War Room and MKIII

[x3tsniper]

With this release hopefully getting closer(war room), any chance we get some assurances that MKIII lies a while off? I suppose 60 dollars isn't that much even if it only lasts a year or 2, but it would be nice to know that MKII will last at least a certain amount of time before I have to drop another 60 dollars. Especially since I already have paid for 4 faction decks.

[AJ the Ronin]

I want to know if War Room will be compatible with Warmachine Mk.2 Remix

[Alex C]

It took ~7 years from Mk1 release until Mk2 release. It's only been ~2 years since Mk2 release. Not to mention there's several Mk2 books in the works for the next couple of years, and that's just what we know of. I think you're safe...

[PG_possiblyarowbot]

With this release hopefully getting closer(war room), any chance we get some assurances that MKIII lies a while off? I suppose 60 dollars isn't that much even if it only lasts a year or 2, but it would be nice to know that MKII will last at least a certain amount of time before I have to drop another 60 dollars. Especially since I already have paid for 4 faction decks.

According to PP, you buy the deck once, you get that factions cards forever.

Unless they backtrack, this would include any faction cards post rules revamp.

Also, there was 10 years between MKI and MKII. Let's be a little less dramatic.

[AJ the Ronin]

According to PP, you buy the deck once, you get that factions cards forever.

Unless they backtrack, this would include any faction cards post rules revamp.

Also, there was 10 years between MKI and MKII. Let's be a little less dramatic.

I can't find on the current FAQ but the original said that the deck will last as long as the current rule set. I asked (more than once) what they considered a rule set and if a Remix situation will be considered a new rule set and I never got an answer.

[BigHoot]

The funny part is that you think War Room's release is getting close.

[x3tsniper]

Eh, 20 days I consider close, and if it fails to release a 3rd time, I will ignore any information on it. It could have been wolfentsein, and released on schedule and been terrible. I personally would rather it get delayed. Granted, I liked the old pictures more than the new ones.

[AJ the Ronin]

The funny part is that you think War Room's release is getting close.

Thinkerhouse even made an update about it being close to release on Facebook even without people here asking for an update. That in itself is a step forward.

[Lich_Lord_X]

Also, there was 10 years between MKI and MKII. Let's be a little less dramatic.

Prime MKI came out in 2003, Prime MKII came out in 2010 that's not 10 years.

I don't see a reason to speculate on an app that is still unreleased and an expansion that hasn't even been foreshadowed yet.

[Bohrdog]

There is no MkIII get out of your "other system" mind set.

[Defenstrator]

Or you can still get your hands on iBodger. You have to update it yourself to account for the lTestest releases, but it's a lot better than nothing.

[PG_Deist]

PP said when MKII came out that they do not plan on doing an MKIII. They accomplished what they wanted in MKII and the amount of time and resources need was ridiculous. They explicitly said they never want to do it again. If something is off, they will errata it.

[lifelesspoet]

MKii is mostly fixed and balanced. If it were perfect errata would not be needed. If MKII was Just errata and fixing 2-3 models per faction and reworking some odd ends, artillary, burst fire, etc. then it would be on par with a new book release rather then a new ruleset. Also, the game has grown exponentially in ten years and that in theory would accelerate rule changes if they ever slip up on power creep again. If there is a an updated rulebook in 3 years I'm not likely gonna cry doom before i see it.

edit: also note they said they had no plans for a hordes battlebox like 6 months ago.

[HRM]

PP said when MKII came out that they do not plan on doing an MKIII. They accomplished what they wanted in MKII and the amount of time and resources need was ridiculous. They explicitly said they never want to do it again. If something is off, they will errata it.

Eventually there will be a MKIII. I don't care what they said, eventually they'll have to do it. A capitalist entity (which is what PP is, lest we forget) is like a tree - if it isn't growing, it's dying.

Besides, the more of ex-GW converts come over (who are used to, even expect, new ruleset editions), the more they can "get away" with it.

[Unknown_Lifeform]

Eventually there will be a MKIII. I don't care what they said, eventually they'll have to do it. A capitalist entity (which is what PP is, lest we forget) is like a tree - if it isn't growing, it's dying.

Besides, the more of ex-GW converts come over (who are used to, even expect, new ruleset editions), the more they can "get away" with it.

There is more than one way to grow a company - GW has a model of cyclical redundancy but that doesn't mean rehashing the core rules system periodically is therefor essential for a miniature companies survival.

[leo_neil316]

There is more than one way to grow a company - GW has a model of cyclical redundancy but that doesn't mean rehashing the core rules system periodically is therefor essential for a miniature companies survival.

Prime, primal, prime remix, prime 2, primal 2.

That's 5 core rulebooks in 7 years.

GW's only asked me to buy 4.... for a couple more days anyway.

[Lich_Lord_X]

Prime, primal, prime remix, prime 2, primal 2.

That's 5 core rulebooks in 7 years.

GW's only asked me to buy 4.... for a couple more days anyway.

Warmachine and hordes are not the same game, let's get that straight, so your numbers are a little skewed.

Also remix was an attempt to not have to do MKII. It also consolidated new rules present in Escalation, Apotheosis, and Supremecy so people weren't forced to purchase the supplement rule books for the cav and trample rules. If PP knew that they were going to do MKII I doubt they would have bothered with remix.

[Seventhprophet]

Warmachine and hordes are not the same game, let's get that straight, so your numbers are a little skewed.

"...so don't worry about the other game, you won't have to play against them in tournaments or know how their system works, ignore that other game and you'll be fine."

[PG_UndeadDan]

"...so don't worry about the other game, you won't have to play against them in tournaments or know how their system works, ignore that other game and you'll be fine."

You don't have to own both books (Prime and Primal) to play a single faction in either game. If you CHOOSE to get competative to the point of "needing" to know the other system, that is no different than buying all of the Forces of Warmachine/Hordes books to stay in the loop, but it is a choice, not a requirement.

[Lich_Lord_X]

"...so don't worry about the other game, you won't have to play against them in tournaments or know how their system works, ignore that other game and you'll be fine."

I don't need to know the stats for every faction I don't play do I?

[Temp22]

If you don't want to buy Hordes or Warmachine core bookS for rules, there are always the free QuickStart rules, straight from Privateer Press themselves. The Hordes PDF even has the battle box cards are attached. I am more concerned about MK XI personally. I mean players will get confused on which faction deck to buy, MK III or MK VI or MK IIX. I'm sure PP will do a new update every year from now on, cause they want even more of my money.

[Pinegulf]

Meh? Why would Econtent be any different from hardware? Books have to rebought so....

[Lich_Lord_X]

If you don't want to buy Hordes or Warmachine core bookS for rules, there are always the free QuickStart rules, straight from Privateer Press themselves. The Hordes PDF even has the battle box cards are attached. I am more concerned about MK XI personally. I mean players will get confused on which faction deck to buy, MK III or MK VI or MK IIX. I'm sure PP will do a new update every year from now on, cause they want even more of my money.

Im personally concerned about the lack of education regarding roman numerals in schools these days. Our kids aren't going to be able to tell MK IV from MK VI. I'm also a little concerned about what MK XXX will bring. Hopefully not Vin Diesel.

[Matthaeus]

If you CHOOSE to get competative to the point of "needing" to know the other system, that is no different than buying all of the Forces of Warmachine/Hordes books to stay in the loop, but it is a choice, not a requirement.

I'm not sure where to begin with this statement. Knowing the rules is a prerequisite to play the game, not a choice. Warmachine and Hordes are de facto a single game with some variations in the core mechanics ; I think this is a more honest view than saying they are "two different games, only with rules integrated to the point where they are fully compatible".

But I agree the QuickStart rules should be plenty to complement one rulebook.

[PG_UndeadDan]

I'm not sure where to begin with this statement. Knowing the rules is a prerequisite to play the game, not a choice. Warmachine and Hordes are de facto a single game with some variations in the core mechanics ; I think this is a more honest view than saying they are "two different games, only with rules integrated to the point where they are fully compatible".

Maybe you missed the original context, so I'll try to clarify:

Person A said:

Prime, primal, prime remix, prime 2, primal 2. That's 5 core rulebooks in 7 years.

Person B said:

Warmachine and hordes are not the same game, let's get that straight, so your numbers are a little skewed.

Person C said (sarcastically):

"...so don't worry about the other game, you won't have to play against them in tournaments or know how their system works, ignore that other game and you'll be fine."

The intent of my response was to state that owning both books isn't required if you only play either a Hordes faction or a Warmachine faction and do not plan on using crossover models from the other game.

I apologize if I was unclear.

[Tielc]

I would have no problems with a Reloaded style book with all of the Errata rules congregated in one place, and as long as it was a story advance like all the other books are. I'm find with their relatively low cost compared to other systems out there, plus I personally find value in the fluff, it's a moving story of an evolving world. I get that some people don't care for the fluff at all, so I don't think it would be a necessary purchase of you already had the rules for Battle Engines, Collasals and any FAQ or Erratas. I however do not like having to reference or keep with me an FAQ, Errata document, or extra books. So I definitely would look forward to a re-hash, compilation, anthology, what have you of all the rules at some point. Again, so long as the story progressed.

[AJ the Ronin]

Thing is Reloaded didn't advanced the plot, it was Prime fluff with some stuff changed to fix the change of vision about some aspects of the setting.

And ruleswise it just didn't added errata, it introduced new elements to the game (within, completely within and screening from the top of my head).

[Lich_Lord_X]

And ruleswise it just didn't added errata, it introduced new elements to the game (within, completely within and screening from the top of my head).

No those all existed before Remix. They just clarified and made errata regarding things like that. Also things like Haley's feat (while within vs. currently within) were clarified and changed as need be. They really didn't add anything rules wise.

[PG_Deist]

Eventually there will be a MKIII. I don't care what they said, eventually they'll have to do it. A capitalist entity (which is what PP is, lest we forget) is like a tree - if it isn't growing, it's dying.

Besides, the more of ex-GW converts come over (who are used to, even expect, new ruleset editions), the more they can "get away" with it.

They don't have to do anything. Privateer Press is not Games Workshop. They are not basing themselves off of Games Workshop. Sometimes people think they will act like GW, but the structure of PP has been different from the get go. They make their money by putting time and effort into balance rules for new models. GW puts time into changing the game every so often to help shift the power around. MKIII might happen, but if it is...it is way off. Gargantuans comes out this spring, then we have hints at the next Warmachine book, so another Hordes book after that to keep with their current trend.

In response to the Hordes 2 player starter, they also said they would probably do it. They made something out of already existing product. Easy to see how the success of the Warmachine starter encouraged them to do the Hordes one.

[AJ the Ronin]

No those all existed before Remix. They just clarified and made errata regarding things like that. Also things like Haley's feat (while within vs. currently within) were clarified and changed as need be. They really didn't add anything rules wise.

I play with people that never touch this (well the old) forums. Seeing the concept of screening, within and c. Within was game changing.

They also changed the way kd worked in relation with giving orders among other things.

Yes everything was on the forum or the living document but that living document was around 80 pages l
bg IIRC.

[x3tsniper]

I can't find it at the moment, but I recall a clause specifically stating that the cards you purchased would last for the current rules set. This implies that at some point MKIII or whatever will hit.

[PG_UndeadDan]

How is it absurd, wanting to know that if I drop money on digital cards, that I already own hard copies of, they won't be worthless in a year or two?

Because the chances of getting a new edition of the rules in the next year or two, when the first iteration lasted nearly 7 years and we are barely into year 2 of the current edition, seems very unlikely.

MK2 was a huge undertaking that involved nearly everyone at Privateer's full attention. Currently they are: Relaunching an RPG line, relaunching and expanding a board and card game division(Bodgers), retooling their entire manufacturing process to include resin, plastic as well as white metal, and taking baby steps into leveraging the power of digital devices as aids to tactile, physical gaming.

Does this seem like a company that has the time and resources to revamp it's flagship product on the off chance that it might spur a minor bump in revenue?

I have no inside knowledge, and I could be entirely wrong. There might be MK3 beta documents being passed around PPSHQ as we speak, but I seriously doubt it.

[AluminumFalcon]

I can't find it at the moment, but I recall a clause specifically stating that the cards you purchased would last for the current rules set. This implies that at some point MKIII or whatever will hit.

That could also simply be future proofing. It is the same as the theme lists that have models that don't exist yet like Stormblade solos and the like. It does not guarantee a Stormblade solo is coming, but it does guarantee Privateer doesn't have to release a new theme force for every warcaster they want to be able to include it or errata or new books. This statement simply means that, if the time comes for a new rule set, they are covered when it comes to telling customers that they will not get the new cards for free.

[PG_Ghool]

How is it absurd, wanting to know that if I drop money on digital cards, that I already own hard copies of, they won't be worthless in a year or two?

This is not GW.
PP does not revamp their entire rules set every 2 years.

[Rinion]

I do sort of hope for a Prime 2.5 or something, where they fix point costs and over/underpowered models

[jandrese]

They did that in Mk I, with "Prime Remix", it was obsolete shortly afterward with 2.0. That is probably what has the OP so worried about war room.

[PG_UndeadDan]

They did that in Mk I, with "Prime Remix", it was obsolete shortly afterward with 2.0. That is probably what has the OP so worried about war room.

Prime remix was out for well over two years before MK 2 hit the shelves. I really don't see the basis for fear or trepidation here.

[deademon]

Random Legal Info: they stated that WarMachine and Hordes will NEVER be in the same book. there are copy write laws that wont allow it.

[jandrese]

Two years really isn't that much time in the miniature gaming world.

[jandrese]

Random Legal Info: they stated that WarMachine and Hordes will NEVER be in the same book. there are copy write laws that wont allow it.

[Citation Needed]

Privateer Press owns the copyright for both Warmachine and Hordes, those laws cannot apply.