Problems with Legion of Everblight....?

[FlippyDoo]

I played my first games against Legion last week and oh boy are they a problem. Eyeless Sight on all of their beasts means our armies depending on are shut down. I also picked up Venethrax for those annoying Horde armies. Now the big question is what do we do against Legion? For example, who do we bring against a turn 2 assassination list like eLylyth? I played pDenny and ended up getting the assassination in after Lylyth tried to, no one can beat the queen of assassination. What about Saeryn where her feat shuts down 90% of our models and their melee attacks? Im thinking Campathrax could probably do it but I dont want to have to rely on him against Hordes. Id like to hear everyones opinions on this. Thanks

[Lambstar]

You're asking a few totally different questions here, it seems, but I'll fill in my experiences.

Saeryn is pretty commonly referred to as an Anti-Cryx caster due to our faction's focus on melee, so I find the trick with her is to either counter with a ranged force or bring another denial feat as a balancing factor. pDenny with pirates or Nyss hunters is always fantastic and Legion warbeasts, especially the fliers the Saeryn loves to field, are lightly armored and can be brought down with some debuffs and a few well-placed Biles/Nightwretches/Dark Fire shots if you're an in-faction purist. For the denial aspect, eDenny and eSkarre both have a lot going for them. If you can force Saeryn to feat first through agressive play and then counter with your own, you have the advantage. It's an intricate dance.

I find eLylyth a little trickier, as she gets by our usual denial options. Stealth is still good against her since she like Striders, but Denny is one of the most vulnerable targets. If you can, a tanky caster marching straight up to her is ideal. This is the sort of playstyle/matchup where Venethrax shines and Terminus is also good at this role. Camping focus and overbearing with a bunch of range-resistant troops (Bane Thralls, Satyxis Raiders, anything that is/can go Incorporeal) is good, since she can't bring enough range power to bear in this situation. Her beasts are also prone to being tied up. For this approach, most casters will work. Try to avoid pDenny (eDenny can get pretty safe unless eLylyth brings a Nightlurker). The Witch Coven is a super huge win-big/lose-big matchup. On their feat turn, you're completely immune to their army. The rest of the time, you fear fire-causing AoE's unless you can kill all the Ravagores.

The worst part is facing down a combination of these 2 at an event, since they both take vastly different approaches to assassinations and face-beatings. I feel like I'm flipping a coin in list choice and winning or losing based on my opponent's pick. But that's a narrow situation. The point is that there's no perfect "anti-legion" list. An army that performs well against Saeryn may do poorly against eLylyth and vice versa. But I suppose that could be said about any army.

Hope this helps!

[various]

i think that an assassination force like Cryx can struggle a little against any Hordes Faction as a quick assassination run is rarely a viable option in the early stages of a game. It's pretty vital to play a more attrition orientated game where you strip away the Beasts before taking the enemy 'Lock out. Personally i've never had a great deal of luck against the LoE due to the variety of ways they can negate our various strengths: no hiding behind clouds to block LOS or outmaneuvering them with our superior speed. Rather than trying a specific anti Hordes 'Caster like Vennethrax you're probably better off taking the 'Caster that you're the most familiar with.

[usbprime]

eSkarre is our answer to Saeryn......you wait for her to feat, then you feat and hit as much as you can with skarres feat......even better you lock out her beasts and position all your troops/jacks into range to charge saeryn......as much fury as she is stacking, she can't transfer everything......

Another viable option is lots and lots of troops. eGaspy and Terminus do this well.......my terminus list has 2 units of McThralls......i know Sancjud uses 30 bane knights and layers the units, so your opponent takes out the first "row" of knights, all your unit vengence. eGaspy you just push your opponent, and use the feat to either destroy his whole army, or caster kill. Legion has trouble chunking through large ammounts of troops.......except saeryn.......blight bringer sucks my ***......

[Admiral_Arzar]

Play Terminus.

Seriously. He destroys eLylyth and every other ranged Legion list, and has a good shot against any of their melee lists simply because he brings a massive army that hits hard and clogs the approaches to him. Even Saeryn has a hard time hacking through the sheer number of dudes that Terminus brings to the table. Venethrax also works, if you play a large enough army to actually screen him from the inevitable Angeli. Do NOT play eSkarre against Legion because you will die horribly to any of their ranged lists on the first turn you don't feat (or on feat turn, it's not hard to run a random dude next to Skarre and shoot that guy with Ravagores/Typhon/Carnivean).

[Happy Scrappy Hero Pup]

You can go negative with eSkarre and feat on your opponent's models (and Skarre. Always Skarre), but I'd take Terminus as well.

Any caster depending on stealth is asking for it from Legion.

[SpiderBite]

I've actually had GREAT success using eDen against Saeryn.
I cant hit you in melee? Kewl. You cant move.
BlightBringer, among other reasons is why you dont bring eSkarre against Saeryn.
eLylyth, I havent had the pleasure of fighting, I'd probably apply Mr.T to the face.

[Gamingdevil]

You can go negative with eSkarre

What? Quite sure you can't go under 0 hp and even if you can, you'd die.

[usbprime]

What? Quite sure you can't go under 0 hp and even if you can, you'd die.

He means what i said.......use her feat to target your opponents models rather than friendlies.

[Admiral_Arzar]

eLylyth, I havent had the pleasure of fighting, I'd probably apply Mr.T to the face.

In an actual tournament format, you end up having to drop Terminus every time for fear of eLylyth, as she is Kryptonite for the rest of Cryx. Legion then generally drops Saeryn for fear of Terminus, as she is the best shot that they have at beating him.

[Craftwerk]

Play Terminus.

Seriously. He destroys eLylyth and every other ranged Legion list, and has a good shot against any of their melee lists simply because he brings a massive army that hits hard and clogs the approaches to him. Even Saeryn has a hard time hacking through the sheer number of dudes that Terminus brings to the table. Venethrax also works...

To elaborate, vs eLylyth in particular, our best chance of winning is to bring a caster who is high armor and will not be easily assassinated from across the board. eLylyth with Ravagores is something like a 26" threat. If you can somehow be immune to fire, it shuts down Ravagores hard.

Saeryn is indeed another huge problem for us, so ensure you have a somewhat rounded list with at least a bit of shooting.

General tactics on how to beat Legion are to kill their beasts! The faction is known for having amazingly good beasts with plenty of beast support, so players tend not to take much in the way of infantry. Watch out for their models like Seraph slipstreaming other heavies to get charges on you, and be aware that an Angelius will wreck a heavy with armor piercing and is good at holding zones since its animus pushes models away.

[FlippyDoo]

I'm also trying to get used to Venethrax do you guys think ARM 22 could stand up to feat turn against eLylyth ? On first turn I advance Venethrax with a Seether screening him and cast Dragon Slayer leaving him at 22 ARM then next turn he'll have 24 at least. What do you guys think ? Also I'm pretty sure pDenny could stand up against Saeryn. Between double Pistol Wraiths and the withershadow's Dark Fire.

[usbprime]

I don't fear eLylyth as much as the saeryn's and eVayl's of the world. The key vs. eLylyth is remembering that eyeless sight doesn't ignore LoS. Lylyth is a 1 trick pony. Make a wall of McThralls followed by (2 or 3 inches) by a few large based models (crabs work good due to the no knock down and your caster 2 - 3 inches back of that. That setup literally stops the insta kill that everyone is afraid of. eVayl, Saeryn and absalonia scare me more due to their near bottomless bags of tricks. For the last 8 months I've played a fairly good legion player twice a week.......so legion doesn't bother me as much as some of the other factions.

[Scottl1]

eVayl is the only legion caster I hate to see across the table cause she makes me want to camp focus and screws with my game. He ways to sneak in assassinations is annoying to say the least.

Lylyth is a source of lols if Im playing a camping caster like Terminus. Oh no your feat killed a handful of mcthralls however will I go on!? lol Saeryn I find jamming them up and preventing tramples shuts down the usual Saeryn gimmicks.