Dunk Tank Viability?

[johntoenjes]

So when dealing with 'Jacks, it seems to easy way out is to have BB cast Swamp Pit next to one, and have the Wrastler two-hand throw it in at point blank range. Is this as easy as it sounds or am I missing something?

[mattausten]

What happens if said jack is a leviathan (or the other cryx one) and the talion charter ones?



Cheers
Matt

[MagnustheJust]

I prefer the slam into the swamp pits personally...

As for the amphibious warjacks -

Just whack 'em!!

They are squishier than their non-amphibious counterparts...

[johntoenjes]

Isn't it harder to line up a pit behind a unit to slam them into? Also, does amphibious protect against engine failure if knocked down? I apologize if thats not how the engine failure works, I'm at work and don't have a rulebook handy

[Benejeseret]

Minor point, but I believe you will need a 1-handed throw the way it is worded. 2-handed throws need a target and cannot target a "space" or terrain. 1h then deviate as per usual and with minimal distance they will usually go where you want due to the 1/2 distance rule. All it means is that you cannot "hit" the swamp, just deviate into.

[thag-rush]

Minor point, but I believe you will need a 1-handed throw the way it is worded. 2-handed throws need a target and cannot target a "space" or terrain. 1h then deviate as per usual and with minimal distance they will usually go where you want due to the 1/2 distance rule. All it means is that you cannot "hit" the swamp, just deviate into.

You can 2-Handed throw in a direction, but it scatters as a 1-H throw does. You can of course sit a feralgeist in the swamp as a homing beacon.

[johntoenjes]

Can't you just throw to a location one inch away so it can only deviate half an inch and not make it out of the swamp?

[PG_Dmark]

Isn't it harder to line up a pit behind a unit to slam them into? Also, does amphibious protect against engine failure if knocked down? I apologize if thats not how the engine failure works, I'm at work and don't have a rulebook handy

First off, the Leviathan, Harrower and Desecrator can't be knocked down in the first place. They're steady. And yes, Amphibious excludes they entire engine failure thing. Amphibious specifically states that it ignores the effects of deep and shallow water. This is why I love the Crab 'jacks as a Cryx player. They are just so awesome.

[johntoenjes]

First off, the Leviathan, Harrower and Desecrator can't be knocked down in the first place. They're steady. And yes, Amphibious excludes they entire engine failure thing. Amphibious specifically states that it ignores the effects of deep and shallow water. This is why I love the Crab 'jacks as a Cryx player. They are just so awesome.

I apologize, our flgs just recently got a Cryx player so I didn't know about their abilities. And I haven't had a chance to look up some rules since I started the thread, posting from my phone at work.

[Benejeseret]

Yes, feralgiest would help the 2-h targeting.

If you are thinking along these lines, also consider the use of buildings (Primal p89-91). A wooden structure a few stories tall looks neat on the table and an unaware opponent can be very, very hurt by it.

When they collapse they cause POW=ARM X Height (stories)....the printed example is a POW48 damage roll that also causes KD. Even simple 2-story wooden huts would cause a POW24 damage with KD.

Toss an enemy in and dop a building on it.

[Snuggly Buffalo]

I believe the Talion amphibious 'jacks are also immune to knockdown. Basically, all of the amphibious 'jacks are immune to knockdown as well, and so their amphibious rule is superfluous as far as swamp pit tossing is concerned.

But as was mentioned earlier, they're also squishier than most 'jacks, and so it's not a big deal to take them down by beating the tar out of them with a Wrastler.

[Vicomte Athos]

When they collapse they cause POW=ARM X Height (stories)....the printed example is a POW48 damage roll that also causes KD. Even simple 2-story wooden huts would cause a POW24 damage with KD.

Toss an enemy in and dop a building on it.

You do know that most building are harder to kill then the warjack you are colloapsing them on right? That two stroy wooden building you listed off is generally going to be a 3x5 piece of terrain, which means it has 80 hit points. Not only that but you have to discuss it with your opponent before the game even starts which is a sure fire way of telegraphing your intent.

[Benejeseret]

Gators should have an easier time of it. Nothing says a house can't be held up by a few tiny and rickety poles

[chaosB]

I believe the Talion amphibious 'jacks are also immune to knockdown. Basically, all of the amphibious 'jacks are immune to knockdown as well, and so their amphibious rule is superfluous as far as swamp pit tossing is concerned.

But as was mentioned earlier, they're also squishier than most 'jacks, and so it's not a big deal to take them down by beating the tar out of them with a Wrastler.

The two heavies(Freebooter and Mariner) yes, the light(Buccaneer) no with regards to KD immune. That said you're dead on with the second part, talion warjacks are pretty squishy, so a wraster or even a spitter should have little trouble dealing with them, with the only difficulty coming from their slightly higher than normal(for warjacks) DEF.

[StefDa]

I seem to remember some ruling that said that we couldn't cast a swamp pit under a 'jack then knock it down (Barnabas' feat, headbutt etc). Is this true, or am I making things up?

[Rotfell]

Yes, since you can't cast a swamp pit under models in general. It's in the spell description and since Barny lacks moving abilities, there's no way, you can do it in his own activation.

And the 'jack must not be knock down, before you're moving him there with another model (like the Swamp Horror), so you can throw/slam a standing 'jack into a pit, resulting in inactivity, but if you do the same with a knocked down 'jack, it's still active.

[Gator_Dave]

What happens to a Warjack that goes down in water?

[johntoenjes]

Yes, since you can't cast a swamp pit under models in general. It's in the spell description and since Barny lacks moving abilities, there's no way, you can do it in his own activation.

And the 'jack must not be knock down, before you're moving him there with another model (like the Swamp Horror), so you can throw/slam a standing 'jack into a pit, resulting in inactivity, but if you do the same with a knocked down 'jack, it's still active.

Wait so if a 'Jack is knocked down and then slammed/thrown into water its not disabled?

[MagnustheJust]

What happens to a Warjack that goes down in water?

0.o

Umm... You really don't know? Wow...

Not trolling you, I just am surprised by this, as it is a core game mechanic. The warjack's furnace gets extinguished - no furnace fire, no functionality.

Wait so if a 'Jack is knocked down and then slammed/thrown into water its not disabled?

Yeah... there was an über bogus ruling that an already knocked down warjack's furnace does not go out if you push it into water. It's incredibly stupid as rulings go, because it only affects Gator players, as this was our primary way of dealing with high armour!!

[phreaker187]

Yeah, the rule on knockdown specfically says that the model has to be knocked down in the water. Dumbest ruling I've ever heard in my life, but the guess Barny's feat + Squiddy drag was just too powerful!

[Der Tod]

They are squishier than their non-amphibious counterparts...

This is not entirely true as Cryx's crab jacks got +1 ARM compared to the normal Slayer chassis.

[MagnustheJust]

This is not entirely true as Cryx's crab jacks got +1 ARM compared to the normal Slayer chassis.

That may be true, but the DEF balances out with the ARM difference.

[LACK OF SUBTLETY]

Can't you just throw to a location one inch away so it can only deviate half an inch and not make it out of the swamp?

The only way you can "target" when throwing is when doing a two handed throw, and then you can only target a specific model.

Otherwise, when doing either a one handed or two handed throw, you pick a point on the table half the strength of the throwing model away from the thrown model and deviate 1d3 inches from that point. You cannot pick a point closer, you must throw the maximum distance modified by deviation. Now there are dodges to this, if you pick a point that is on the other side of a model or wall that will stop the thrown model's movement, you can direct the landing point far more accurately since the model will run into the model/terrain and stop.

[Gator_Dave]

0.o

Umm... You really don't know? Wow...

Not trolling you, I just am surprised by this, as it is a core game mechanic. The warjack's furnace gets extinguished - no furnace fire, no functionality.

I understand that, I'm wondering what the game effects are that happen to a Warjack that is knocked down in water?
Does it automatically die and turn into a wreck marker? Does it just go immobilized? Or does it just shut down, and if it does shut down can a caster reactivate it? Sorry I don't own a rule book, and would like to take advantage of using this technique.

[stephiroth]

jack in shallow water that gets KD goes inactive, you can restart it by getting into b2b and sac'in your action. Do believe any model can do that. If the jack is KD in deep water it is removed from play. That is what I know, could have changed a little in mark 2. (I also have no mark 2 rule book, let a friend barrow it and he moved away lol)