New Darius Theme List

[Khador247]

Don't say Khador never did anything for you.

Please do not post full theme lists on these forums, it is against TOS. - Mod_GeminiX6

ESorscha got a new theme list as well. Details on Khador forum.

[Defenstrator]

Is this in the new NQ? It looks interesting. A Stormwall with Hammersmith/Avenger flanking. The Rangers buff the shooting. Not a huge amount of benefits though. I don't really want the halfjacks to AD where people can shoot them, the first three Stormpods will be a bit far back (although having them behind does help with getting Triangulations off). Getting the jacks a lot further upfield first turn is nice though, and I won't turn down a free Stormsmith.

[bouncymischa]

Is this in the new NQ?

So it seems. The Khadoran one seems at least Conquest-friendly, if not mentioning it specifically. It makes me wonder if each Colossal release will be accompanied by a corresponding tier list that encourages you to take it?

[sleet01]

Excuse me...



...I just craned in my pants.

This is pretty much the theme list I've been wanting for Darius since forever. Too bad about Junior, but Darius has Fortify so oh well.

As a postscript, that Stormblade solo better drop ASAFP. I can't wait to find out what it does.

[Jake the Dog]

Wait, no Thunderhead?
So you need a Stormwall and a Centurion/Hammersmith/Avenger or a second Stormwall. Thunderhead would have met the requirement if allowed.

[knight_actual]

Stormblades...... Interesting. Stormblade solo..... Interesting. Stormclad maybe?

[sleet01]

I'll probably only play this at 50+ points, but I'm thinking:

Darius (+5) [<-- this always makes me laugh]
- Squire (-2)
- Storm wall (-19)
- Stormclad (-10)
- Hammersmith (-8)
- Firefly (-5)
Rangers (-5)
Stormblades (-5)
Stormsmith Stormcallers x 2 (-1)

Though I might drop the Firefly for more Stormsmiths and the SB UA. Or the Stormblades for a Stormblade Solo and more SS models.

[Da-Rock]

So they must take Rangers with only the Stormwall and Avengers having guns. No Storm Striders and no Jr. Kind of a bummer for a BIG Darius fan:

Tier 1 = uh, all Lighting Pods out a max of 30" from board edge after a Trample? Not really great unless you go 2nd and your opponent runs out. You will then need to kill a Pod to get another. Seems like a situational move. Your opponent will see the triangle from the start and only the stormsmiths can do any damage. Stormsmiths will need to move out far forward to get off Triangulation. (maybe they should have got AD instead of Halfjacks??) (C-)

Tier 2 = Why again would I want my Halfjacks to have Advanced Deploy? Only helps if I am creating a gun line and want to turn them into mines early, otherwise they are easy kills? (D-)

Tier 3 = Free Stormsmith. So 19pts gets me 1pt free? With Hordes being played more in my meta the Stormsmiths are only used for occasional Solo kills and infantry since Disruption is useless. Other Tiers at least give a free 2pt UA? Ooooh, I could take another 19pt Stormwall and get another free 1pt Stormsmith....saaaweet! (F-)

Tier 4 = All our Speed 4 models get 6 speed for one turn. I'll take it, but I won't take the tier list. (B+)

I'm getting two lime green leisure suits with lapels shaped like hang gliders for the price of one.....Two of sh%! is still sh@!, if they really wanted ta "BLANK" me I would get three of them! :-) :-)

Poor Darius, I can't imagine why they spent time putting that one out......................probably because PP hasn't seen anyone play him in so many years they just guessed. :-(

Oh well

[Centa]

Hmmm, in the first moment i thought "WOW, that must be a joke".
But after a lil bit i think Darius lose to much, and doesnt get any real benefits out of it.

T1 Benefit: Placing 3 Pods instead of 1 in the first turn isnt such a big benefit. If you go first, your enemy will shoot them down, coz he has nothing else to shoot at. When you go second, it may be good if your opponent runs as far as he can.
T2 Benefit: Halfjacks with AD. Most of the time i run my Halfjacks first turn, and next turn i advance and make a mine out of one or two. This benefit doesnt change anything. Exact the same range. If you run them first turn, your enemy will kill them.
T3 Benefit: Thats the only real benefit Darius get. 1 free point
T4 Benefit: If you run your jacks to far in the first turn, Darius cant keep up with em. A running Stormwall cant place a pot. That means you would lose T1 benefit if you run. If you do not, he will be to far behind your lines.

You lose 3 important models (Strangeways, Junior, eEiryss), have to buy Rangers (they are a good unit, and worth their points, but i wouldnt play em with Darius). Also you cant use Ol'Rowdy, not a too big porblem but still a drawback.
And in larger point games you lose all the support you can get from Mercs: A&H, Gorman, Ragman, Lanyssa, Anastasia,....

The new Theme Force is better then the old, but still not as good as it might look in the first moment.

Or maybe it just doesnt fit my playstyle...

[Da-Rock]

I think his old Wrecking crew is waaaaay better than this steamer. I am really bummed that they wasted time and energy on a theme list that doesn't fit a theme, doesn't fit how anyone currently plays Darius nor does it allow you to play him differently unless the goal was to make Darius played even less.

Gonna love me some x2 Avengers getting a +2 on Ranged Attacks tearing up.......(looks at Avenger range) Hmmm, 10" range and AOE 4, no Snipe around, no Jr.........oh tearing up my Rangers because 10" range + AOE 4 and effective RAT 6 is gonna rock the table! :-(

Oh, I just thought of another = effect RAT 8 standing still next to Stormwall with "Fortify" on giving no knockdown to my two Avengers and with that 10" AOE 4 shot I can just barely reach that POD with its Def 5..............oh crap.....I deployed all 3 on 1st turn and my opponent ignored killing them and kept all his soft targets away from them so I can't deploy any new ones unless I divert some of my numerous Cygnar shooting that way......crap I'm running Darius!

[katadder]

dont forget stormwall is a jack so counts for tier 4 qualifying

[Da-Rock]

dont forget stormwall is a jack so counts for tier 4 qualifying

Yes, a Jack and base armor 19, but as others have said, it just doesn't do much. I rated it as the highest tier. Too bad its tier 4 and tier 1-3 eat golf balls!

[Calibre]

This must be a Khador joke or like said earlier the guys at PP hasn't played Darius in so long they just put a few things together to call it peanut butter and jelly sandwich.

Rangers makes some sense, in terms of getting ranged boosts outside of spending focus. 3 Pods for triangulation, doesn't make any sense, 48" board - 17" normal deployment - 12" enemy run 1st turn (average) leaves 19" between you and your enemy. Even if the Stormwall benefits from the +2 SPD and tramples 10" he still can only put out those pods 9" away, as it has to be completely within which means you are placing those pod smack bang on their front line, so your not threatening anything merely blocking charge lanes with them. It would have been nice if things like the Storm Strider was part of this theme or maybe Storm Towers to eLeap off but it doesn't look like this.

AD mines are even worse than the pods, most of us can gamble on losing/replacing before we need them for feat turn. If your lucky and go second you can either move or run them, ideally you need them half way up the table to keep enemy out of the zones, but AD and moving only puts you 22" up the board, and turning into a mine only threatens another 2" forward, so there's about another 2+" of zones your not threatening and the enemy could clip. Running will like others have stated get the bots either shot up or charged.

Free Stormsmith with a 19pts models...wow, how many do we need to take before that turns into a bargain. I get what they were trying to do here, Darius needs a way to get rid of solo's, things like Sheperds or Striders, but its still a model which needs LOS to the model and has to pass a cmd check with a abysmal def and arm and your not going to have an abundance of troops so its fairly easy for our enemy to take out our callers. I would have gone for something along the lines of 2 Free Stromsmiths or -1pt cost on GMCA.

The biggest problem with this tier is they've decided to switch it up a bit remove the crutches for Darius, ie Strangeways and Jnr but then they add Stormblades which features in almost every other type of theme list, its like there is no other unit in Cygnar, I say switch it up a bit add the "other" Cygnar troops Stormguard, Stormlances.

[DrBaltar]

Hm, Stormblade Solo"s"?! This one ist the most interesting part for me!^^ Now we ve got 3 theme lists with them (Stryker 1 theme list and second Haley2 theme list). This makes me hope that we get them in the next book! I hope he grants more surviveability

[PG_Dino-Czar]

You can't hear me, but I'm weeping for some of you.

The pods are probably set on the 20" line, like in n3mo's theme. This isn't a big bonus, and I only ever set on or two. It will work with the stormtower, and thats alright, but whatever.

AD halfjacks is actually a pretty significant bonus. It lets you steal a move on your opponent and get your mines in play where you need them. If you go second set them up a bit further back.

A free storm caller is more triangulation, which is more infantry clearing, which is something Darius needs badly. No complaints here, other than it could have been level one.

+2 speed turn one is fantastic. I run a pair of Hammersmiths with the wall and Darius already. Seeing them jet forward early is something I'm excited about.

I'm sad at no stormstrider and no Jr; I'll live with the complete lack of magical attacks, but losing those two models out of the list I'm already running stings a bit.

This is a theme worth trying.

[Piledriver]

That list is useless
let me count the reasons why:
1. no strangeways
2. no jr. = no safety net
3. no magic weapons, say hello to the choir
4. no spd 5 heavy Jacks, I know stormwall is spd5, but I cannot see it charging that often. Also in a lightning themed army, no stormclad ?

I play Darius, and I wouldn't loose all that to play this theme list.

[Crate123]

That list is useless
let me count the reasons why:
1. no strangeways
2. no jr. = no safety net
3. no magic weapons, say hello to the choir
4. no spd 5 heavy Jacks, I know stormwall is spd5, but I cannot see it charging that often. Also in a lightning themed army, no stormclad ?

I play Darius, and I wouldn't loose all that to play this theme list.

You can include a SPD 5 jack just fine, it wont contribute to Tier 4 but you can still take them.

[knight_actual]

I actually quite like this tier even though the storm blades are a little out of place.

Lack of substantial points savings is disappointing, but the ability to get all of your assets up the field quickly is quite good for Darius.

The lack of any magical attacks will hurt.

Pods should be up 10deploy 10trample 10launch so about 30inches up field. And I would be surprised if you couldn't choose to deploy less than all 3.

[Flounderfinder]

No one has mentioned storm towers yet and how they can work off of the lightning pods. Getting a couple of pods down turn one with a few AD halfjacks could go a long way to denying an opponent a zone in scenario play for a low investment.

I think this is a solid tier list with lots of potential and once it is confirmed, I'll try it out at least once.

[bouncymischa]

So they must take Rangers with only the Stormwall and Avengers having guns.

Hey, Darius has a gun too, you know! :P

[Da-Rock]

so far I haven't read a single argument that has made me rethink my assessment of this theme list. Not even close. In fact after reading some posters say that its good has made me reread their posts to see if they have ever run Darius and then wonder who they play against that makes any of the tier worthwhile.

Darius has a a 12" cannon that if he fires means he is open to attack and only at Arm 18 since Jr is not around and he gets just one shot because Reinholdt isn't around either.

Somone tell me why I would play this theme and not just get everything I want out of tier? I never buy more then 2 Stormsmiths anyways because getting triangulation off more then once means that you are most likely playing Bobby Joe who spends more time digging for nose gold than playing the game. So if I go out of Theme Tier I lose =

Launching up to 3 Pods first turn
AD on my HalfJacks
1pt
+2 Speed on turn 1

hmmmmmmmmmm

[Jake the Dog]

And after the greatness of Stormwall and Nemo3, the Cygnar forums are back to status quo and not liking everything they get. :|
puts on flameshield

[PG_Dino-Czar]

And after the greatness of Stormwall and Nemo3, the Cygnar forums are back to status quo and not liking everything they get. :/

Why do you have to go and do that? A couple people do not equal "the cygnar forums".

[Jake the Dog]

Why do you have to go and do that? A couple people do not equal "the cygnar forums".

Of course I was generalizing, but the gist of it remains a true observation. The posters in this board more often than those on other boards shun / dismiss most of the new stuff they get.

[Da-Rock]

Of course I was generalizing, but the gist of it remains a true observation. The posters in this board more often than those on other boards shun / dismiss most of the new stuff they get.

I am usually in love with what PP puts out. I also play Cygnar ALL of the time and defend a large portion of its models/rules. I play Darius more then any other Cygnar caster......................

The Theme list is a waste of ink and PP should have spent the time and energy giving out a theme to a different caster that they care about because this showed NO creativity at all!

If the theme had a good theme to it, I would not have commented. If it had any functionality that applied to Darius, I would not have commented.

Cygnar rocks and I love just about every model and rule they have out. We have got a TON of love recently by PP and I thank them over and over, but this..................this for a Darius lover was........................................this was a sliding glass door on my Junk!

[sleet01]

*Citation needed

It's so weird; for me his posts just look like big pink bars.

@Da-rock: this theme is no worse than Darius' usual theme list, and actually provides some benefits he can't get there:

1) RAT buffs that aren't just focus
2) Extra SPD, which is categorically better than 2" of extra deployment for the BG... and affects the 'jacks that need it most
3) The ability to mix lights and heavies
4) A melee unit that both provides free focus and is *much* more likely to be owned / used by more players

Obviously this isn't going to be the best theme list for Cygnar ever, but be real: did you actually expect to get a tier list that makes Darius super-good? Outside of a theme that includes the B13, Aiyanna & Holt, Ragman, Junior, and a 2-PC drop on all warjacks I don't think PP can ever make MK II Darius *great*. This theme, at least, gives him something *different*.

[Dan from Chicago]

So they must take Rangers with only the Stormwall and Avengers having guns.

1. Rangers have guns
2. Stormblades have guns
3. A Stormwall has A LOT of guns, and would rather not spend focus boosting to hit when it could boost damage instead

and as somebody else mentioned

4. Darius has a gun ... with a 4" AOE and decent POW

[knight_actual]

Stormblades have guns!!!! Gasp. Sudden realization strikes. Rangers!!

[vintersbastard]

The Theme list is a waste of ink and PP should have spent the time and energy giving out a theme to a different caster that they care about because this showed NO creativity at all!

Now come on, it's not an eCaine theme force.

[sleet01]

So anyhow, this theme list has some stuff I've long-desired in a Darius theme list: Stormblades, the option to take light 'jacks, and a bit of extra speed. Yes, it's too bad about Strangewayes, but at least Mechaniks are in there and any lost focus from Power Booster can be made up with Accumulator focus. It would have been nice if the point savings had come in the form of actually cheaper 'jacks, but lets face it: you're going to want a Stormsmith or two with Storm Wall anyhow.

I definitely think this theme is targeted at 50+ point-level games. While it might be possible to reach Tier 4 and gains some benefits at 35 points, I feel like it's more suited to 75-point games with 1+ Colossals. Which sounds like fun with this theme, to me.

[Mod_Donaldbain]

Stop the bickering and keep it on topic.

[Ender101]

I think its a solid tier list. I kind of like that Half Jacks get AD, since it means they might be able to get into a good position to turn into mines, perhaps to protect one of the jacks that are running around. I like the T4 benefit of granting +2 speed to the stormwall too. I don't like the lack of Jr., but we can't have everything I suppose.

I do like it better than the regular Darius tier, as I think that many Sword Knights is boring to play. I suppose that I would rate it as middle of the road, leaning towards good for Cygnar.

Is anyone else stroking their beard in thought about running two Stormwalls with this tier? An extra storm caller and more triangluation points seem like they would do alright. It would also allow Big D to allocate two to each and have some left over to upkeep and boost his own shots. Seems like it could work.

[SirMythos]

I thought of a list with Big D, two Stormwalls, Rangers and 5 Stormsmiths. I think this would have enoght against infantry, since the smiths and both stormwalls could get them down. And a stormwall should work against jacks - espacially with jackhammer. The most exciting thing is the feat, which could repair both stormwalls back to full.

[Calibre]

Of course I was generalizing, but the gist of it remains a true observation. The posters in this board more often than those on other boards shun / dismiss most of the new stuff they get.

Like I said earlier this tier list shows all the signs of not being carefully thought out, it is as if they wanted to add something extra but wasn't really in the mood so they picked a caster that nobody really cares about and threw something together and hope it sticks. There was NO creativity involved when they created this tier and it shows, anyone can see that.

What makes me even more angry is that theme lists doesn't grow on trees we don't get a lot of them, and then when we finally do get one, its something like this. I wouldn't mind if it was a eStryker or a eNemo list of similar format of that of Caine's Street Sweepers a prime caster which has a better tier and really don't need a tier to make him anymore powerful, but this is Darius, dubbed Cygnar's worst and most ugly caster. If you look back to his to his wrecking crew theme it has a synergistic feel to it, you get troops which supports/benefits jacks, heavy jacks cost less, all in all this theme say durable, defensive heavy which compliments Darius' playstyle. This is is well "lets take sum uhmmm rangers to boost our rat...., definitely the stormwall......,stormcallers to kill stealth solo's which we hopefully have LOS to.....and mhhhhh what troops can we use??? well stormguard is not fondly loved by Cygnar players sooooo lets go for stormblades, yes they can't say no to that". Other than the in-game effects gained from this list there is little synergy, you leave it up to your enemy to enter your triagulation zones, your covering fire, your mine fields and yet you are not far enough to stop the enemy from entering/clipping zones. Furthermore this theme suffers even more drawbacks with the lack no magical weapons. So now you've got a ton of mostly accurate shooting with nothing to counter stealth, ethereal stuff.

You will need to be 24" up with the nodes mines and aoe's to provide protection to callers and your heavy jacks and contest the zones but you wouldn't be that far up as you can see, so it only means that you can retaliate on the enemy after they have charge/destroyed your jacks. The mines would be up max 22" and your jacks right behind them this puts your opponent in the perfect position clipping the zone with his 1st line / cannon fodder with his 2nd line hanging back for the counter charge, or all on the front to charge you come next turn. Other than the jacks the solo's and the AD rangers there is little cover for Darius which means your stormwall and your jacks is IT all you have to contest/control zones with and not worth risking putting so far up and at such a huge risk.

[watchgeorgerock]

The only positive thing I can see about this theme force is some Darius fluff. I am not a fan of it. Cygnar needs mercs to work well ( I know, i know dont start that again) I can give up Sylys and Arlan... they are my Darius crutch and help his with one of his only decent combo's. ( Give focus to stormwall, let storm wall run, jack hammer 8 inches away)

[TheSanityAssassin]

Is the pod thing "First turn" or "First time you launch pods"? Could you not hold off launching them until turn 2 or somesuch to actually catch a big chunk of models in the triangulation??

[Oniwasabi]

Is the pod thing "First turn" or "First time you launch pods"? Could you not hold off launching them until turn 2 or somesuch to actually catch a big chunk of models in the triangulation??

When you deploy the pods during your first turn is where that benefit kicks in.

It's a weird tier benefit and the only one in there that (barring truly crazy stuff from my opponent) I doubt I will ever use. Useful against crazy light infantry jam armies I suppose (though most people opt not to take those lists if they think they're facing a whole bunch of covering fire and triangulations). I like the other tier benefits though. Halfjack AD means that I might actually get to set up halfjack mines preemptively for a change. Free stormsmith is basically a 1 point off each Stormwall since I'm planning on bringing 3 stormsmiths in most of my Stormwall lists anyways. +2 SPD on the colossals and the slow jacks is a nice benefit as well. Be nicer if it worked on ALL jacks (even if you still needed 2 ARM 19 jacks to gain the benefit). I doubt I'll ever use it below 50 points though since I'll probably just make it another of my double Stormwall lists for fun and profit.

[bStyker]

The list itself isn't one of those "The Weathermen" type lists, where it's just amazing, instead I feel like it's a decent stylized list that gives you a few benefits to shore up some weaknesses in positioning. The way I see it is that this is a list that forces you to advance on Darius' forces as fast as possible, and the Tier Benefits allow Darius to best position his forces so that it's no easy feat.

First turn. Trample up 10" and deploy 4 Stormpods into out of LOS positions/locations (to limit the enemy picking them off). Half-Jacks prime into mines for next turn.
Second turn. Detonate any Mines you can use. You then have 5 Stormsmiths to clear any engaging infantry on those 2 Stormwalls. Rangers get into position, Stormwalls open up fire, each firing RAT 8-10 heavy guns boosting 4 of those big POW 15 damage rolls, and lay cover fire. Mechanicks fix any damage while Darius camps his 1 focus, or fires his steam cannon at anything he can, boosting if needed.
Third Turn - A repeat of Turn 2, only most likely your opponent will have fewer forces. If anything big (beasts) get through the Disruption web/covering fire/mine field/firing squad, then you can Jackhammer them into the ground and fire away, or feat to fix a Stormwall to mint condition, then rinse and repeat.

... honestly, it seems fine to me. It'll just suffer a little versus any form of capture scenario. This is the list I'm thinking (pre Stormblade-Solo)

Darius (+5) [<-- Sleet, this also always makes me laugh]
- Squire (2)
- Storm wall (19)
- Storm wall (19)
Rangers (5)
Rangers (5)
Stormsmith Stormcallers x 5 (3)
Mechanicks (2)
----- Reinforcements ===> Stormblades w UA & 2 WAs (10)
=50pts

Best,

[WarcasterKramer]

I like this new theme force because it is very unique. Darius is NOT as bad as alot of people think and the ability to repair both collossals back to full while Darius hides behind them is incredible.

I regards to the pods in the tiers - that is awesome. Assuming you go second, your stormwalls start 10 inches up, trample 10, throw pods out 10. That is 30 inches up the board on the first turn. Your opponent probably has infantry close to where those pods start (assuming 7 inch start and a 10-12 inch run on their first turn). If you spread the pods wide, you could have a massive area of the board covered by the pods. Your opponent will have to move into their effective area, and even if they destroy a couple of them, you could throw then out again the next turn and rain down lightning calls all over their army.

2 Stormwalls will be very difficult to beat and even more difficult to 'one-turn' if you have fortify up. And they will be able to do a really good job of holding objectives.