Troll Mauler (9)
*MIN*Kriel Warriors- 1 leader & 5 grunts (4)
Caber Throwers x3 (3)
Janissa Stonetide (3)
Horthol Long Rider Hero (5)
*MIN* Long Riders (7)
Lanyssa Ryssyll (2)
Viktor Pendrake (2)

[Grim Wingus]

If you have a 12" shooting range with Snipe and your enemy walks into it, you can surely aim, shoot, then hoof-it backwards with a little help from Grissel.

Also true.

[Beckman]

What would you sacrifice from my list to fit an Impaler in?

50 points

Grissel (+5)
Earthborn Dire Troll (10)
Dire Troll Bomber (10)
Dire Troll Mauler (9)
*MIN*Kriel Warriors- 1 leader & 5 grunts (4)
Caber Throwers x3 (3)
Janissa Stonetide (3)
Horthol Long Rider Hero (5)
*MIN* Long Riders (7)
Lanyssa Ryssyll (2)
Viktor Pendrake (2)

That's a tough question. Probably Lanyssa Ryssyll in order to max your Kriel Warriors, and your EBDT in order to gain an Impaler, and max your Long Riders, and Janissa in order to get KSB+SSE with the extra point. That way you still have some assassination protection that you would have had from the wall. Alternately, you could swamp gobbers with the extra point.

The list you have is fine, I WOULD probably cut Lanyssa regardless, I don't think she is particularly strong. And I don't think the Bomber is a necessity for Grissel, but it can work fine with or without an impaler. I think you're verging on a little beast heavy, which is why I would not cut infantry for your Impaler. I don't think that two melee heavies is necessarily bad with your list, you have enough stuff to tie enemies up, although you have no speed buff, you will hit like a ton of bricks. If you just fielded more infantry, you might struggle with the higher armor stuff a little more. The way you currently have your list configured you have less jamming potential, but more ability to deal with harder targets.

[Arden]

That's a tough question. Probably Lanyssa Ryssyll in order to max your Kriel Warriors, and your EBDT in order to gain an Impaler, and max your Long Riders, and Janissa in order to get KSB+SSE with the extra point. That way you still have some assassination protection that you would have had from the wall. Alternately, you could swamp gobbers with the extra point.

The list you have is fine, I WOULD probably cut Lanyssa regardless, I don't think she is particularly strong. And I don't think the Bomber is a necessity for Grissel, but it can work fine with or without an impaler. I think you're verging on a little beast heavy, which is why I would not cut infantry for your Impaler. I don't think that two melee heavies is necessarily bad with your list, you have enough stuff to tie enemies up, although you have no speed buff, you will hit like a ton of bricks. If you just fielded more infantry, you might struggle with the higher armor stuff a little more. The way you currently have your list configured you have less jamming potential, but more ability to deal with harder targets.

Hmmmmmmm, does this sound better??? I cut the Mauler because the Slags animus is +2 to damage rolls (in lieu of the +3 to str that the Mauler offers)


50 points

Grissel (+5)
Earthborn Dire Troll (10)
Dire Troll Bomber (10)
Troll Impaler (5)
Slag Troll (6)
*MIN*Kriel Warriors- 1 leader & 5 grunts (4)
Caber Throwers x3 (3)
Janissa Stonetide (3)
Horthol Long Rider Hero (5)
*MIN* Long Riders (7)
Viktor Pendrake (2)

[Beckman]

Hmmmmmmm, does this sound better??? I cut the Mauler because the Slags animus is +2 to damage rolls (in lieu of the +3 to str that the Mauler offers)


50 points

Grissel (+5)
Earthborn Dire Troll (10)
Dire Troll Bomber (10)
Troll Impaler (5)
Slag Troll (6)
*MIN*Kriel Warriors- 1 leader & 5 grunts (4)
Caber Throwers x3 (3)
Janissa Stonetide (3)
Horthol Long Rider Hero (5)
*MIN* Long Riders (7)
Viktor Pendrake (2)

Yeah, I can dig that. Threatens Knockdown and Bombs, has calamity to pierce armor. You're a little light on model count, but you've got a great secondary ranged game. You can really soften up enemies beforehand. Your Bomber can pull double duty by trading with enemy heavies with Calmity and slag buff.. You've got a classic beast wall with Janissa and EBDT, and some good support shooting with the Slag...

Make sure to position the EBDT just right for Hallowed Avenger so that you can charge out over your own wall at just the right time when a KW bites the big one. That can really frag up your opponent's turn, if they haven't allocated focus to a Jack, and suddenly you're in their grill. Or if they have beasts, but they've already activated them and you're like, "Hi! I'm now in charge range of you. Good Luck! Hope you're looking forward to being my lunch next turn!"

I love Long Riders + Horthol, but it's a shame you can only fit min + Horthol in. I'm on the fence as to whether to keep them in or take them out, but I definately like your beast loadout, so I wouldn't change what you have there, and your support is super solid.

Remember that the cabers can't CMA in order to knock people down and drop bombs/slag them up, since they do not have CMA on their weapons.

[Arden]

Yeah, I can dig that. Threatens Knockdown and Bombs, has calamity to pierce armor. You're a little light on model count, but you've got a great secondary ranged game. You can really soften up enemies beforehand. Your Bomber can pull double duty by trading with enemy heavies with Calmity and slag buff.. You've got a classic beast wall with Janissa and EBDT, and some good support shooting with the Slag...

Make sure to position the EBDT just right for Hallowed Avenger so that you can charge out over your own wall at just the right time when a KW bites the big one. That can really frag up your opponent's turn, if they haven't allocated focus to a Jack, and suddenly you're in their grill. Or if they have beasts, but they've already activated them and you're like, "Hi! I'm now in charge range of you. Good Luck! Hope you're looking forward to being my lunch next turn!"

I love Long Riders + Horthol, but it's a shame you can only fit min + Horthol in. I'm on the fence as to whether to keep them in or take them out, but I definately like your beast loadout, so I wouldn't change what you have there, and your support is super solid.

Remember that the cabers can't CMA in order to knock people down and drop bombs/slag them up, since they do not have CMA on their weapons.

Thanks for all of your imput. The cabers are almost not fair when used to lend their POW to the E.B.D.T. That is a +4 POW to the Earthborn and all you have to do is get the caber in his melee range. Put the Slags animus on the Earthborn and cast calamity and that's a P+S 23 with corrosion continuous affect!!!! HEEEEEEERE JACKIE, JACKIE, JACKIE

[EvilFuzzyDoom]

I concur with the advice to remove the EBDT. Grissel likes a heavy or two, but is probably going to get uncomfortably short on Fury with three.

[PG_machine007]

I would also considering taking out Pendrake. Its a tough call. I'd almost want to take Saxon over him because your list seriously lacks pathfinder.

[Arden]

I would also considering taking out Pendrake. Its a tough call. I'd almost want to take Saxon over him because your list seriously lacks pathfinder.

Hmmmmmm, the lack of pathfinder will be a problem. I can remove Victor and 1 caber thrower and throw the Fell Call Hero in (I already have a Fell Caller all painted up). I find that when I use him on the flank as a dedicated Long Rider/Horthol buffer he doesn't get in Grissels way as most of the time they end up out of her 9" CMD range anyway. I think that the Long Riders and Horthol on one flank with pathfinder and the Earthborn on the other side with pathfinder is a scary thought.

It would look like this:
50 points

Grissel (+5)
Earthborn Dire Troll (10)
Dire Troll Bomber (10)
Troll Impaler (5)
Slag Troll (6)
*MIN*Kriel Warriors- 1 leader & 5 grunts (4)
Caber Throwers x2 (2)
Janissa Stonetide (3)
Horthol Long Rider Hero (5)
*MIN* Long Riders (7)
Fell Caller Hero (3)

[Arden]

I concur with the advice to remove the EBDT. Grissel likes a heavy or two, but is probably going to get uncomfortably short on Fury with three.

I hesitate to get rid of the EBDT as I can get rid of the Mauler instead and replace him with the Slag who does almost as well as the Mauler when buffing with his animus.

[PG_Mr. Mayhem]

I'd keep this list:

Grissel (+5)
Earthborn Dire Troll (10)
Dire Troll Bomber (10)
Troll Impaler (5)
Slag Troll (6)
*MIN*Kriel Warriors- 1 leader & 5 grunts (4)
Caber Throwers x3 (3)
Janissa Stonetide (3)
Horthol Long Rider Hero (5)
*MIN* Long Riders (7)
Viktor Pendrake (2)

and swap Pendrake for some Whelps, as I'm of the mind to keep the Earthborn, but agree that you need some fury management. Don't forget you can cast Rift on/near the EBDT to give it the SPD bonus.

I also concur that making room for Saxon is a good idea.

[Arden]

I'd keep this list:



and swap Pendrake for some Whelps, as I'm of the mind to keep the Earthborn, but agree that you need some fury management. Don't forget you can cast Rift on/near the EBDT to give it the SPD bonus.

I also concur that making room for Saxon is a good idea.

Rift is an offensive spell and as such must be cast on a target... correct??? I'm still very new to the game and find it very hard to set up the rift for the Earthborn to benefit from as the EBDT must "begin it's activation within 2" of rough terrain" to gain +2 SPD. So if I choose a target and hit it with Rift It must be within 4" of the EBDT (2" that the Earthborn requires+half of the 4" AOE) for it to benefit him. Why would I need +2 to speed if the enemy model is only 4" away?

[Cleavelander]

Target the Earthborn, or target an enemy that happens to be close to the Earthborn and use his enhanced movement to get to something further away.

[Beckman]

Thanks for all of your imput. The cabers are almost not fair when used to lend their POW to the E.B.D.T. That is a +4 POW to the Earthborn and all you have to do is get the caber in his melee range. Put the Slags animus on the Earthborn and cast calamity and that's a P+S 23 with corrosion continuous affect!!!! HEEEEEEERE JACKIE, JACKIE, JACKIE

I strongly advise you to at least try a couple games with the list that you came up with:

Grissel (+5)
Earthborn Dire Troll (10)
Dire Troll Bomber (10)
Troll Impaler (5)
Slag Troll (6)
*MIN*Kriel Warriors- 1 leader & 5 grunts (4)
Caber Throwers x3 (3)
Janissa Stonetide (3)
Horthol Long Rider Hero (5)
*MIN* Long Riders (7)
Viktor Pendrake (2)

I think it's a great balanced list. You might get some more performance out of it by cutting the EBDT, but it's got a lot of good points.

1. It's got a really nice secondary ranged game. You can force some lists to come to you. It's good enough that "walk up in Janissa Brick and shoot bombs" is a gameplan against some lists.
2. You've got two Heavies that can trade with enemy heavies if you slap Calamity on them.
3. The Earthborn is fully capable of wrecking another heavy or your opponent's caster if they get sloppy, or you suprise them with a good Hallowed Avenger. Also, if you keep it in reserve as a countercharge unit, it can kill any heavy jacks that assail the Bomber or your other stuff.
4. Your list has a decent tar pit, and some Cav to back it up.

Edit: Whelps/Pendrake/Saxon are all good choices for those 2 points.

[PG_Mr. Mayhem]

What he said. If you find room for Whelps they can make good targets, but if you're playing against Hordes and plan to charge/kill a beast, targeting your undamaged Earthborn (or technically any Dire Troll/thing with snacking) and damaging it will allow it to snack on it's victim, letting you remove the fury on it (also works if you just really want to RFP a living model).

While perhaps not the most economical way to spend your fury, keep in mind you can use it to speed up other models as well. If you really need that key Long Rider to be able to move just a bit more to get off that slam, move a Rift target within 3-4" of him (not in front :P ) and animi him up. If you can find room for Saxon all the better, as you won't have to avoid the rough patch.

[PG_somnicide]

Yeah remember that you can target models out of range with AOE effects and it will drift. You can also target friendly models with any effects that don't specify otherwise. If you are worried because your EBDT is already wounded you can run a whelp over there next to it or something else and target that instead. Even if you hit the whelp the half damage on the EBDT will not likely do anything.

edited my Mr. Mayhem! it does bear mentioning that you can't spawn whelps with friendly damage.

[Arden]

The Rift spell has a POW of 13, so on an average 2d6 roll of 7 (3.5 each die) that's a total of 20 damage. With an ARM of 18 the EBDT would only be damaged by 2, and if he's near an obstacle or obstruction he gets +2 ARM and wouldn't be damaged at all!!! Even if the Earthborn is damaged by 3 or 4 he has regeneration and can heal back d3 the next turn. I like this strategy although it seems funny to bomb your own friendly model! I guess a little damage is a small price to pay for another 2"..... of movement that is. HaHa

[Beckman]

The Rift spell has a POW of 13, so on an average 2d6 roll of 7 (3.5 each die) that's a total of 20 damage. With an ARM of 18 the EBDT would only be damaged by 2, and if he's near an obstacle or obstruction he gets +2 ARM and wouldn't be damaged at all!!! Even if the Earthborn is damaged by 3 or 4 he has regeneration and can heal back d3 the next turn. I like this strategy although it seems funny to bomb your own friendly model! I guess a little damage is a small price to pay for another 2"..... of movement that is. HaHa

You'll find that a lot of the time the amount of damage that you have on your beast simply does not matter. Since you can heal your beast before activating it, it isn't a big deal to heal it beforehand. The only time it really matters is when you need the 1 FURY that it would cost to regenerate lost aspects, or if a free strike could take out Spirit. It's likely that if your opponent wants to take out your model and charges it with weaponmasters or a 'Jack, the 2 boxes will probably not be the difference between surviving or not (although sometimes it is :P).

[Arden]

Yeh, that's what I'm thinkin too. Pretty excited about this list although I'm having Mauler withdrawls, aside from the Long Riders and Horthol, the Mauler is my favorite model!

[PG_thegreatblah]

I like this strategy although it seems funny to bomb your own friendly model! . HaHa

Remember this always, as a Troll player you will more often than you realize use your own models as target practice to kill an enemy, whether it is with an AOE, spray, Slam or Throw. Our medium based infantry rolls through their small bases with ease and is usually much easier to hit.

[Beckman]

Yeh, that's what I'm thinkin too. Pretty excited about this list although I'm having Mauler withdrawls, aside from the Long Riders and Horthol, the Mauler is my favorite model!

The Mauler is a great model, and the Dire Troll Mauler Extreme Sculpt is one of the game's best looking pieces, imo.

I used to really not like the Mauler's game rules... But they really grew on me. I found that if I took the Mauler and an Axer or some other stuff, I could spend the rest of my list dealing with non-heavy targets, since the Mauler is great at killing enemy heavies. Since we have medium based infantry, we can bog down the opponent for the heavies to finish the job.