35 Points pMorghoul Hardcore (Cyclops or Bronzeback?)

[bentron4000]

Hey everyone.

I think i'll diverge away from my regular Khador Strakhov list that i use for tourneys and instead use pMorghoul. But I've run into a dilemma.

Currently, my list looks as follows:

pMorghoul
Titan Gladiator
Molik Karn
Cyclops Savage
Cyclops Brute
Max. Gatorman Posse
Paingiver Taskmaster
Min. Paingiver Beasthanlders

I think it's a pretty typical list, and my test games have gone really well so far. However, I haven't [I]really[I] made use of either cyclops yet. The brute, of course, is there for his animus, but so far in my test games i haven't had to use it at all.

This makes me think I should instead use this list:

pMorghoul
Titan Gladiator
Molik Karn
Titan Bronzeback
Max. Gatorman Posse
Paingiver Taskmaster
Min. Paingiver Beasthanlders

Do you think that swapping the utility of the cyclops animuses (animi?) for the pure mashing power of the Bronzeback is a better choice? I have to say, I'm slightly worried that I'll run into a stormwall and want to make sure I'm well enough equipped to drop it.

Any advice would be great, and thanks for reading!

TL;DR: Should pMorhgoul have a Savage and Brute combo, or a titan Bronzeback?

[John Q.]

The Brute's animus is, in my opinion, pretty vital to making Morghoul work. It allows you to run right into the heart of the enemies army and make the most of his small control area for his feat. DEF 17 with immunity to back strikes, knock down, CMAs and CRAs, a couple of transfers and no boosting for the enemy is pretty amazing in terms of survivability.

To go along with that, while Morghoul can get in there and kill whole units on his own, he can't crack armour, and with a bit of luck for positioning (or use a Gladiator as an animus machine/slam tool to position the enemy/secondary threat), an Abused, Enraged Bronzeback can kill two all on his own, often without breaking a sweat. I consider the Bronzeback pretty vital with him too.

A list that I've had good success with for him is

pMorghoul
Bronzeback
Gladiator
Cyclops Shaman
Cyclops Brute
Marketh
Orin Midwinter
Paingivers (min)
Venators (min)
-UA

It gets right into your opponent's face, hits like a train made of bombs, and denies them the chance to hit back at full effectiveness.

[bentron4000]

Thanks JohnQ.

Your advice is noted, and appreciated. I'm doing my best not to be stubborn, but for me, Molik Karn is an integral part of my pMorhgoul lists. And i unfortunately can't find a way to include Molik Karn, a Bronzeback, a Gladiator aaaand a brute all in the same list without dropping my Gatorman Posse.

While considering your advice though, I realized that my list has absolutely no way (aside from pMorghoul's himself) of dealing with incorporeal models. This could be very bad, if i end up seeing Vilmon and pals or something else nasty. I noticed that your list has a Shaman - which i assume is there for casting the brute's/Gladiator's animus - but i'm thinking that might be a very good replacement for the Savage in my list. It'll not only help with casting those useful animus, but it'll aslo give me at least one magic weapon.

I'm curious now about the Shaman. What role does it fill in your list?

TL;DR - Should i instead consider keeping the initial list, but dropping the Cyclops Savage for a Cyclops Shaman in order to get the magic attack?

[viperidae99]

The Shaman brings a lot of great things. He brings a much needed ranged attack (with Ghost Shot), an animus to remove things like Crippling Grasp, and the ability to share animi around like Rush and Beat Back, so your heavy hitters and Morghoul have more fury. If Morghoul zips away but still wants Safeguard, and the Brute can't quite reach him, having the Shaman as a kind of relay to cast the animus has saved my bacon before. And I do love bacon. Worst case scenario, he's a fast beast with Reach to tie stuff up. Since I started taking him in my lists, I haven't used a list without him.

Switching the Savage for him sounds like a good move, as you've got enough slap power with the heavies, and Morghoul seldom needs the Savage animus when he can get two attacks for 1 fury. Beasts enjoy it but then you're not getting Rush or Beatback.