pMagnus - upgrading from 35 to 50

[NeoRonin]

So... As my sons begin to build their own armies, I'm thinking of adding some more mercs to the stable. I can fairly easily run a 35 point list, but if I upgrade to 50, I'd need some input on composition before proceeding (since now my fun money is being spent on 3 armies and not 1)

Does this list look like its diverse enough, who would I have problems with, and so on?

Thanks in advance for your input!

Army Name: Most Wanted
Mercenary Theme Force
Theme Force: Most Wanted Tier 4
49+6 points, 31 models

Magnus the Traitor* +6 points
* Mangler* 8 points
* 2x Renegade* 5 points each

Gorman Di Wulfe, Rogue Alchemist* 2 points
Kell Bailoch* 2 points
10 Long Gunners* 10 points
* Long Gunner Officer & Standard* 2 points
Orin Midwinter, Rogue Inquisitor* 2 points
Stannis Brocker* 4 points
5 Steelhead Heavy Cavalry* 10 points
6 Steelhead Riflemen* 5 points

[MagnustheJust]

Drop the SH Riflemen for the SH Halberdiers - max unit. The Long Gunners & SH Riflemen are redundant in that set up, and the Halbies will give your SH Heavy Cav a huge boost to their punch.

Other than that, it looks rock solid!!

[NeoRonin]

Well, sweet! Thanks for the prompt reply! I see what you're saying, I didn't realize the synergy between the halbies and the cav. Time to start saving my pennies!

[pattison]

I didn't realize the synergy between the halbies and the cav. Time to start saving my pennies!

I assure you that you won't regret.
This is the 50pts Most Wanted list that I run normally:

Magnus the Traitor (*6pts)
* Renegade (5pts)
* Renegade (5pts)
* Mangler (8pts)
* Mangler (8pts)
Long Gunner Infantry (Leader and 9 Grunts) (10pts)
Steelhead Halberdiers (Leader and 9 Grunts) (6pts)
Steelhead Heavy Cavalry (Leader and 2 Grunts) (6pts)
Gorman di Wulfe, Rogue Alchemist (2pts)
Kell Bailoch (2pts)
Orin Midwinter, Rogue Inquisitor (2pts)
Saxon Orrik (2pts)

It feels very "complete" and well-rounded.

[NeoRonin]

I can see the strength of that list, but isn't four 'jacks pretty hard to run, even with the free upkeeps?

Also, any thoughts on how the lists would stack up against vs. incorporeal lists or is this a common weakness of most mercs lists? (I'm still fairly new to the joys of Magnus...)

[pattison]

Incorp spam is a pain for most lists, but at 50 pts Most Wanted is indeed able to handle a couple of incorp models.
In the list I shared there are Kell & Orin with magic(al) attacks, plus Magnus can use his offensive spells through arc nodes if needed.
This won't solve your problems facing a full incorporeal list, but Most Wanted never will. But it's okay.

Running 4 jacks like that is not at all difficult with pMags.
Actually I think it's the right amount of jacks with him.
Iron Aggression goes on one Mangler, Temper Metal goes on the other one. I tend to put Snipe on the LGs and Blur on the SHH, but these two might change depending on your opponent. The trick is that you typically don't need focus on all your jacks at once. First of all the IA'd Mangler runs for free, and your Renegades don't always have to run. I'm thinking about swapping one of the Manglers to a Rover and see how it works with Snipe on early turns and with Temper on late ones. But the Mangler is just too good to pass up. It's a hard decision, but I'll try it for sure.

[NeoRonin]

Thanks again for the input. I'm just starting up again, and I'd forgotten that you can only have one upkeep running at a time, not stacking multiples on the same model. I think that will help with my focus management as I won't be needing to cast multiples of IA or TM on all the 'jacks. (please note that this error was due to my rustiness/lack of experience, and also because pretty much the only people I play are my two 12 year old sons... For now)

I also really appreciate the input/advice on dealing with spam lists, I know that here there are a few guys who run various incarnations of spam lists at the FLGS and I'll be facing them eventually. So, I'll see what I can do to tweak my list and go from there

Any more input is still appreciated!

[pattison]

Mentioning spam lists: Most Wanted typically have less problem with infantry spam (spare incorporeal infantry as discussed before).
You have a couple of shots, CRA options against multi-wound or high DEF/ARM infantry, and decent AOEs.
The 'spam list' Most Wanted has more probs with is heavy-spam with high ARM values.
And this is the reason I really like Manglers in it, because P+S17 is good to start with, while the chain weapon quality of the wrecking ball can make the difference against very high ARM models. They tend to wield some kind of shield, like the Avatar or a Centurion. The Mangler also ignores shield wall ARM bonus, while the Thresher attack will likely catch numerous models in that shield wall formation with reach.
Your other ARM crackers are the flanking Steelhead Cavs, so you should always protect them if possible and keep at least 2-3 Halberdiers alive for flanking.

[NeoRonin]

After some consideration of the input here, this is what I've decided...

Magnus the Traitor* +6 points
* Mangler* 8 points
* Nomad* 6 points
* 2x Renegade* 5 points each

Gorman Di Wulfe, Rogue Alchemist* 2 points
Kell Bailoch* 2 points
10 Long Gunners* 10 points
Orin Midwinter, Rogue Inquisitor* 2 points
Stannis Brocker* 4 points
10 Steelhead Halberdiers* 6 points
3 Steelhead Heavy Cavalry* 6 points

Main reason I went with the nomad/mangler rather than dual manglers is simply cost containment, as I already am missing the halbies and cav (picked up Stannis today)