War Room (I know I am being ridunculus)

[PPS_Simon]

This begs the question: Is Simon's mod voice black?

I don't need a mod voice.

[wargolem]

I agree quindraco, but how anyone under forty can run a game company and have such a poor understanding of the net is beyond me. They have a horrible privateerevents.com that in no way functions worth a flip, they are pushing (imho) vaporware in war room, and they do not have a firm grasp of reality when doing product releases - bombardiers, demolisher, etc. etc. (I am a Khador player so I really only know the major release screw ups on our faction).

Tip #1 for marketing - Don?t release things and say they are playable and then wait a freaking year to release the models.

Tip #2 for marketing - keep your community updated

[ucfan34]

Don?t release things and say they are playable and then wait a freaking year to release the models.

As opposed to any other companies who do the same thing (Infinity & Malifaux) or another company (Games Workshop) who puts out books with stats that never see models.

[Cheesy Flip Flips]

Tip #2 for marketing - keep your community updated

They have done an absolutely reasonable job keeping the community updated. They gave us an anticipated release date and subsequently informed us when that date changed. They even provided a status update as to why the release date was changed. I'm not really sure what else we, as a community, could want or expect? It would be totally unreasonable on our behalf to expect Privateer Press to provide us with an hour by hour commentary on the app approval process.....

[Reuben]

Should be released in a week is vapourware? It's not quite Duke Nukem. Also, the other things have nothing to do with the internet. PP had a very clear stated the reasons for such delays, and they are far from unprecedented in miniature gaming companies.
The problem with constantly keeping the community updated is they respond poorly to delays to set expectations. If there's any lesson from this thread, it's that you're better off giving no information at all until the product is actually delivered.

[wargolem]

Obviously some of you like the "if A does it, then B doing it makes it ok" argument. I personally do not. I want PP to succeed and really would love for them to actually get better. Those of you that have been around for a couple of years remember the manufacturing delay that a LOT of vendors were experiencing from PP last year. That coupled with releasing models in the books and then waiting till the next expansion came out to actually release the models is disconcerting.

That being said, I do love this game and they do have great customer service for the most part, but just because I like a game company does not mean I will not call them out on some of their hiccups. War Room was promised in May, got backed up because Tinker house is a small developer that got behind, then got backed up because they added a few things like a list builder that should have been in the rough draft before coding even started, then it was supposed to be June then it was given a semi-firm release date, and now we are waiting on the 3 vendors (app stores) to ok its release. I will still get it and hopefully get all the faction packs with it as well (depending on if I find a plethora of bugs which is what I definitely hope does not happen).

Now you can make snarky little comments and what not, but it does not change the facts. They need to get better on some things and if you want to cheerleader them for not doing those things, then more power to you.

[Fearless]

I made a snide comment about the delay yesterday, but I wanted to comment in a more coherent way, albeit still pretty whiney.

First off, I have an iPad. I think it's silly that they're holding back a simultaneous release. There's no reason my Kindle and Android using brothers and sisters should have to wait for WarRoom just because Apple likes to take their sweet time.

I mean, they don't have iPads, haven't they suffered enough? (I kid, I'm a big fan of both!)

Seriously though, I won't feel left out. So go ahead, let them play.

Moving on....I want to know why the heck after the last MAJOR delay PP decided to put a date on WarRoom?

Seriously why not say, second week in July or something? Why be specific, and then tick a lot of us off when it's late AGAIN?

And.....surely someone in PP or Tinkerhouse knows a thing or two about apps and submitting them. Shouldn't they have been aware that if it goes gold it's going to take some time to submit and therefore won't be out for July 9?

Why, didn't they submit it, let's say July 1st for the July 9th release date? While I'm excited about this app. I do think how the whole thing has been done from the very start has bordered on shoddy. And I'll download it and try it out, but I'm going to test the heck out of it before I spend money on it.

Privateer is usually top-notch with their products and releases. And I do think using tablets and smartphones which are now ubiquitous is bloody brilliant! And a great use of technology!

But the launch, or lack thereof is really disappointing. And the fact that after the last delay in...May was it? They still couldn't hit their target date doesn't speak well.

And let me be clear, it's not a desire to have the app and nerdrage I'm speaking from here. It's a pretty frank appraisal from where I'm sitting. As ever, your mileage may vary.

[DarkLegacy]

Moving on....I want to know why the heck after the last MAJOR delay PP decided to put a date on WarRoom?

Seriously why not say, second week in July or something? Why be specific, and then tick a lot of us off when it's late AGAIN?

And.....surely someone in PP or Tinkerhouse knows a thing or two about apps and submitting them. Shouldn't they have been aware that if it goes gold it's going to take some time to submit and therefore won't be out for July 9?

Why, didn't they submit it, let's say July 1st for the July 9th release date? While I'm excited about this app. I do think how the whole thing has been done from the very start has bordered on shoddy. And I'll download it and try it out, but I'm going to test the heck out of it before I spend money on it.

Privateer is usually top-notch with their products and releases. And I do think using tablets and smartphones which are now ubiquitous is bloody brilliant! And a great use of technology!

But the launch, or lack thereof is really disappointing. And the fact that after the last delay in...May was it? They still couldn't hit their target date doesn't speak well.

And let me be clear, it's not a desire to have the app and nerdrage I'm speaking from here. It's a pretty frank appraisal from where I'm sitting. As ever, your mileage may vary.

They said in the release approximately July 9th, not absolutely July 9th. Most people missed that approximately, as you have.

[brilder]

iBodger fans have plenty reason to be frustrated. It was taken off the app store due to Warroom, and then Warroom gets delayed. I would not be playing this game if not for iBodger.

I'm not bitter about it or anything, but just making a point about how some feelings are justified. The sooner it's released, the sooner we can forget about all this ballyhoo.

[Tossy]

A response as to why there is a delay would be nice... Unless there has been and I have missed it.

I guess the only reason I expect a response is because PP are usually awesome with communication

[DarkLegacy]

A response as to why there is a delay would be nice... Unless there has been and I have missed it.

I guess the only reason I expect a response is because PP are usually awesome with communication

Apple's process for releasing apps takes awhile sometimes and they are doing a simultaneous release across all platforms.

[Lich_Lord_X]

I would not be playing this game if not for iBodger.

Really? I mean I love the app too but building lists isn't that hard, iBodger just makes it so much convenient. Now list building in Fantasy on the other hand, that's near impossible without that overpriced program that I can't talk about on here.

[WarpedWolf]

One last check before bed. Okay, no War Room in the Amazon app store.

No War Room today. War Room tomorrow. There's always War Room tomorrow.

[PG_PolarBearCub]

One last check before bed. Okay, no War Room in the Amazon app store.

No War Room today. War Room tomorrow. There's always War Room tomorrow.

Haha I hope so..It will be really nice to have it tomorrow before I go to the LGS to play some games

[quindraco]

I agree quindraco, but how anyone under forty can run a game company and have such a poor understanding of the net is beyond me. They have a horrible privateerevents.com that in no way functions worth a flip, they are pushing (imho) vaporware in war room, and they do not have a firm grasp of reality when doing product releases - bombardiers, demolisher, etc. etc. (I am a Khador player so I really only know the major release screw ups on our faction).

Tip #1 for marketing - Don?t release things and say they are playable and then wait a freaking year to release the models.

Tip #2 for marketing - keep your community updated

War Room isn't vaporware, it's just delayed. I don't see any reason to accuse PP of lying. The Whitemoon Dreams game is much more vaporware-ish, given the scarcity of information we have about it. Also, their model release policy has nothing to do with internet foibles.

A real example of their misunderstanding of the internet is their pricing scheme for war room. Right now they're hoping to extract between 14 and 60 dollars from every player, because they've misunderstood the sheer magic that is pricing your app at 99 cents per thingy. Rather than 7 per faction with discounts for bulk ordering, they should have done 1 (99 cents, not a dollar, but I'm rounding) per *book*, with Prime and Primal free. None of us would have been able to resist, meaning raw sales would be much larger. There are currently 14 other books that exist (11 faction books, Wrath, Domination, and Colossals), so that's the same 14 per player (but with many more players purchasing), and then instead of up-front money, players are continuing to pay since we'll all gladly fork over 99 cents for each release.

[ringkichard]

If PP charged $1 for the crunchy bits in each new book, would you ever again buy a book?

[azrael71]

I am all for buying e-versions of the rules as well as subscribing to no-quarter in the same fashion.
But the bulk of the cost of such publications is the actual creative part, as such, I would happily pay near to or exactly physical copy prices just for the convenience of space saving, reading on the move and getting new releases on release day, not when the postal service decide to deliver.

But this may be a discussion for another thread

In regards war room, I am happy to pay under the cost of the physical decks.
I don't think PP have missed a trick at all. The app is free with some base cards. If cost is an issue, build your forces using the base cards from those included

[azaminkor]

If PP charged $1 for the crunchy bits in each new book, would you ever again buy a book?

The difference between 1 dollar and 6 dollars in that sense is meaningless. As both are far less than the price of new book. The difference is how I will use that app, where the difference between 1 and 6 is vast.

[Wishing]

If PP charged $1 for the crunchy bits in each new book, would you ever again buy a book?

How is that argument different from what it is like now (as I understand it) - once you have bought a "faction" for Warroom, you get all the crunchy bits from all the future new books for free, so why would you ever again buy a book?

[computertrucker]

I have been so occupied with a new edition of a different game, which is completely awesome I forgot to check on the status of war room untill now. Well back to work, and creating new marine lists.

[PG_kakita]

Ring: By that argument, since the cards come free after a one-time purchase (of $60 for everything), I get all other subsequent cards for free, right? Doesn't that mean I wld never buy a book either?

I'm not arguing for one side or another (I actually have no idea what taking any sides entails), but seriously asking that question.

I don't believe PP is peddling vaporware (I have enough trust in PP in their previous moves to believe that they'll make good on their promise) and am eagerly awaiting the release of War Room. And I will still buy all their books in hardcover (they make for great reading material). But I hope they've thought through their IT and Maintenance costs (and possible implications) of War Room for the future.

[quindraco]

If PP charged $1 for the crunchy bits in each new book, would you ever again buy a book?

As has been noted by others, War Room's real pricing is 0$ for the crunchy bits in each new book once you've forked over the initial 60 to cover every faction (or, if you do it parsimoniously, 7$ to unlock a faction's part of the crunchy bits forever).

[ringkichard]

You're probably right that I'm never going to buy a paper Warmachine book again. PP is going to have to make up my lost book purchases by selling me more figures.
In my case, that's probably an easy task because I haven't bought or played Warmachine recently; War Room is maybe bringing me back to Privateer.
And if I HAVE ALL THE THINGS (read: cards) I'm more likely to start a second faction or come back to PP whenever new cards/books are released, so there's a bonus marketing aspect, too.

The only question is, "How much of my money are they going to get now, in exchange for never selling me a book again, until Mk. III."
$60 seems cheep, honestly.


I think, if a customer has to chose between a new book for $35 or just the crunch for $1, psychologically it's tough to convince most people to buy the book.
I also think that most people would probably only buy their own faction book and the merc book, and then Wrath, Dominion and Colossals. That's $5, and $1 for every new book.
They'd have to publish 55 new books to break even with the $60 I'm planing on dropping on day 1. They're not going to make that up on volume.

[ringkichard]

What I should have said, also, is that I don't think PP wants every player to get War Room.
A little bit of book market cannibalization is fine; adapt or die, and then you can't sell any books at all.
But I don't think they want the $1 price point and rabid adoption that comes with it, or they'd never be able to sell new books again.
And that would kill the whole product line. They could print new books at a loss, but they'd have to raise prices steeply on the models to compensate, and book quality would suffer.

[AnotherMike]

What I should have said, also, is that I don't think PP wants every player to get War Room.
A little bit of book market cannibalization is fine; adapt or die, and then you can't sell any books at all.
But I don't think they want the $1 price point and rabid adoption that comes with it, or they'd never be able to sell new books again.
And that would kill the whole product line. They could print new books at a loss, but they'd have to raise prices steeply on the models to compensate, and book quality would suffer.

Correct me if I'm wrong, and I honestly have no intention for this to sound belligerent, but they're really in the business of making miniatures more than writing fiction. I'm guessing that's the more revenue generating side of their business. In my mind, War Room + Future Updates helps lower the barrier to entry on the figs-side. Less cost for rules nonsense means consumers are more and better able to spend money on the figs side.

Especially since people can find most of the books in pdf on the internet already (it's dirty to say, I know). This way they can turn some of the piracy into revenue. I'm unlikely to drop the money to buy each faction book, but I'd be willing to pick up their decks for <$5.50 apiece bundled in War Room ($60/[6 WM Decks + 5 H Decks] = $5.46).

Or at least that's how I see it. If I don't have to buy the books, I'll probably spend that money on figs....

[MadJack]

If PP charged $1 for the crunchy bits in each new book, would you ever again buy a book?

Abso-freaking-lutly. There's a lot more in the books than the crunch. I happen to enjoy the fluff at least as much as the crunch (probably more), and on top of that there's all the pictures of painted minis, painting/modeling guides, etc. Most people who wouldn't buy the new books probably don't buy them now - they probably just use the cards that come with the minis they buy. I always think those people are cheating themselves out of some of the experience of Warmachine/Hordes, but at the same time, that's kind of the beauty of the way the game is produced. Other than Prime/Primal, for the most part you don't need to buy each book, since you can just use the stat cards that come with the models you buy. War Room is just the logical progression of that. It gives people more choice, so that they can buy or not buy the books as they please.

Edit: for the record, I own every Warmachine/Hordes book that has been printed (including every issue of NQ), way back to original black-and-white Prime. I also own almost all of the IKRPG books (all the ones I've been able to get my hands on), even though I've never played the game, and likely never will. I just really like the setting and the fluff. I'm pretty sure I'm not alone in that.

[PG_somnicide]

I think this is a masterstroke of genius. A different wargame set in a grim future had a new book released which took many people's attention away, now when War Room hits it will pull everyone back.

A scheme so subtle and evil it could have been devised by Everblight himself...

[Trygle]

Why would an app bring people to this game?

The app itself is not the main draw. Giant steam powered mecha are the eyecatchers.

All the app does is serve an existing fanbase.

[quindraco]

Why would an app bring people to this game?

The app itself is not the main draw. Giant steam powered mecha are the eyecatchers.

All the app does is serve an existing fanbase.

War Room v. 2 will have the 3-D rotations of the models in it, which will let anyone with the app ogle the models that haven't got[1]. Also, Hordes hasn't got any of the robots you seem to favor so much, for the record. :-P

[1] This is a joke.

[workwilliam]

For the record, I was brought to this game by the app.

I know the app isn't even out yet, but the fact that a company such as PP would say "Hey, look what we're doing with the cards that are part of the game!" I had looked at Warmachine when I was curious about it, but my initial investigation did not really take for some reason. However, hen I saw that PP was releasing this app, I took a second look, watched the video, and it made enough of an impression on me that I explored the game more and found the rules so much more elegant than 40K (which I was into at the time). The fact that the app seemed like it would be a great tool was attractive, but it was almost more the fact that PP's approach made me say "Why don't all miniature game companies have something like this? It makes so much sense." (whether you agree with that statement or not...) was what drew me to the game and closed the deal.

Since then I've sold off or traded all my 40K minis and have gotten into Warmachine. Admittedly I've only started with Menoth and Khador, and have maybe 40-50 points in each faction, I am eagerly awaiting the app that started me down this road to come out.

Will

[Patryn]

I am wondering if there will be a way to try the app out without purchasing any decks? I'd probably just drop the $60 for a one time fee, but not if I can't even tell if I find the app useable.

[WarpedWolf]

I am wondering if there will be a way to try the app out without purchasing any decks? I'd probably just drop the $60 for a one time fee, but not if I can't even tell if I find the app useable.

You'll be able to use any cards that are part of a 'starter product' for free. This includes Prime, Primal, the battle boxes, and a 'selection' of Merc/Minion/Retribution models.

[Spike77]

I have been calm since the announcment and have not checked the google play store, for some reason that changed today and I find myself now checking it 3 times an hour. Whats wrong with me !!!!!

[Navarp]

This begs the question: Is Simon's mod voice black?

What does Grand Exemplar Kreoss Look like?


Does he look like a Whelp?

[PG_General Nemo]

What does Grand Exemplar Kreoss Look like?


Does he look like a Whelp?

...Wh-what?!

[CrazyMadHatter]

So, any news? My head can only hit the keyboard for so long

[PG_Big K]

For those talking about the price. I am very greatful PP is a company that is very reasonable, another gaming company that shall remain nameless, based in the UK is charging more for the digital copies of a single codex than buying the actual codex. And here we are able to have an ap like war room for free, and for $60 only you get every faction, and every update till MKIII comes out. Pretty awesome and well worth the wait even if it is still maybe a week away. In the sceme of things PP players are spoilt.

[blitzmonkey]

...Wh-what?!

It's a pulp fiction reference

[AJ the Ronin]

It's a pulp fiction reference

You should have said: Say "what" one more goddamn time, I dare you.

It fitted so perfectly that I think he knew.

[BilesyBelcher]

...Wh-what?!

Say "What" again!