Mordikaar FT

[Yertle4]

I haven't much talk about this guy, and IMO he probably got the biggest nerfstick in the entire Field Test. His spell list is 75% garbage, and he costs +4 pts. Good feat, good melee weapon, good ranged weapon, 25% good spell list....

That's all theorymachine of course, as I haven't playtested him. Mostly because I never played him before.

I was wondering what those of you who have played him thought.

[tensteam]

I've played with him and I'm not impressed at all. Your impressions seem very true as I like both his melee weapon and especially ranged weapon. The bad thing is that the spell list really is garbage. Revive is the spell he needs to cast every turn, but it drains his fury. Death Sentence has its uses as does an occasional Ghost walk, but Void Gate and Essence blast are just bad. To be honest playing with Mordikaar in MkII is more frustrating than fun as you cannot do what you'd like because the fury shortage. The spells just cost too much.

I've got no idea why he is considered the strongest warlock with only +4 warbeast points.

[Yertle4]

To be honest playing with Mordikaar in MkII is more frustrating than fun as you cannot do what you'd like

Almost all my playtest games are vs warmachine, so I find that playing FT Skorne in Mk II is more frustrating than fun :P

At least, when I'm actually playtesting and forcing myself to take the Gladiator (and I regret it every game, and have the same feedback every game) and other subpar models. Sometimes I'm surprised, often not.

I basically just want to make sure that he gets lots of playtest feedback, because he seems like he totally sucks and there's not much forum rage about it.

[Mutton]

He got generic;D. I feel it was a complete overnerf to the crazy power of him with kitties in mk1; all his spells basically got more costly and less potent.

[Deathraven]

He got generic;D. I feel it was a complete overnerf to the crazy power of him with kitties in mk1; all his spells basically got more costly and less potent.

This. He got such bad treatment I can't think of what to put as feedback that doesn't amount "You monsters, put him back! Sob sob."

[werecat]

SO agreed. He's woefully underpowered as of now, but I have no idea how to fix him...

[Mutton]

Step 1: Lamentation
Step 2: Essence Blast is SP8
Step 3: Drop Revive for SiA or give him a Soul mechanic. I'd rather the first to keep him unique, but SiA was his spell, and now it's gone for a spell he can barely use.
Step 4: An upkeep version of Ghost Walk. It's too expensive for him. Cryx can cast it due to Skarlocks.
Step 5: ???
Step 6: PROFIT!

[Draekon Darkstorm]

Essence Blast should be 2Fury range Spray 8" to at least make it somewhat attractive to cast. Currently, Fury 3 with the loss of a model from play is to steep.

Draekon

[Deathraven]

What would be a way to bring spirit in amber back without it being too powerful? Maybe if the returned model couldn't charge, so it's attack wasn't as powerful or as logner threat?

[Joroth]

I agree as well, that his current spell list is what makes him very sub par. The +4 beast points can be due to the fact he can effectively cut himself for fury and heal it back with Death Blast.

My suggestion is
1. Give back Manifest Void to replace Void Gate. Void Gate is not that good, it's terrible not for what it does (because it CAN screw with the opponent easily enough), but because it costs so much. Either give back Manifest Void, drop the spell to 3 and remain an upkeep spell, or keep the same cost and up it to an AOE 5

2. Spirit in Amber really needs to return in lieu of Revive, if they are worried about it be abused, then make SiA cost 2 fury instead of 1. I think that would be fair

3. Death Sentence isn't that bad it definitely still see use I think, I prefer the old Doom Marker, but mainly for ridiculous damage Molik.

4. Either make Essence Blast SP 8, or increase the damage to 6/7 + base STR of chosen model.

5. I'm not very sure what to do with Ghost Walk. Void Walker was awesome, but a bit good. If he could gain something similar that was an upkeep, I think he'd be set

[Yertle4]

It just goes to show how easy pulling yourself out of death is in Immoren.

[Deathraven]

Here's my 2c on his spell list, bear in mind I've had very few ft games with him yet.

Death sentence: The spell would be fine if we had a channeler, as it is only useable when someone gets cheaky with their flankers.
Essence blast: spray six is fine by me as the improvements to spray balance it out. Main problem is no SiA to position the shot and I'm NOT pay 6 fury to do it with revive!
Ghost walk: pricey spell in a big list o pricey spells, otherwise fine.
Revive: major issue here, simply too costly and it puts his cheapest spell up from 1 to 2. And the 2 is death sentence which is highly situational and then it's 3 next.
Void gate: Looks good on paper, wish I could afford to cast it!

So as you've probably guessed my main problem (apart from revive sucking) is that even as a fury 7 he can't afford to cast more than 2 spells a turn. Possible solution is bring back a limited form of SiA and knock down the cost of essence blast to 2. Really though this guy would be happier in a cryx army as he needs a skarlock and an arc node BAD!

[Amon]

Mordikaar really suffers from having spells that simply cost far too much fury. I'd suggest:

1. Drop that void gate nonsense and replace it with Lamentation. He already has an attack spell (essence blast) and Lamentation is closer to what he used to do.
2. Increase essence blast to SP 8 and raise the POW by 1 or decrease its cost to 2.
3. Revive has to go. It's simply too expensive for what it does, especially since Mordikaar is already overflowing with massively expensive spells and has no way to boost his fury. Bring back SiA either at a cost of 2 per casting or keep it at 1 but models revived by it don't get to charge. The former would mean less ressurected minis overall, the latter would stop the biggest threat from it. Either would decrease the big problem of the exploding kitties that was so common in MKI.

[patisarat]

Played with Mordikaar yesterday and beat an Adeptis Rahn assassination list by the skin of my teeth.

I only played with Mordikaar a few times in MkI, but I really enjoyed using him. Obviously the nerfing of his spell list is a huge difference. Everything else is still great, but the spells just don't fit together - they are all too expensive and all too situational, and it's just not much fun to use him any more.

The good:
The feat still rocks. Simply awesome: it's one of those really offensive and aggressive kind of defensive feats, like Saeryn's.

His ranged attack Death Blast is like an extra 3-Fury spell for free each round (identical to Hex Blast except for the special effect). And he can get an aiming bonus. I killed 4 Sentinels with it in one hit and healed 8 points back.

The bad (his spells):

Revive is too expensive for a very situational spell. Can't imagine casting it unless there is a great charge lane available for a Cetratus or two. Give us back SiA at 2 Fury, that would be fine.

SP6 range on Essence Blast is weak weak weak. I have to RFP one of my models for this at 3 Fury?

Why oh why is Ghost Walk not upkeepable? It seems like a classic sort of upkeep spell. But since Deneghra already has the same spell listed, it won't be changing to suit us.

I did actually use Void Gate to stop a jack from being allocated focus at a critical time, and it was really good (no Shake Effect for you, Chimera!), but that's most of his Fury gone right there. If the AOE followed the target model around like some other spells do (Blight Bringer), then it would be worth the cost, I think.

So the verdict: Great feat and ranged attack, and he has some nice situational tricks, but a weak and incohesive spell list means he is overcosted and hard to use outside the feat turn.

[Benj]

I won't be able to play games during the fieldtest so this is purely theorymachine, but would it help his case if the "trooper channeling" part of Essence Blast was changed to a generic rule on Mordikaar? For starters he should get much more use out of Death Sentence that way. Casting Void Gate wouldn't automatically risk Mordikaar's life, and using a trooper you might get close enough to negate deviation. Or you could throw a first turn Void Gate through a Bloodrunner to be upkept at a choke point.

Essence Blast would have to be changed to use the STR of its point of origin. Side effect would be Mordikaar being able to cast it from himself without it costing a model.

[lord tyrant watt]

Since Mordikaar was becoming my favorite warlock in Mk1, the dramatic changes have left me at a loss on what to do with him. These are my suggestions for Mordikaar.

1, give him spirit rendering back. Its fun and fluffy.
2, His spell list is lacking.
A. Death Sentence is not Doom Mark, but it is a MK2 replacement. I personally would like to see "marked for death".
B. Essence Blast, is an O.K. spell i think i cast it once is Mk1. i just like the use of my troops more. Range 8 would fix this.
C. Ghost Walk. Once again, its an MK2 replacement. I too would love to see it as an upkeep. Dont get your hopes up though.
D. Revive. This is where his list goes waaaayy down hill. this spell does not belong a caster that doesnt collect souls or gain extra fury in some way.
My suggestion: Spirit In Amber:cost 1 , bring back 1 trooper model for each fury spent up to 3. These models are destroyed at the end of this turn. This spell may be cast once per turn. This fix would make it useable and not overpowered.
E. Void Gate. Mordikaar does not need this expensive spell. He has to get Manifest Void back. If thats not an option, give him lamentation.

Feat: its good as written, but not with the spell list that mordikaar has. With the spells he has it requires him to be close to the front lines, which is not good because he has to use all of his fury in a turn.
If you play him from the back, a ranged army can now walk out of it and blast the skorne army without any affects of the feat.
I suggest taking back to MK1. Its the only board control feat the Skorne have, and it lets us survive against a heavy ranged list like Cygnar and Retribution.

What do you think?

[Draekon Darkstorm]

I gave feedback on the following.

Essence Blast - To expensive for the current costs required and with the short range. A range 6" spray, for a Fury cost of 3 and the removal from play of a faction model should be way stronger than the AVG pow of 11. 12 if we use a cataphract and a whopping 13 with a Cyclops/Krea. It really is just extremely overcosted for what it currently does.

Revive - Horrible on a caster that has no way of getting extra souls such as the Testament. Combined with the Essence Blast removal from play, it prevents the effective use of either spell.

Death Sentence - A useful spell that would be a great benefit if 80% of the army could use it without exposing Mordikaar to danger since he has to get so close to use it.

Void Gate - Overcosted, and not worth using. I suggested that it be replaced with Blight Field, same AoE, same effects just loses the damage portion, but does open up more tactical planning on blocking avenues of attack.

Draekon

[DarkWonderer]

I won't be able to play games during the fieldtest so this is purely theorymachine, but would it help his case if the "trooper channeling" part of Essence Blast was changed to a generic rule on Mordikaar? For starters he should get much more use out of Death Sentence that way. Casting Void Gate wouldn't automatically risk Mordikaar's life, and using a trooper you might get close enough to negate deviation. Or you could throw a first turn Void Gate through a Bloodrunner to be upkept at a choke point.

Essence Blast would have to be changed to use the STR of its point of origin. Side effect would be Mordikaar being able to cast it from himself without it costing a model.

I realy like the idea of Void Channeling. However PP hates effects that cheat on deviations (look at Stormblades UA and it's changes for mthe field test). That said it would be the most simple way to fix at least some of his problems.

[D.Vader]

What do you think?

I agree with you on a lot of points. Mordikaar was my favorite skorne caster hands down. I been mulling over him since the field test released, hoping that it was just the fact my favorite caster changed that made me feel like he wasn't right but I still do unfortunately.

I feel his stats, weapons, void lord, and feat are good but the spell list is where he is significantly lacking. I'm fine with death sentence, I too would prefer marked for death, but that's okay. Essence blast is hard for me to swallow. It's expensive in both fury and resources for a 6 inch spray when a well known cryx caster can have an 8 inch spray with corrosion for 2 focus.

Void gate is an expensive and hard to use effectively spell. Manifest void should be brought back IMHO but without the limitation on denying enemy souls, or perhaps in some way to collect skorne souls if he's to keep revive.

Revive is another problem spell for him. I totally understand he's got more fury than ToM has focus but Mordikaar needs to have a bit of fury left each turn. He does not have the ability to arc as ToM does. This forces him to play a bit more upfield which often means he needs to hold onto a fury or two which in turn limits what he can cast with 3 expensive spells. IMHO you're only able to cast revive once a turn when things really get going. I think Lord Tyrant Watt's solution for for restoring Spirit in Amber is a good idea. It helps bring back his utility while not being overpowered.

Ghost walk is a great spell but when combined with 2 other high cost spells it will see very limited use IMHO.

His overall "cost" of 4 warbeast points seems a bit off too. I really hope he sees a redo before Jan. Just my 2 cents.

[Hollywoodxxl]

Almost all my playtest games are vs warmachine, so I find that playing FT Skorne in Mk II is more frustrating than fun :P

At least, when I'm actually playtesting and forcing myself to take the Gladiator (and I regret it every game, and have the same feedback every game) and other subpar models. Sometimes I'm surprised, often not.

I basically just want to make sure that he gets lots of playtest feedback, because he seems like he totally sucks and there's not much forum rage about it.

WOW, Im actually gonna agree with you for once. Mordikarr is garbage.
Ill make it real simple. The Makedas are the ONLY competitve lock we have now

[Mutton]

WOW, Im actually gonna agree with you for once. Mordikarr is garbage.
Ill make it real simple. The Makedas are the ONLY competitve lock we have now

I still think eMorg is competitive.

[Yertle4]

So is Xerxis. That's about half.

[Mutton]

Poor Mordikaar though... I wonder what would fix Zaal, other than just fixing AGs, does he need much?

Idea: Let Mordi have up to 5 souls, turn into fury, the normal deal.

[werecat]

So is Xerxis. That's about half.

Better than some warmachine factions could have said during the FT.

[Hollywoodxxl]

Since Mordikaar was becoming my favorite warlock in Mk1, the dramatic changes have left me at a loss on what to do with him. These are my suggestions for Mordikaar.

1, give him spirit rendering back. Its fun and fluffy.
2, His spell list is lacking.
A. Death Sentence is not Doom Mark, but it is a MK2 replacement. I personally would like to see "marked for death".
B. Essence Blast, is an O.K. spell i think i cast it once is Mk1. i just like the use of my troops more. Range 8 would fix this.
C. Ghost Walk. Once again, its an MK2 replacement. I too would love to see it as an upkeep. Dont get your hopes up though.
D. Revive. This is where his list goes waaaayy down hill. this spell does not belong a caster that doesnt collect souls or gain extra fury in some way.
My suggestion: Spirit In Amber:cost 1 , bring back 1 trooper model for each fury spent up to 3. These models are destroyed at the end of this turn. This spell may be cast once per turn. This fix would make it useable and not overpowered.
E. Void Gate. Mordikaar does not need this expensive spell. He has to get Manifest Void back. If thats not an option, give him lamentation.

Feat: its good as written, but not with the spell list that mordikaar has. With the spells he has it requires him to be close to the front lines, which is not good because he has to use all of his fury in a turn.
If you play him from the back, a ranged army can now walk out of it and blast the skorne army without any affects of the feat.
I suggest taking back to MK1. Its the only board control feat the Skorne have, and it lets us survive against a heavy ranged list like Cygnar and Retribution.

What do you think?

Spot on as always....

I however loved essence blast. At his fury 7 he could effectivly wipe out troopers better with the spray than the individual models could by charging in. Spirit in Amber would be used from turn 2 on in every game. I will NEVER cast revive. I actually though it was a typo at 3 fury. I wouldnt even mind seeing puppet strings with mordy.

PPs efforts to get the warlocks and casters more active in the battle and not just spamming from afar...blood boon, vortex of destruction, The new Absolonya etc... unfortunatley with the current fury leech rules mordy is too squishy for near front line shenanagans

[Hollywoodxxl]

Better than some warmachine factions could have said during the FT.

Is this sarcasam or for real?

I play Khador as my WM faction and with the exception of pvlad and old witch I think we made out pretty good

[Hollywoodxxl]

I still think eMorg is competitive.

His feat is awesome. Prolly top 3 in the game!

But, without entropy hes not killing much in warmachine. Flashing blade? really? Can we at least have 360 front arc? Acrobatics? Forget all that, ill trade all that for vanish triggering once per activation DURING HIS ACTIVATION after destroying an enemy model.

[Yertle4]

Flashing Blade is pretty sweet. I've had opponents try to swarm him with troops as a follow up to his feat (since I usually use it to deliver my army closer), and Flashing Blade allows you to cut a way out, walk out, do your thing, and vanish away. More useful in gameplay than it looks on paper...

[greenlock]

Isn't mordikaar supposed to be around Void spirits in the fluff? Why not add something like A Void Spirit in this models control area gains +2 to attack and damage rolls and increase the FA of Void spirits with him by 1 or give him an extra for free.

[Helion]

Hrmm, I'd have to agree that Revive is definitely the biggest hole in Mordi's profile. Void Gate seems like it could be ok if we had a channeler of some sort. Personally I think the Cyclops Shaman should be made a channeler, but that's beside the point.

Another problem with Mordi is that his weapons would make him ace, if he could reliably hit anything with either attack without boosting. MAT 6 RAT 5 is going to eat a lot of Fury in boosts against anything but Heavy warbeasts, then he'll probably want to boost damage with either one in that event.

Overall, I think his cost is eaten up by the possibility of a POW 15-18 Eidolon or him eating a few Shield wall troopers to heal him after cutting. Unfortunately, that also means his spell list suffers quite a bit. I'd rather him lose Parasitic Curse and regain SiA or another spell that makes him more of a spell threat than stay the way he is.

[Yertle4]

Isn't mordikaar supposed to be around Void spirits in the fluff? Why not add something like A Void Spirit in this models control area gains +2 to attack and damage rolls and increase the FA of Void spirits with him by 1 or give him an extra for free.

We could call the rule 'Void Lord' and it could give Void Spirits boosted attack rolls while they are in his control area.

Man, that would totally make him good!

[Helion]

We could call the rule 'Void Lord' and it could give Void Spirits boosted attack rolls while they are in his control area.

Man, that would totally make him good!

man, I wonder why Privateer didn't think of that...

I just can't place what else to do with Mordi. In my head, I played with the idea of healing, or reviving Void Spirits if they fall, provided you had one to begin with. Too much?

[D.Vader]

No update for Mordikaar. Hopefully he'll see revision before the final document.

[Hollywoodxxl]

We could call the rule 'Void Lord' and it could give Void Spirits boosted attack rolls while they are in his control area.

Man, that would totally make him good!

What about void lord ability in his command range for boosted damage??

My FT game with him went bad....couldnt stop Kromac chopping me down.

Void gate was too easily avoided, and Ghost walk should be upkeepable or essance blast be 2 fury or make Mordy an 8 fury. Revive is horrible unless its a scenario game and you MUST use it. Too many expensive spells. Nothing left for transfers

[sirspen]

I finally got a game in with old lanterns (which I have honestly been dreading seeing as I'm an individual who likes to win and could not possibly comprehend a situation in which i would be able to perform at any level with this caster) and i had experienced an unusual anomaly. There were several points within the game in which I did not want to cast a spell. I mean i WANTED to cast spells, but I just could think of a spell to cast nor any reason to cast any of his spells. The only spell that crossed my mind to cast was Ghost Walk, but its hardly worth it at 3 FUR and not being upkeepable.

The whole situation was disheartening, to say the least, and i feel that it made my enjoyment of that particuar battle considerably less enjoyable. I felt that I was forced to leave even more up to chance more than I normally do (seeing as my caster, what should be the CENTER of my army, felt as though it served no role). And when i did finally feel that casting a spell would be a boon to my cause I was unable to cast as many spells as i would have preferred due to there high cost and short range.

The fact that noting has been said about him in any of the updated is discerning (in my humble opinion) as it feels more like a penalty to take this caster than a benefit. I have left extensive feedback (being about a page and a half's worth) and for those of you who feel that change for this figure is necessary I suggest you do the same. The complete retooling of Absylonia and Rhyas gives me hope that, if we try hard enough, we might accomplish this daunting task.

[Yertle4]

The question is - what is Mordikaar's win condition? Or at least, what it his game plan?

[sirspen]

The question is - what is Mordikaar's win condition? Or at least, what it his game plan?

This is the problem (or so it feels), he really has none. You might be able to argue that essence blast is his win condition, but if so it is one of the worst ones i have ever seen. And his game plan is... lacking to say the least. I believe that he not only needs an almost entirely new spell list, but also need to be given some direction (as you stated, he seems to have none). Unfortunately I do not know how to give him direction or what spells to give him, all i could do was point out his flaws and hope PP finds a way.

(though this might not be the right direction to take as PP seemed to have looked at his stats and went "ohhhh yeah, this guy is so awesome; well only give him +4 beast points" "yeah, hes really only a small step down from eThag right?".)

[Deathraven]

To be honest I think the only way for PP to even get on the road to fixing him without a big rewrite is to make him fury 8. At least then he can afford his crazy expensive spell list and his essence blast 'win condition' will at least have boosted hit or damage when you fire 2 off.

[Amon]

@ Sirspen: That is just terrible, and I nearly ran into the same situation with Zaal the other day. At least Zaal has hex blast, but it's a bad day when your warlock just doesn't have anything to do.

The question is - what is Mordikaar's win condition? Or at least, what it his game plan?

The last time I played Mordikaar his game plan was something along the lines of "call in sick and have eMakeda lead the army instead." It totally worked too--Kaya was getting all pumped up and shouting stuff like "Hang on to your bathrobe Mordikaar, because here I come! Woldwyrd I choose you--spirit door assassination run activate!" But when she got there she was really surprised and was all like "Oh, Makeda what are you doing here? I thought this was Mordikaar's house!" Then Makeda knifed her and dragged the body out to the dumpster in the back alley, but there was no room to hide it in there because Mordikaar was already inside.

True story.

[sirspen]

@ Sirspen: That is just terrible, and I nearly ran into the same situation with Zaal the other day. At least Zaal has hex blast, but it's a bad day when your warlock just doesn't have anything to do.

Thank you for your sympathy, it is indeed a sad day when you move your warlock and then end his activation without performing a single action. my opponent even took pause, looked at his spell list, became silent for a few seconds and had all he could say was "I'm sorry".