Against Exemplar spam?

[Pixelcycle]

I've been playing against this menoth player at my LGS who likes to take a LOT of exemplar errants and knights exemplar and games have been an uphill battle against him. Blessed ignores my troop buffs so I can't really brick very well against the army. The last two games I played were reduced to me throwing nihilators up as a tarpit while I put trainwreck on my titans and let them mow through the exemplars. I won the last two games only because my opponent positioned his caster too close and I was able to trainwreck a bronzeback into melee with him.

Any better ways to counter exemplar spam? I know they can't be targeted by spells but I thought bouncing ashes to ashes off of one of my beasts into them might work?

These were the two lists I was using (still trying things out and getting the hang of skorne, I didn't really like either list that well.)

Naaresh
-Basilisk Drake
-Basilisk Krea
-Bronzeback Titan
-Titan Gladiator
-Aptimus Marketh
Agonizer
Max Nihilators
Min Beast Handlers

Xerxis
-Bronzeback
-Bronzeback
-Gladiator
Max Arcuarii
Min Beasthandlers

[Pixelcycle]

Oh, here's my opponents list as best I remember it.

eKreoss
-Crusader
Max Exemplar Errants + UA
Max Exemplar Errants
Min Knights Exemplar
Min Knights Exemplar
Daughters
Piper
Nicia
Paladin of the Wall x3? (I don't remember, they didn't really do a whole lot.)

[PG_lord tyrant watt]

This is an easy match up for Rasheth. Jam your titans down their throat and hit two of them with Breath of Corruption. With the AoE centered on the titans, if any non-reach models charge the titans, they take a pow 12.

Proceed to use Beatback on both the Sentry and Bronzeback, mow them down and then hit them with another BoC.

[Rynth]

Rasheth's BoC can save Titans from non-reach troops. You can use a Void Spirit and an expendable friendly troop to emulate the effect via Eruption of Ash(check your own melee range to make sure you move to its center).

The Exemplar's ability works via healing. So any effects that prevent healing will stop it. IIRC, for us that primarily means Silence of Death(use on Nihilators, Swordsmen, Ferox, and other multi-attack models to get multiple Errants per attacker).

Self Sacrifice only works against "enemy attacks," so non-attack damage sources don't trigger it. Collateral Damage(via throws and slams, crit or otherwise) is our easiest source, but we also have some lingering clouds(Void Spirits, Breath of Corruption, and Dessicator) and a unit that brings AOE Corrosion(assuming the Errants aren't Aegis'ed). If the unresolved "what is and isn't an attack" ever gets resolved we might pick up some others.

EDIT:
I see the troublesome list also includes the Piper. Combining Tough w/ Self Sacrifice can be obnoxious. Fortunately, Silence of Death shuts that down just as well.

[Pixelcycle]

Thanks! I'll try Rasheth out against him next time I play him.

[PG_dungeongod]

Rasheth + Gatormen are pretty nasty against Protectorate - I know I hate to see gators in general when I am playing Protectorate, as they jam really, really well and can chew through infantry.

[Theripontigonus]

If masses of infantry are a concern, there's a few options in skorne that don't see much play. The pain giver solo has thresher and anatomical precision with reach. Because the attacks are simultaneous they can't do much to dodge them with self sac, and he doesn't care about the increased armor from knights exemplar. Black spot on eHexeris is pretty sweet for killing infantry (on models without self sac anyways) and Ashes can be great even if you have to shoot your own beast first. My other suggestion would be to try pMorghul. He can kill so much infantry on his own it's obscene. Double attack, anatomical precision and overtake. Add in sprint and fate walker and he can be wherever you need him afterwards.

[ScotlandNil]

I'm surprised nobody's mentioned pHexeris - his feat would result in pretty much all of his Exemplars killing each other. In fact, I'd say the list you mentioned is pretty much the exact match up I'd want to see when using Hexeris!

In fact, I think you'd kill all his guys so easily that it's bordering on not fair/fun!

[Pixelcycle]

Well I ran a tier 4 rasheth list against him but he retooled his list and focused on tying up my beasts and sat on his focus, I couldn't get to kreoss to hurt him and he wouldn't do anything other than brick and whittle away at my beasts with his daughters. We ended up just calling it because the game just dragged on.

My list
Rasheth
-Bronzeback
-Gladiator x2
Gatormen Max
Task Master
Agonizer x2
Min Beast handlers

His list
EKreoss
-Revenger
Max Cinerators
Max Errants + UA
Max Daughters x2
Piper
Nicia

I REALLY felt like I needed more infantry on the field. I think in hindsight I would have just dropped the agonizer and played outside of the tier and upgraded one gladiator to a sentry. He refused to commit to a charge and just ran all of his daughters back behind the cinerators while they advanced towards the gators. I used my feat a round too early but it helped to mitigate the damage his feat did.

It was a really frustrating game.

[Rynth]

I'm surprised nobody's mentioned pHexeris - his feat would result in pretty much all of his Exemplars killing each other. In fact, I'd say the list you mentioned is pretty much the exact match up I'd want to see when using Hexeris!

It actually isn't surprising because it isn't that good.
Bastions move damage around potentially dying to Sanguine Bond rather than your attack. In order for Dark Dominion to trigger your attack has to box an enemy model, so they can often get around it. However, if you put enough attacks into them you'll eventually get a kill through and his former buddies will have little health lefts and will likely die quickly to each other.
Cenerators and Vengers don't kill each other on average and any that are left get a buff for your murderous effort.
Errants will die to Self Sacrifice rather than your attack, so no Dark Dominion there either.
Knights Exemplar will on average die like champs to each other, even though the ones attacking for you won't have the Bond of Brotherhood STR bonus.

So of the 5 types of Exemplar only one is good for Hexeris1's feat.

In fact, I think you'd kill all his guys so easily that it's bordering on not fair/fun!

Hexeris1's feat is so generally so mediocre that it is immensely enjoyable when you can get it to do amazing things. Once I had about 25 points of an Gaspy2 army eat itself then get removed from play unable to get feated back. It was glorious.

[Darque]

It actually isn't surprising because it isn't that good.
Bastions move damage around potentially dying to Sanguine Bond rather than your attack. In order for Dark Dominion to trigger your attack has to box an enemy model, so they can often get around it. However, if you put enough attacks into them you'll eventually get a kill through and his former buddies will have little health lefts and will likely die quickly to each other.
Cenerators and Vengers don't kill each other on average and any that are left get a buff for your murderous effort.
Errants will die to Self Sacrifice rather than your attack, so no Dark Dominion there either.
Knights Exemplar will on average die like champs to each other, even though the ones attacking for you won't have the Bond of Brotherhood STR bonus.

So of the 5 types of Exemplar only one is good for Hexeris1's feat.


Hexeris1's feat is so generally so mediocre that it is immensely enjoyable when you can get it to do amazing things. Once I had about 25 points of an Gaspy2 army eat itself then get removed from play unable to get feated back. It was glorious.

Yeah I'll second this. got hit with a Menoth list in a single list tourney and it shut pHexy down cold. it was a very one sided round.