Good round up JDAntoine!
Got another game in with him and put it up in my report log. Link is in my signature
Good round up JDAntoine!
Got another game in with him and put it up in my report log. Link is in my signature
Followed the link and decided to pick out this snippet, because I think it's a great rundown for Irusk 2 builds and the flexability he offers in terms of the infantry and solo's applied.
For me the prime reason to pick Irusk 2 is indeed his toolbox or awnser to everything. I love it because unlike a Wurmwood or Lylyth or Sorscha it doesn't really ask a question but it sure does awnser the opponents questionIrusk2
Just such a toolbox caster really. Feels like he has something for every situation.
Not sure why he was here. Did nothing in this game and doesn't really help the list at all.
Never really got going due to Rasks feat. However the 20" threat on his guns in this list is great.
Simple, cheap and great! Prefer it to a rager here since Irusk has Artifice and bodies to keep him safe. It also provides a second jack who's melee threat really can't be ignored.
Every day he's tinkering!
Very nice that he can focus on boosting while Irusk gives the winter guard tough instead of relying on him.
Iron Fang Ulhans
It's good having a serious melee threat that's not a jack here. Looking forward to having Battle Lust on them
Nice to have some extra range that can operate independently of the rest of the army.
Winter Guard Field Gun
This thing is great with Fire For Effect! I know folk like the mortar with that spell, but I definitely prefer the field gun.
Winter Guard Rifle Corps
The winter guard broken corps are great. Nuff said.
Reinholdt sometimes helps and sometimes doesn't, he doesn't benifit from the Tactician and that's a thing, Airburst covers some Stealth problems but in general I do agree Sylys does more. Hand of Fate Airburst is generally better as removing Stealth on a model or having an additional Hand Cannon shot.
Behemoth remains the first pick for Irusk 2, always, because of Solid Ground and honestly I feel the same for Iron Flesh Warcasters and generally I think a ton of lists just profit from what he does. Again the comparison I sometimes read between it and two Juggernauts does not apply on the board. 20" threat ranges vs 8" threat ranges are a thing.
Juggernaut is cheap and that's really why I love him in my build aswell. Alten Ashley seems really cool and so does the Gobber Tinker because they are always cool.
Iron Fang Uhlans currently are amongst the best punching unit we have and with a massive threat range aswell. As you said, give them Battle Lust, Fury or other damage boosters and you can seriously wreck heavies. For Irusk 2 their use is even more increased because of Tactician, it's great and glorious really. IF you have Reinholdt I really like the Winter Guard Field Gun Crew, otherwise I like the Mortar Crew more, by large because Stealth can really stop the thing really quick and most Irusk 2 lists generally do not have the room for a Torch next to Behemoth.
Thanks for sharing your reflections Dave, was a good win! I can also really advice on running a max unit of Iron Fang Pikemen or Kayazy Assassins with him because the spam becomes real. A ton of Caine 2 lists are prepaired for dealing with two units throughout the game, three make a real difference .
The one thing I continue to love with Irusk 2 is the mix and match of units for him. Litterly every unit in Khador (our biggest strenght) has a point of contention with Irusk 2, Iron Fang, Winter Guard and Kayazy, it all works but gives different strengths and weaknesses to the list.
Good comments JD!
Couple little things:
1) When saying Behemoth threats 20" it's only fair to say the juggernaut threats 10"
2) I feel something with repair is needed when running Behemoth. Otherwise it's really easy for him to loose his subcortex and then his ranged game drops a lot!
Good shout on the third unit call. I might try infantry spam with him at some point, though I think I'll try it with Irusk1 first. Probably running shock troopers, pikemen and winter guard.
I agree overall on him being an answer caster for sure. As you say Wurmwood/Haley2/etc ask a question (or several) of your opponent whereas Irusk2 looks at what his opponent is doing and picks the best action to deal with it. Feels really flexible as a caster now. I do like question casters (Karchev/Harkevich/Strakhov/Vlad2 for example) but I really like how each turn with Irusk2 starts with feeling like you have several different options for how to deal with the enemy army.
I think I'm going to switch things around slightly on the solo selection based on what this wants to play in tot. Will report back once I get some more games in with him.
Looking very forward to it! And your right considering 10/20" threat ranges with Juggernaut and Behemoth, consider that changed, it certainly is a fairer anylysis but the point that's still very much there is that Behemoth has twice the threat range and that certainly means he's worth twice the cost.
On top of that, one of the few Objectives I think remains incredible for Behemoth/Winter Guard Mortar Crew/Winter Guard Field Gun Crew is Armory and it again covers one of the few weaknesses Irusk has because if POW 8 Airburst Blast damage isn't going to cut it, you might want to go for another single magical shot or alternatively it allows you to use that focus for Battle Lust.
It makes the Obective a wonderful choice into PoM at least and they massively suffer under Irusk 2's Feat because SPD is not PoM biggest strenght this edition. Versus Cryx and Skorne any additional Magical Shot is also very welcome because they have the Incorporeal pieces and obviously you'd also want it into Haley 3 if you expect that to remain a thing in your local meta.
Repairs are cool for Behemoth but I personally have not found it to be that much of a problem. In theory if you expect the Sub-Cortex to be removed quickly (which really requires Kell Bailoch and what more?) you can still Fire for Effect Behemoth on the first turn. It's silly but ensures him being effective. Altough I've played more than one game where I didn't even need to give Behemoth that additional extra focus, a lot of times the Mortar Crew and Irusk 2 himself also provide more than sufficient AoE's.
The 3rd unit has been working wonders for me, especially paired with the two Warjacks being Behemoth and Juggernaut. For many opponents it's just too damn much to chew through. I also propose the use of minimum units of Winter Guard Rifle Corps in order to find the points for that. In all my games the Rocketeers end up actually mattering the most and while WGRC are nice your anti-infantry coverage is allready massive if you include a Behemoth and Mortar. On top of that Iron Fang Pikemen/Iron Fang Uhlans with Cover/Rough Terrain do a really fine job at poking away at faces aswell.
Looking forward to your next report, had a Butcher 1 battle yesterday which used 3 Rocketeers on Feat turn to seal the deal. Because of that nonsence I continue to be open for any Irusk 2 pairing but will not remove Irusk 2 from it if my intend would be to win a Tournament.
JD - moving the musing about infantry choices (and really what we are talking about is that tinkering with the engine that is already going 385 Horsepower to up it to 405)
Slyss/Reinie (I think completely dependent on your other list. Both have strengths and weakness and no obvious choice (an underappreciated downside of Reinholdt is that he doesn't see through Khador models so you may not be able to get LOS in B2B for destealthing)
Kodiak (though I have also run it with Devestator - again I don't think a bad choice)
Now this is not the chain saw build but what I live about it is the ability for further threat extension. I run it as the pie plate of doom - with Uhalns up front and then the Doomies behind - possibly as far as 4.1 inches to avoid electro leaps.
But one could change it for the pikes to get
BDI (w/out UA)
We have precision strike without the UA which with battle lust is arguably huge. A Single battle lusted BD into say a Ironclad is doing Dice off 5 or 9 to 10 points. There are 11 boxes on that chassis on Columns 4 and 5 and if you take out the cortex that thing just ins't that good. 2 Pikes will pretty much ruin it between removing the cortex and the Quake Hammer.
When I referred to "steady" in the other thread it was in reference to the IFK. So with Steady on Solid ground we don't NEED him for that...nor with Black Dragons do we need precision strike. We could, however, go Vanilla Dragons without UA add the IFK for precision strike and pick that up on the Uhlans as well (rolling 4D6-2 on that charge with battlelust into Ironclad.
Yeah great part of the forum to discuss Irusk 2 lists right? In any case, I do like your idea here but I feel the maximum unit of Winter Guard Rifle Corps is not that much needed, in reality I've more than once found that the power from this unit straight up comes from the Rocketeers. The CRA's WGRC provide are nice but I feel the infantry coverage of this list is great as is. In both the lists you present I see ways to unjam the Uhlans and generally speaking that's all that really matters.
With your old list my personal gripe is that Doom Reavers do not massively profit from the spells Irusk 2 has available to them.
Most importantly being Battle Lust. I do like Doom Reavers in theory but I also do not think they make great unjam models because of Berserk. Swinging right back at the Uhlans is not something I'd like. Going full Doom Reavers (4x) is a different matter because you can spam them while having focus for Airburst and all of that.
However the new list you presented certainly brings up an interesting design and honestly my advice is just to for it! With a slight alteration to the Black Dragons, because if you drop the WGRC to a minimum unit (shave 5 points) and a UA (1 point left) you can either upgrade the Rager to a Juggernaut or even Ruin by handing in the Eliminators. Which from my honest perspective seems like a better overall plan. Which is the list I'd be willing to test. Black Dragons by themself can be sufficient but I really value the additional movement a ton of Iron Fang bring. Unjam/Charge/Protect/Repeat.
I personally don't believe the Iron Fang Kovnik adds much to any Irusk 2 force (same with Markhov) because as you said there are abilities gained and paid for that you do not need. What I like a ton about Black Dragons here is side-step. With the 12+ games I've had with the regular Iron Fang Pikemen in the build I have found that Reposition is amazing with Tactician and there is no reason to why Side-Step will not do the same. The advantage you have is that against some niche things who can become Stationary you do have an awnser within your force.
Hi all! I just joined the forums and decided to put a battle report up as my inaugural post! I am have played Warmachine for the past three years, but always in fits and starts with school and life getting in the way. I have decided to become a little more serious in hobby, but still feel very new especially with MK 3. I loved Irusk 2 in MK 2 so I decided to give him a go again. I saw JDAntoine’s list and fell in love with it. Sorry for blatantly stealing it, but it seemed too good to pass up! Note- Sorry for the long battle report, I was so pumped after winning this game that I immediately sat down after and wrote this up. I will try to be more concise in the future.
War Room Army- My Army
Theme: No Theme Selected
75 / 75 Army
Supreme Kommandant Irusk - WJ: +27
- Sylys Wyshnalyrr, The Seeker - PC: 4
- Behemoth - PC: 24 (Battlegroup Points Used: 24)
- Juggernaut - PC: 12 (Battlegroup Points Used: 3)
Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich - PC: 4
Iron Fang Pikemen - Leader & 9 Grunts: 15
- Iron Fang Pikemen Officer & Standard - Officer & Standard: 4
Iron Fang Uhlans - Leader & 4 Grunts: 20
Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 5 Grunts: 8
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
- Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
Winter Guard Mortar Crew - Gunner & Grunt: 5
War Room Army- My Opponent
Protectorate of Menoth -
Theme: No Theme Selected
75 / 75 Army
Thyra, Flame of Sorrow - WJ: +29
- Hierophant - PC: 3
- Blood of Martyrs - PC: 16 (Battlegroup Points Used: 16)
- Devout - PC: 9 (Battlegroup Points Used: 9)
- Reckoner - PC: 16 (Battlegroup Points Used: 4)
- Reckoner - PC: 16
Vassal of Menoth - PC: 3
Wrack - PC: 1
Wrack - PC: 1
Vassal Mechanik - PC: 1
Nicia, Tear of Vengeance - PC: 5
The Covenant of Menoth - PC: 4
Vassal of Menoth - PC: 3
Choir of Menoth - Leader & 5 Grunts: 6
Daughters of the Flame - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10
Daughters of the Flame - Leader & 5 Grunts: 10
We played Steamroller 2016 Scenario #1- Entrenched
I won the die roll and decided to go first. My opponent chose the side with the wall near the zone and a forest on her extreme left flank.
I set up my units with IFP on right flank with Behemoth to anchor. WGRC on left with Juggernaut to anchor. IFU behind them all with Irusk the WGM and Sylys next to him. (Sorry for stealing that as well JD!)
She sets up with Thyra in center with the choir and support models surrounding her. Blood of Martyrs and Reckoner on her left flank and Reckoner and Devout on Right. She ADs the daughters between the two flanks and Nicia on her extreme right flank behind a building.
First turn- I go first I run/move everyone up. I have iron fangs mini feat to move up to 11” in shield wall. Irusk casts energizer to get the jacks up and casts solid ground and ffe on the mortar.
Her first turn- ran/moved everything up. Caster casts occultation on the choir. Choir sings Passage on her jacks. Vassal of Menoths give the Reckoner and Blood of Martyrs on my right flank enliven.
Top of 2nd- I move my iron fangs up 6" in shield wall. Irusk activates and moves up behind screen of Uhlans and Forest. Caster casts energizer to move himself up a little more and to allow behemoth to move two inches. Casts artifice of deviation to give the front line of IFP cover and to make life hard for the Daughters and jacks next turn. Juggernaut toes into the forest. Behemoth activates and aims (I forgot the sisters had stealth) and shot both bombards, both deviating into nowhere. WGRC activate and move into the forest. Slightly out of the LOS of her units due to the forest. Joe moves up behind them. Jug moves up to anchor the WGRC. Mortar moves up again and is sad panda as it still cannot gain LOS on anything.
Bottom of two- Thyra upkeeps occulation. She activates her caster to move up into her zone behind her jacks and feats. First group of daughters charges into my zone, surround and take out my objective. Second group of daughters activate and run behind my left flank to threaten the mortar and Irusk. Her Reckoner on my left flank shoots Juggernaut and hits which does six damage to the four column and sets it on fire (which was never put out over the course of the game, but never made it once over ARM 20). Choir sings passage again. Enliven is given again. The Reckoner shoots, but misses. Everything else moves up with the feat, but does not advance beyond.
Top of three. I allocate one focus to behemoth and two to the juggernaut. I drop FFE, as the mortar is no position to hit really anything of consequence, save a few daughters. Drops artifice of deviation. And upkeep solid ground with the Sylys. Irusk activates and moves up slightly behind the forest (my first mistake of not moving him into the zone) he casts energizer (which was not really needed) to let behemoth move back a bit and for the juggernaut to creep up in the forest slightly. Irusk holds onto two and feats. Which catches everything but the farthest of my opponents support units. I activate behemoth and have him aim at the central daughter in my zone. He boosts with the powerful attack and hits and manages to kill with blast damage four of the sisters outright. He attacks with the other gun, boosting as well and kills one which leaves only one remaining daughter in my zone. The IFP activate and issue a charge order with two of them CMAing the last sister and the rest either performing a CMA on the Reckoner and Blood or simply running and jamming the two jacks. They kill the last daughter in my zone and flub one CMA and do 5 damage to the Blood. On the other side I charge juggernaut against her Reckoner in her zone and manage to do around 20 or so damage.. (My rolls were terrible). IFU activate and charge the Reckoner and Devout. (Mistake here in not giving them battle lust and also forgot about impact attacks) Devout is able to make it’s defensive strike attack against three of my Uhlans and while she misses two, she is somehow able to kill one outright. and The other four manage to dent the Devout significantly and reposition back slightly and in base to base. Joe boosts attack rolls. WGRC attack sisters as best as they can. Despite a few terrible deviations, they are able to kill two.
Bottom of four- so my opponent didn't realize that Irusk’s feat also gives -3 SPD so she allocates two to character jack. One to Reckoner on right flank. She up keeps occultation. Activates her Daughters and vengeance moves them toward Irusk and rifle corps. She charges two into rifle corps and one into Sylys. She kills Sylys and kills three rifle corps. Irusk is now engaged by her Daughter. Blood of Martyrs activates and kills four IFP and side steps to stand in the middle of the map between her zone and mine. Her Reckoner on my right flank misses twice on a single IFP. Her other Reckoner manages to hit juggernaut for everything but movement. She kills another two uhlans with the Devout and a few smacks from Thyra. I still have the Juggernaut and two Uhlans in her zone so no score for her.
Top of four. Irusk gives behemoth two and keeps the rest letting solid ground drop. Irusk casts energizer to let the behemoth move up towards the Blood of Martyrs. Irusk moves slightly (aganin not in the zone) and attacks and kills the sister. Give battle lust to IFP. IFP move in slightly and attack with a two man CMA the Blood of Martyrs to soften it up a little. End up doing 6 damage. Other IFP attack the Reckoner and almost kill it. With a little bit of magic and precise measuring I was able to charge behemoth in against the Blood of Martyrs. Behemoth is able to easily kill it with one focus to spare. Juggernaut ineffectively attacks the Reckoner. Uhlans move back in and manage to take out another couple of systems from the Reckoner, killing it. Joe boosts the rifle corps again and they take out the remaining sisters easily.
Bottom of four- we talked about it and at this point my opponent knows she either has to win on scenario or kill Irusk. As Irusk was safely tucked away( still not in my zone) she has no chance there. She thinks for a bit, noting that she has only one light, her caster and Nicia( which to this point had been hiding behind a building the whole game) left on my left flank against a heavily damaged juggernaut and two uhlans with only one damage box ticked on one of them. She drops occultation gives the Devout two focus. Gives the remaining Reckoner a focus ( to try and break free I'm assuming and get into my zone to stall my points). She starts with her Reckoner. It misses every attack and does nothing. The Book then activates and gives the Devout Flames of Wrath. She then activates the Devout to try and take out the uhlans and set everything on fire. She kills one uhlan and sets the other one on fire. She moves her Nicia in for the charge next round but does nothing but run this one. She runs the choir up to try and block charge lanes for me. She then decides to run her caster to the back of the table so I can't assassinate next turn.
Top of five- I totally screw up and forget to give behemoth anything.The Uhlan and Juggernaut both take no damage from the fire I have Irusk cast battle lust in IFP again. He then finally moves into my zone and energizers behemoth up a bit. The IFP do a little damage to the heavy, but are able to clear all of the choir save one. The one remaining uhlan gets that honor and kills it and repositions out of the charge lane for behemoth. This is where I realized my mistake with behemoth and hoped that all I would need were the two initials. I charge behemoth toward the light and annihilate it completely. This leaves both zones empty of enemy units. I set my sights on her objective and I set the rifle corps to the task and manage to bring it down to 2 health. I thought I was out of options until I realized my poor little juggernaut was base to base with it and only needed turn around and smack it once. I score three points that turn and we talk and decide to end the game as she simply does not have enough to stop me from scoring one point on her turn.
I made a lot of obvious rookie mistakes this game and I am sure there were some that I never even realized. Not placing Irusk in my own zone for two rounds really hurt and I think I could have had the game over and done with a lot quicker had I been smart about it. I need to get back into the swing of things again. Not giving Behemoth his full load of focus also was a real dumb move.
Speaking of which Behemoth is a beauty! He was the shining star in my list and thanks to the ability to screen him well, I never felt like he was in any danger at all. He made it out completely untouched.
The Uhlans are my first calvary model and they are fantastic! I was a little worried that because of their base size they would be hard to place well, but I never felt like they ever needed help in getting to where they needed to be, when they needed to be there.
Tactician is so fantastic! I almost feel like I need to put Irusk down and get used to regular placement rules again just so I don’t get too spoiled with that much awesome.
Like I said earlier, I loved Irusk in MK 2, but I really feel like he has been cranked up to 11 in MK 3. He has such a toolbox between his innate features, spells and feat. I never once felt like there was something that someone in the list couldn’t handle.
I'm getting ready to take Irusk 2 to battle Saturday, and thought I'd run through my list first, in prep for the report.
- Sylys Wyshnalyrr
First mate Hawk
Iron Fang Uhlans (max)
Press Gangers (max)
So, basic premise of the list is to use all of Irusk's goodness to exploit the improved press gangers. My plan would be to run the press gangers in front, WGRC in the middle with I2 and Big B, and Cav Models in rear, ready to pounce. Irusk's handing out tough, giving the pirates the ablity to move through each other for easier gang, and solid ground. Further, he cna use artifice of devation as pathfinder on a stick, or to slow an opponent, and give them battle lust for the intitial attack. For their part, the press gangers are going to be MAT 7 and P+S 11 if they can get gang. If I need to punch armor, they get battle lust to become POW 11 weaponmasters. If the target is a warrior model, then hawk gives them super weaponmaster. In addition, Valachev is giving them the bonus move to allow them to better "gang" and they are making more models. Lord Rockbottom is quite as useful with them and Irusk, but he's their to hand out boosted melee attacks and overtake. If a few of these guys survive, there are not any warrior models in the game that are going to want two of them coming in with Boosted MAT 7 P+S 11 Super weapon master charge rolls...
WGRC do their thing. I've taken the advice above and put them as a min unit, while maximizing rockets. 3 rockets plus Big B should be sufficently horrendous for my opponent. Finally, charging out of the back with the empresses mighty fury is a full unit of Uhlans and the Drakhun. Uhlans are always going to get Battle Lust on the charge, and the Drakhun and do serious work on his own.
It's a jack short probably, and the drakhun could straight up become a Juggy with unused jack points, but I'm not sure I want to do that. I'm sinking 24 points into the pirates, which is a lot, but it feels really good. One easy swap that I'm thinking about is switching Lady Hawk for Ragman. Against warrior models it's strictly worse for the pirates, but +2 is still really good. Plus, Ragman can help anyone in the army making him much more useful the entire game. I'm also wondering if I need a few more bodies, but not sure.
I'm trying this list out tomorrow, so I'll let you know how it goes with a battle report. Initial impressions and thoughts greatly appreciated.
Well, got 2 games in with my Irusk 2 list that's posted above. It'd didn't go too well, but let's keep 2 critical factors in mind. 1. This was my first two games with Irusk 2 ever, and that includes Mk2. Lots of mistakes were made, many of them I'm probably still ignorant of. 2. I'm pretty sure I was playing into a bad match-up that I would normally play with my B3 list, but I'm certainly open to thoughts on that
Irusk 2 vs. Kara Sloan
Scenario - Incursion
Result - Loss by Assassination.
- Hurricane (proxy of new Colossal)
Gun Mage Captain Adept (I think, it's the one with Shadowfire)
I actually almost won this game. To be fair, this was my buddy's maiden voyage with Kara Sloan as well, so critical factor #1 applies to him too. I won the dice roll and elected to go 2nd. This was good for me b/c I got to pick a side with a hill which put an Artifice of Deviation'd Irusk at DEF 21. It also allowed me to move up much more on my turn. Turn 1 he advanced. On Bottom of 1, I moved forward with a tightly packed group. I kept the Horses behind, just as I thought. I also started trailing Behemoth, which was a mistake b/c a) he couldn't do much work and b) I was overly afraid of the hunters, which was dumb. Top of turn 2, He does not feat, but starts putting some damage on my pirates and Rifle Corp. He's playing way back, waiting for a turn 3 feat. On my turn, I decide to pounce on the flags, and try to put him under huge pressure. I aggressively move to Airburst his Eiryss on the left flag, although I stupidly forgot to use Wyshnylarr, and don't have the focus to boost, meaning I miss. I do pop my feat, more on that in a minute. At this point, i can barely get Hawk in to Eiryss, and send her in to do the dirty work. This was key though, as I have no shield guards, and if I eat an Eiryss 1 shot, it's game over especially with his feat still live. If she fails to do it, I'll be funning my Cav to block the shot at Irusk. The bad news is, I poorly position Hawk, and she is about 2 millimeters from scoring the flag. It should be noted Eiryss was his only model within 4 inches of any of the flags, and he was right on one. I send the Drahkun to the right flag and he's in for what will be an easy point. I shove my rifle corp on the middle flag, but this is where I make a mistake. I hang the valuable rockets back so they can benefit from AoD, and they are about 1. 5 inches from Irusk. I run my Uhlans to engage his four hunters. So, when my turn ends, I've got control of 2 flags, and score 2 points... it should have been 3, but I'm dumb. I know his feat is coming, but Irusk is DEF 21. I'm close to him, but I've popped my feat, and his Hunters are Speed 3, and he's going to have a hell of a time getting in to contest. I'm looking at a potential Bottom 3 victory. If I can score 2 on his turn, It's over as he'll never reach the Drakhun. On his turn, he pops feat and takes some shots at Irusk with Sloan. One of the 3 hit, and put a bit of damage on him, but not enough to worry as I have a focus left. Then the Hurricane activiates. I didn't realize it has a knock back attack. He uses that gun to launch the 2 rocketeers I'm trying to save into me, causing me to eat 2 POW 16 collateral damage rolls. I can't take that on the chin, and I fall down dead.
Same lists, opponent, and scenarios.
Loss - basically tabled.
I win the roll, but he wants to try his list going 2nd. I let him, and it's a blood bath. Him starting 10 inches up, and going 2nd means I feel immediately under the gun. I try to rush my pirates and Rifle Corp forward, but leave my caster, horses, and Big B back (dumb). He feats and doesn't miss a single attack roll. Now granted, they are boosted to hit, but he needs 9's, and should probably miss one of them. I don't make a single though roll, and both my infantry units are smashed. One side note. 1 unexpected bonus of my list is the fact that with Rockbottom and Joe, the WGRC and Press Gangers can rush way out ahead of Irusk, and still be given tough. That was nice, and while it literally did nothing for me this game, will certainly pay dividends in the future. I am now in big trouble. I try to surge up, but his army just smashes my remaining force with shots. I start the top of 3 with Big B (too far back), Irusk, Rockbottom, and Wyshnylarr. I concede as were low on time, and even if I could assassinate him (which might not have even been mathematically possible) it will be such a hallow victory it's not even worth it. And to be honest, I don't think it was mathmatically even possible.
Thoughts and Lessons
First, let me do the most unoriginal thing and complain about Sloan. Her kit is so good for range. The range extended, the hit fixer, and the feat (bonus attack) are just so solid. I don't even mind her, it's the hunters I can't stomach. Innate RAT 7... ***. These models are just sick, and with a SPD 6 and +2 range from Sloan, it's just really tilting.
I really like the pirate module. Too early to tell. Whether you agree Sloan is a bad matchup or not, I think I can definately say the press gangers were not going to be good into this army. The can get some damage in, but they had no chance of using their innate recursion, or the Lass' ability. here were also so many guns, it was just going to be rough. I'm excited to try them into some other armies.
I was way too conservative with Big B. I've played a ton of B3 with 3 jacks, and I think having the 1 jack made me too scared to lose him. I also normally have 1-2 repair units. His effect was negligable in both games, and at 24 points, that's simply unacceptable. I was too scared of the hunters. Even boosted, each shot only averages 6 damage.
Artifice of Deviation and Solid Ground are absolutely as baller as you think they are.
I felt a little light on bodies, but I wonder if that's b/c he had so much shooting, I was just wilting. I'm not sure more bodies help me out or not.
I'm moving my Cav back down to min. Not sure where the freed up 8 points go, but even if I want horses, i'd rather find a point and go Drakhun, Drakhu, min Uhlans than Drakhun and max Uhlans.
I'm rubbish at writing battle reports, but thought I would share some very specific pieces and why I take them with great success. First, my list:
Rifle Corp + 2 Rockets
Nyss Hunters + Valachev
So most of that is standard fare, but I will explain Torch and Nyss Hunters, and why the list works. First I need to explain the way the list plays. This is a hardcore gunline at heart, with ability to successfully outshoot most opponents (See Nyss + Torch below), slow the meeting of the lines with the feat, then either match with a melee list or even out punch them. 2 10 man units with CRA gives VERY credible assassination threat with FFE swapping, the mortar and Behemoth. There is ability to chunk out mid armour beasts then finish a spiral with Alten and prevent healing. On Alten, he's the only model that's not immune to blast damage. Abuse terrain and his reposition, you need him to last. Once lines finally meet, Nyss even at ps 9, at double weapon master spike like crazy. The Rifle Corp then also transition, mat 5 pow 12 weapon masters against low def high arm, or mat 5 boosted pow 8 weapon masters is fine against high def low arm targets. Again, can't stress hard enough how important keeping Alten around for late game is, you may not kill a tough beast or jack, but you can cripple it effectively with shooting softening them up and the aforementioned melee abilities. Eliminators are also late game pieces, hanging back until required.
This is a list of patience, barely commit, you will force them to come in out of the rain and then can finish them off easily. It is effective from start to finish, not just from when you finally get to alpha in melee. It lets Irusk play back further and be safer. I run Armoury objective because magic weapons is about the only weakness.
Reinholdt loses a lot of efficacy against things like clouds, forests, etc. Sure Irusk's army can see through them but Reinholdt can't.
Then, there's this ruling: http://privateerpressforums.com/show...argeting-Flair
So, while our gunline is seeing through clouds and forests but being sad because of prowl effects and the like, Torch comes to the rescue. Either walk 6 (energiser) and place 2 x 3 inch flares, or assault 9 and place 1 flare. Take down a Cassius 19" away and if Wurmwood is hanging back that's where he'll be forever more, or until some stones get back there. Combo is too strong with Irusk's feat to pass up, and assault gives him the edge over Spriggan.
These guys are completely clutch with Irusk. They are, hands down, the best artifice of deviation / solid ground abusers around. Def 18 no worries. Place 7 of them base to base around the front edge of AoD, then another 3 base to base in front of Valachev. Good luck sniping him out now, even eleaps will just bounce between the Nyss if they hit at all. They let you advance into other gunlines range with almost impunity. Even opposing rifle corp are struggling, 3 man cra's will still only hit 50% of the time, then there's a tough roll on top of that.
The other main reasons for them are versatility (range/melee) and hunter. There is a proliferation of dig in troops you will be seeing - Idrians, Brigands, Reeves, Irusk2 mirror, etc. Nyss outshoot all of them. Let them advance into you and shoot first, who cares? If they're within 15 inches you aim and shoot back abusing zephyr. Place them opposite rifle corp with AoD in the mirror, win that flank. Stealth infantry? Walk 7, zephyr 3, shoot 5. 15 inches threat with CRA for high value targets like Orin, Kell, Eiryss, etc. Their damage range with battle lust charging is 14 - 39 which is nothing new, but they gained half an inch threat which makes them easier to pack in on targets that get close enough.
There's more terrain on the table, more chances for a) opposing troops getting concealment + cover, but also b) standing behind a forest/building/terrain thing, move out shoot, reposition back with zephyr to be free from LoS.
Aussie wargamer. @Toonooky on Twitter
Second game - If Sloan is shotting with Hunters at my low value infantry I am WINNING.....especially with tough. Needing 9s is NOT a sure thing - especially when you can tough and remain standing up. Just 1-2 tough rolls and suddenly she is in trouble. But I think the right play in that game is the same as your first. Drop the Artifice and put Irusk in it. Then EVERYTHING goes up (threat saturation) and now lets see what she does. If you have Irusk on the Hill in the artifice that is def 20. Guess what. Eyrss needs an _12_ to hit you (a 10 if somehow she can aim). I will take those chances ANYDAY.
4 hunters means 8 shots under feat. Sloan gets 3 (with reload) Huricanne is 5. So 16 shots. We can assume around 5 models will tough.
And now he is in DEEP doodoo. Lets start roll 3 dice at -3 against those hunters with my rockets and see how long they last. The Press Gangers look to tie up range. You out threat the hurrican with behemoth...or if they shot at HIM (bad idea) the Hurricane now eats battle lusted Uhlans...or Sloan gets tracked...or you win on scenario with his low model count army.
Part of this is actually thinking about the models and the way it will play out. Eyrss is scary until you contemplate that in the middle of the artifice and with Solid Ground up there is litterally NOTHING that sloan can do to help E1 land the bolt.....or knock Irusk down. EVEN AIMING Hunters needs 12s. Please. Try. I want you to.
And yes, I do this BEST without the pressures of the game. I always overvalue the threat E1 is right now because I remember her getting boosted attack rolls with deadeye and like PTSD that is something that sticks. Plus it sucks to lose games to double 6s. But that is a feature not a bug. Embrace it.
Last edited by Sand20go; 08-29-2016 at 10:22 AM.
First, thanks for the write up and I agree. Nyss are undervalued right now....and shouldn't be.
Please note about Torch. The main problem with MANY (but not all cloud banks) is what are you charging? If it is a trencher/Haley 3 gun line they are behind the clouds so no target. You can SOMETIMES catch a Trencher (or 2) in a properly placed Flare (remember, you need LOS to the center point so it is on the edge of the bank) but sometimes not.
The one thing I am not sold on is the mortar. I LOVE it (a lot) but your list already has a lot of shooting and can clear infantry like no tomorrow. 1 boosted POW 16 shot is very nice but I am not seeing it win games for you. What I would suggest is testing a build where you.....
Drop the Rifles to Min and add a Rocket (+3)
Drop the Mortar (+5)
Drop the Elminators (+5)
And add doomies. Now you have the opportunities to REALLY make your opponent pay. Stay away? (Get shot up to smithereens. Close, eat doomies. Put the Nyss along the front edge of the pie plate. Doomies in the center. Irusk and Valachev bring up the rear. With no more Abom threat and innate tough (and with no knock down) doomies are a great fixer...allowing your range game to have so much fun.
Torch is there mostly for the feat turn. Things that make clouds like trenchers can just be shot off the table, it's the prowl models that he enables being dealt with. Scary as hell for Kaelyssa and Denny. The mortar is also too valuable, have yet to have enough troubles punching to need them. Having that volume of shooting that can combine into low volume high pow shooting, that can convert into high volume strong melee, is key here. Everything besides the mortar provides double duty. The mortar forces different play styles, spreading out models, clipping guys like Ragman and other sac pawn targets if they get careless with placement. Even just drifting around that amazing aoe damage can bet some great results and is an amazing source of tilt for your opponent. Never neglect the ability to tilt your enemy
Doom reavers are just don't go within 11 of here. They're static. Everything in this list projects enough. Besides, rifle Corp are doom reavers with 2 less mat and don't punch each other
Aussie wargamer. @Toonooky on Twitter
Any suggestions for an optimal jack selection for zero points?
Here's a 50pt battle report going into karchev.
Turn 1 I set up so irusk can push the flag and start cutting down armour. I went second. He ran his doomies up and I cut them down with rifles.
Turn2 I dropped all my shots into the lead Kodiak and ripped it's cortex off and knocked it down. I stayed out of charge range of everything else and contested the zone.
Here is the end of the game. He knew he wasn't going to be able to drown me in armour because of my feat and behemoth waiting so he tried to get karchev into my iron fangs to kill them with a spray. With toughs only one died.
On my turn i finished off the Kodiak, slammed the juggernaught and then battle lusted the iron fangs that killed karchev.
I'm not sure if karchev has game into irusk2. I'd have to see that 300 list to be sure.
Oh I noticed a lot of you guys are still using the mortar. My recommendation is to switch to the field gun. 18" knockdown threat is game winning and behemoth gets all your fully boosted aoe action for you.
Try the field gun. It's vicious how good it is and it has 2 grunts to "take up" as well so it's faster too.
Definitely getting me some field guns. They're perfect for screening Irusk and they fix I2's lack of attack buff.
lastly one of the biggest strengths of the field gun is allowing your red fangs (vanilla iron fangs) to charge something and still mini feat reposition back to your lines just in case the target lives. that reposition 5 on irusk2 feat turn can literally give you 2 battle lusted alphas into enemy heavies.
Last edited by jack frost; 08-30-2016 at 09:05 AM.
Can you recommend a list that doesn't include uhlans as I don't have them yet? I was thinking assassins, doom readers, and IFP but any help you can provide in suggesting an optimized list without uhlans would be super helpful
Last edited by Skyhawk78; 08-31-2016 at 10:12 AM.
Winter Guard Spam (WGK has run this. Lots of mileage from FFE and bodies with tough. If you own 6+ rockets this seems like a thing
Krieg (I think) flying can operner - 4 units of doomies
KA+IFP - Lots of fun with Solid Ground and Artifice. A nice thing about this list is that you can spread out more. Artifice provides cover for the ARM 18 IFP and the stealth KAs go outside of that - some hopefully in the tough bubble.
Nyss+WGIRC - the latest addition. Uses the Nyss for the mixed arm support which is nice and then the Battlelusted Weaponmaster. I think I would try to squeeze in Ragman if this route - and maybe even Gorman or Hutchuck to really allow them to crack armor. Points could be too tight.
I was wondering if something like this would work or be tweaked to omit the uhlans
Min WGRC w/ 3 rockets
Min assassins with underboss
3 points remaining.
War Room Army
Khador - irusk2 copy
Theme: No Theme Selected
75 / 75 Army
Armory - Steamroller Objective
Supreme Kommandant Irusk
- Sylys Wyshnalyrr, The Seeker
Orin Midwinter, Rogue Inquisitor
Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich
Iron Fang Pikemen - Leader & 9 Grunts
- Iron Fang Pikemen Officer & Standard - Officer & Standard
Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 9 Grunts
- Winter Guard Rocketeer
- Winter Guard Rocketeer
- Winter Guard Rocketeer
Winter Guard Field Gun Crew - Gunner & 2 Grunts
Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt
Battle Mechaniks - Leader & 3 Grunts
Oh yeah! I like this ^. Thanks!!!
I've really enjoyed using the Gun Carriage with him. It's a good piece by itself and takes FFE well. I usually use it as a skirmisher, but sometimes it gets in there and smashes things, or acts as a flanking threat so the opponent has to choose between dealing with it and dealing with my infantry. Recently I played a friend's Circle army and he misjudged the threat range, so I killed his WW Stalker in 1 activation. It was fantastic.
Can't take credit for the tactic, though, I found it somewhere here on these forums. But it's a winner.
Losing and learning is still better than winning and learning nothing.
Battle report for my first Irusk2 game is up in my thread. Link in signature.
Great report HCT, funny to see Solid Ground not being used :P. In general I think he's still our top cat for infantry but it's awesome to see you going at it with Warjacks.
And because we can:
that new artwork though...bleh. The old one was way better.
A few questions to Irusk2. Do you see him as a complicated caster? Because in my mind. He has sooo many options.
But everytime I look at him I really like him.
And why is everyone defaulting to Behemoth? Why not take a Colossal like the Conquest? A list I am looking forward to play is this one:
Caster: 1 / 1
Points: 75 / 75
Irusk2 (Supreme Kommandant Irusk) -27
- Conquest 37
- Sylys Wyshnalyrr, the Seeker 4
Iron Fang Pikemen (Leader and 9) 15
- Iron Fang Pikemen Officer & Standard 4
Winter Guard Infantry (Leader and 9) 10
- Winter Guard Inf. Officer & Standard 4
- 3 Winter Guard Infantry Rocketeer 6
Winter Guard Field Gun Crew 4
Winter Guard Mortar Crew 5
Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich 4
Ogrun Bokur 5
Saxon Orrik 4
Ah well, I dont mind the variants of the artwork too much. If players want to have the old one on there, I could edit the above (did the same for Karchev).
I don't see Irusk 2 as a complicated Warcaster but he does indeed have a massive toolbox, which is why I like him so much.
Irusk 2 simply said can awnser a large scale of issues, while this meta is very much issue driven. Skews I believe you could call that?
Behemoth is likely thaken so often with Irusk 2 because in the previous edition he also showed up in his Theme forces, given the two somewhat of a connection.
Other than that Behemoth simply said has the hardest hitting blasts, allowing you to get that much more out of Solid Ground as you can (and should) directly fire into troops that are into melee with out troops. The only real thing that hinders Irusk 2 and Behemoth is a ton of blast immunity. A Colossal cannot benifit from Energizer, so while I'd like Conquest for the blasts aswell I do believe that Irusk 1 is much better equiped to have a Colossal.
Other than that your list looks reasonably solid. I think that WGI indeed can do the trick aswell now. What I'm missing in your force is the inclusion of Iron Fang Uhlans.
To me the biggest pro Irusk 2 currently brings is Tactician + Solid Ground, meaning you reward yourself by having your models very tightly together, the beauty is that because of this you can easily thake the opponents hit with stuff like Iron Fang and charge in there aswell with Iron Fang Uhlans.
Shooting your own guys, more Irusk 1 style than 2 but I like it. Never had the idea.
Energizer is true, but to be quite honest between swaping FFE and Battle Lust I don't see myself casting it all to often. The main point would be the Blast into our own guys.
Until recently I didn't even know the highs of playing with Forces that don't need to be close to your caster (many battles with big Battlegroups). But S1 tought me that you. But in this List in particular my plan was to have 2 Points of attack. On the one Side Irusk2 with his infantrie and on the other the Conquest creeping on the Edge of Irusks controll range.
I want to try Uhlans as I have seen a lot of good come from them (in Battlerports) but I only own 3 atm and have only played them once (looking for 2 more atm).
Truth be told in the 1. Version there where 3 Uhlans in the list which got scraped for Saxon, Field Gun ans Slyss.
Maybe I switch the Conquest to double Jacks (Behmoth + Marauder/Jugger/Destroyer) or Behemoth + 3 Uhlans + Artillery Officer = Conquest + Ogrun.
But as far as I know the Artillery Officer isn't available. What do you use for him?
Shooting your own guys truely is one key to succes for Irusk 2. Most of the player who havn't faced Irusk 2 still like to jam models into melee so they 'assume' they can't be blown to shreds by things like Behemoth, Mortar or even Airburst. The great thing is that this isn't the case . So 'jamming with non-Blast immume infantry' is generally speaking a death sentence to that infantry. Obviously Irusk 2 has more pro's than that, as Tactician allows you to also shoot Rockets through your own forces (and be immume to the blasts aswell). Most of the games I basically leverage the most out of Solid Ground and to date this tactic still works incredibly well.
The second key to succes for Irusk 2 is charging through your own guys. This is where Uhlans come into play, even 3 will allow you to get a good feel for them, granted 5 are obviously more ideal. I believe I've posted the set up before but the largest advantage the Uhlans give you the initial turns is being a screen between your opponent and Irusk 2, a tough screen as 2 are still on high ARM + Tough + (possible) Artifice of Deviation to ensure that Uhlan-wall isn't broken.
Currently I don't use an Ogrun anywhere, by large also because I pair Irusk 2 with Karchev and use Karchev in the ranged heavier lists that arn't Sloan or a ton of MHSF (but the latter are a bit rare). I personally dont have any plans for the Artillery Officer yet, he's not out. He will be great for future Destroyer use.
The updated version of my Irusk 2 list currently looks like this:
Tinker/Destroyer are the real tests, it's very likely that the eventual list will look different, more like it used to with Juggernaut and Field Gun (which previously was a Mortar).Irusk 2
- Destroyer (test)