Results 1 to 28 of 28
  1. #1

    Default This Newbie needs advice for Old witch and Vlad1,Can you give me a hand?

    First,English isn't my first language.So I hard to write what I think.Sorry.

    May be I will start Warmachine/Horde in January (If Warmachine Models come to me on correct time),With Khador.

    Why I will start Khador?
    Because,I Really like Old Witch's fluff! She's fluff just Great.It's full of Mystery and like REAL Legend of Europe.
    Also,Powerful.I think Old Witch has most Powerful story in Warmachine's Warcaster.Well,She is Gaia of Khador!

    Also,I am interested in Vlad1.Why? Just S&P. I think It's Best Spell of in Khador.
    (But I don't like Vlad's fluff...His name and Concept looks like Vampire Count of Rumania But he is Just Heroic Warrior.Not Bloody or Dark.)

    Anyway,I bought Old Witch,Vlad1 and some Khador Model.
    I have looked Old Witch Thread...and I said Oh my God! Old Witch is very very Hard to Play warcaster.

    So I have a question about two Warcaster,Old Witch and Vlad.

    1.I Really like Widowmaker and Kodiak,and Behemoth.Well,Behemoth is Fantastic.So Many Warcaster uses him.

    But Old witch with Widowmaker,Vlad1 with Kodiak is Good Combination?

    2.I thought Old Witch's Point is making Her Warjacks First Strike.But I have read some thread,It is not Point of her.

    So...What is Important to play with her? How to use her? I need advice.

    3.I heard Vlad1 is Cool and good for Newbie.S&P,Blood of kings,Feat...etc etc.

    But I don't know Basic Deployment His army and How to Use All of His Spell! like Blood of Kings,Wind Wall...Without S&P.

    If you have advice about this question,I really appreciate you.Because I will Play Vlad1 More than Old Witch.
    (...I heard about In local meta,Uses 4 warjack is usual.It's hard to play Old Witch.)

    ---

    Thanks for Read my text.

    And If you have advice or Short story about these two caster.Please talk to me,I want know More and More about these two warcaster!

  2. #2
    Conqueror NymiethePooh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    328

    Default

    I love the Kodiak and feel it can go with most casters. Then again, I liked it in mkII. I recommend the Kodiak to most new players because it offers a chance to learn power attacks and get a feel for when to use them without losing the initial attacks. It's sort of like having training wheels on a warjack.

    Widowmakers are a good unit that perform consistently in most lists.

    Different people have different goals they are trying to achieve with Old Witch. Some see her as a control caster. Some see her as a means to speed up our jacks. Some see her as an assassination caster. The way I typically play her is attrition where she kills three or more infantry a turn before teleporting to safety. She turns souls into focus for her warjacks unless a really good assassination opportunity opens itself up to me. The threat of assassination is primarily used to encourage the other player to keep their caster away from areas of the board. The way I play her is easy as it is kill some models with her while Avatar of Slaughter is on her, but save four focus every turn to teleport away and camp two. It's a slow way to play her, but I find it to be fairly dependable. Old Witch is versatile in that there are many ways to play her. My way is probably not the best, but it is how I am accustomed to running her.

    I have a lot less experience with Vlad. He is good at making anything better. This is sometimes referred to by the phrase "Force Multiplier". You can make almost any models work well with him. The issue is time. Rerolls take time. If taking an army that is likely to depend on the rerolls then expect to spend more time on each attack than if taking an army that can perform without the rerolls but the rerolls provide some extra insurance. I am certain that most Khador players can offer greater insight into Vlad than I can. The time issue is from my own limited experience and may be due to my lack of experience with Vlad.

  3. #3
    Destroyer of Worlds Voodoogk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    1,076

    Default

    Vlad1s game revolves around signs and portents. In most games he will give a focus or two to his jacks and then cast signs and portents (SnP for short). SnP has a strong effect on dice luck, you roll three dice, drop the lowest and what is left is your result. Statistically, this means your dice will roll 2.5 ish higher than than just rolling two dice unaided. Realistically this means your opponent is going to be hammered by over the top dice pretty much all game long. where normally 7 is average, you can normally bank on 9's with snp, and you'll see boxcars way too often. In a dice game, this is a huge buff. The spell affects any of your models within 14"'s of Vlad, so you can get a pretty big area. To take full advantage of this, most people bring a lot of guns, because we don't have too many other casters that do very much for guns. I'm personally no exception, I like taking him with at least a bombard or two, a gun carriage, and a grolar. The more dice you roll, the more effect you'll get out of vlad1.
    Beyond that he has his feat which doubles the speed of warjacks in his battlegroup and they get free charges/power attacks. A useful feat in this day of multiple jacks. If he really wants to push it from there he has boundless charge as well, for 2 focus you can threat 14-15"'s on feat with any of our jacks. This is pretty much all his focus though, so that jacks not going to do as much if you cast snp and boundless on the same turn. He also has windwall which protects him from non-magical guns.. this can be a big deal in some games, useless in others.
    Finally blood of kings allows him call up his inner action hero. It costs the same as SnP so you can not cast both in the same turn.. gives him +3 to all his stats. He's ends up with a very strong statline with this spell, good for some assassinations, but mostly good as a defensive tool to keep vlad alive.

  4. #4
    Destroyer of Worlds roddo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Oswego New York
    Posts
    1,647

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by NymiethePooh View Post

    I have a lot less experience with Vlad. He is good at making anything better. This is sometimes referred to by the phrase "Force Multiplier". You can make almost any models work well with him. The issue is time. Rerolls take time. If taking an army that is likely to depend on the rerolls then expect to spend more time on each attack than if taking an army that can perform without the rerolls but the rerolls provide some extra insurance. I am certain that most Khador players can offer greater insight into Vlad than I can. The time issue is from my own limited experience and may be due to my lack of experience with Vlad.
    vlad doesnt need rerolls, thats vlad 2 and hand of fate. Snp is very quick. He basically has a spell thats better than some feats, and it allows him to make anything he takes better offensively every turn of the game. If his army gets 2 turns of attacks he could have the best damage boosting ability in the game.

  5. #5

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by NymiethePooh View Post
    Different people have different goals they are trying to achieve with Old Witch. Some see her as a control caster. Some see her as a means to speed up our jacks. Some see her as an assassination caster. The way I typically play her is attrition where she kills three or more infantry a turn before teleporting to safety. She turns souls into focus for her warjacks unless a really good assassination opportunity opens itself up to me. The threat of assassination is primarily used to encourage the other player to keep their caster away from areas of the board. The way I play her is easy as it is kill some models with her while Avatar of Slaughter is on her, but save four focus every turn to teleport away and camp two. It's a slow way to play her, but I find it to be fairly dependable. Old Witch is versatile in that there are many ways to play her. My way is probably not the best, but it is how I am accustomed to running her.
    Thank you!

    So,Old Witch Charged Easy-to-Kill infantry Models.And Kills 3~4 infantry,and Uses Unseen Path,Keeping Focus 2.
    Um...Next turn,Soul tokens are converted focus.These Focus are allocated Her jacks or Used for her Spell? (like Murder of Crow)

    interesting! Actually,I have know Old Witch Just stay backyard and making Cloud untill Assassination timing.But your play is more aggressive and exciting...I want to play like you on First Old Witch game!

    But I have a one Question.If opponent uses MOW or Bastion and 4~5 jacks...like Karchev,Harkevich and Kozlov.How to play Old Witch with these guys?

  6. #6

    Default

    Thank you for your advice Voodoogk.Wow,Vlad1 is Great!

    So He is balance caster.Basically He is commander of Army but If I use Blood of Kings,He will be butcher! (but not like Real 'Butcher')

    I thought SnP Spent 4 Focus on Vlad1,So He can't Allocated many Focus on jacks like Other caster.So His Warjack Not much powerful like Butcher,Strakhov.But SnP So powerful than I thought!
    Last edited by KarasTengu; 01-04-2017 at 01:45 PM.

  7. #7
    Destroyer of Worlds
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Darkest Canberra
    Posts
    4,353

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by roddo View Post
    vlad doesnt need rerolls, thats vlad 2 and hand of fate.
    Neither has re-rolls! Are we trolling new people or something?


    KarasTengu: your English is WAY better than my everything-else-but-English.

    About Vlad1: he's good because you can run anything you like. To play him well is all about keeping him alive while he feeds his army Signs and Portents and tries to get scenario points. Sometimes this is very hard - if he casts Signs and Portents, he runs very low on focus, and he is not very hard to hit. So you need to decide when it is better to go Blood of Kings and just be really tough, leaving the army to fend for themselves. Even when you cast Signs and Portents, you need to decide if it's worth leaving some of your army out of the area, so that you can keep Vlad further back or in some safer position.

    About Witch: I'm pretty bad at her, so I don't have much advice. But for those armies you can not kill easily, you do have good options with (for example) a pair of Gallows to get an assassination opportunity (whether that means getting their caster with it to bring them closer to you and in range for a Behemoth to punch it to death, or just moving the screening models out of the way so you can shoot them). You can slow them down with the feat to stop supporting or screening troops coming up, even vs a heavy list (that is, you can be faster than them, and get to scenario points early, and then hold on). And otherwise, yeah, you can run a list with Witch that makes up for her lack of punch: bring hard hitting stuff that doesn't need a damage boost, for example, if you want to kill super heavy lists.

  8. #8
    Warrior
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Dark woods of Sweden
    Posts
    92

    Default

    My take on old witch:
    She wants Ternions for clouds so she and scrapjack can stay in stealth.
    She wants shooting because her feat usually gives them time to shoot more before they get engaged.
    My list:
    Old witch & scrapjack
    -Sylys (free upkeep and 12" gallows with arcane secrets)
    -Behemoth
    -Torch
    Malakov
    -Juggernaut
    Ternions.
    --------- After that I still swap around a bit.
    Winterguard riflemen because Iron flesh or Hunter/pathfinder.
    Eliminators, and a bunch of solos for funsies but it usually doesn't work.
    Nyss and valachev.
    Boomhowlers and valachev.

    What I really want to try is Uhlans, with Iron Flesh and Wall of steel they are arm 21 and they still have speed 8, 2" reach with a large base so they can impact a big part of the battlefield.

  9. #9

    Default

    Thank you for all advice! Khador's Kommandants are Such nice people!

    So...I think the these Warcaster's characteristic is this.If I think wrong about two caster,Please tell me.

    Vlad1

    - Easy to use more than another Khador's warcaster.

    - SnP is a one of Best spell in the Khador.It has good Combination with Guns of Khador.

    (But,I think it is Good for Melee Jacks...If Jurggy under the SnP. I think It will be powerful than Guns under the SnP)

    - Blood of Kings makes him Not only Hero of Frontline but also Jerry of Tom&Jerry.

    - Basically Vlad1's position is back of battlefield,Because Vlad1 has to his army under the SnP area and can't uses the Blood of Kings(Made hime like Jerry) at the same time with SnP.

    I think He is great caster!

    But Khador players in game center which is near my house,Not much Play with the Vald1.Instead they play with Butcher1,3,Kozlov and Irusk2.

    Why? He has serious weakness? I have curious! If he has,Please tell me about cover to his weakness.


    Old Witch

    - Good for if opponent uses the Infantry army,but She hard to play with Warjack army.

    - Gallows makes Old witch's Enemy to out of site.If Old Witch meets who is Heavy Jack Caster like Harkevich,Gallows can be Used to Joker of Assassinate turn.

    (but some People said "Gallow just Waste of focus"...so what is true?)

    - Sylys,and Graylord Ternion are necessaries of Old Witch.Makes Cloud and Gives Free upkeep.

    - If Her Feat used well,Oppenents Infantry can notting to do at they turn.So WGRC or Nyss hunters good for her,Also She can gives Hunter and Pathfinder for them.
    (I think Patfinder is Important.it Looks like great.)

    - She looks like infantry caster,but she mostly uses 2-3 jacks.it's Not like Irusk2.I think She can't makes her infantry beats down heavy jack.

    Well,I have looked other khador caster and other faction caster than I think "Old Witch has other caster's goodthings that they are lacked than Orignal."

    Apparition is good but Harkevich gives Reposition to Jacks.Weald Secrets is good but Irusk2 helps Khador's Infantry more than Weald Secret and Iron Flesh.
    She makes 5-inch Cloud AOE but Cryx's Witch coven Just Shuts down LOS.

    I think,the Problem of Old Witch is she has no NUKE like Butcher's Feat or Vlad1's SnP.So she throws many jab to her Oppnents untill they weaked. (Like Tau in 40K?)
    I think That is might be hard but it is exciting!

    ---

    May be my Khador models arrive in next sunday...If I play some game in sunday,I will use advice of this thread in game!

    Again,Thank you!

  10. #10

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Voodoogk View Post
    Statistically, this means your dice will roll 2.5 ish higher than than just rolling two dice unaided..
    Err excuse me sir, I believe the correct figure is 1.46 higher average on 2 dice under SNP.

    Here is a great document on the effects of SNP including on boosted rolls (4d6 drop the lowest) where it does have a greater effect.
    http://museonminis.com/gametheor/

    Most importantly, it feels like you never roll below a 7 or 8 so it makes your 'coin flips' really really consistent.


    Why I think your meta may not use Vlad1 KarasTengu is because he's quite a 'boring' caster by some definitions. I doubt anyone would say he's anything but great, but he can be very repetitive.

  11. #11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by H4ppyNZ View Post
    Why I think your meta may not use Vlad1 KarasTengu is because he's quite a 'boring' caster by some definitions. I doubt anyone would say he's anything but great, but he can be very repetitive.
    OK,I got it.
    For example,I want use many Jack,Vlad1 Can be run with 6~7 Jacks,but in this case Harkevich is better than Vlad1.like this?

    It's like Orenge fanta,First taste is good and last taste is just sugar taste.

  12. #12

    Default

    I would seriously recommend playing your first games with Vlad1. Try Old Witch after you have some experience.

    The thing about Vlad1 is that pretty much everything works better under his command. He's also very survivable because of Blood of Kings, Wind Wall and Parry (don't forget this ability). Not to mention, he can slash enemy warcasters dead with Blood of Kings. All my wins with Vlad1 happened because he personally killed the enemy warcaster*... most often I didn't even make him charge but made him walk to melee via non-linear 9" path... and this movement can begin behind a terrain feature that blocks line of sight. My experience is that this kind of thing can take even fairly experienced players by surprise. He also has good Feat for the Mk.III-environment. All these things combined make him a good starting caster.

    So, feel free to experiment with Vlad1. Old Witch requires more thought with list building and actual play.

    *Just... make sure the time is right. Vlad1 is a good and solid fighter but not overpoweringly so. Blood of Kings doesn't win games by itself. Signs and Portents followed by Blood of Kings does. This of course takes multiple turns.
    Last edited by RedCommander; 01-09-2017 at 02:41 PM.

  13. #13
    Annihilator Zelbinnean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Washington, D.C.
    Posts
    739

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KarasTengu View Post
    - Gallows makes Old witch's Enemy to out of site.If Old Witch meets who is Heavy Jack Caster like Harkevich,Gallows can be Used to Joker of Assassinate turn.

    (but some People said "Gallow just Waste of focus"...so what is true?)
    So, you have to be reasonable with use of Gallows. It's an expensive spell for a random amount of distanced pulled. So it will either be very good or very bad, and you have no way to exert control or fudge the dice results of that amount. That is why people say not to depend on it, because it is not in any way reliable.

    If your strategy is dependent on a good d6 roll for Gallows distance, you are hinging win and loss around a totally random single die roll. That is generally not a sound strategy.

    Also, for Nyss to benefit from Weald Secrets, you need to add Valachev to them to make them friendly faction. There isn't a great reason to take Nyss when you can take WGRC + rockets instead.

    There are some interesting jack-heavy Old Witch lists floating around, mostly using Kodiaks. The biggest issue with Old Witch is she is extremely fragile and easy to assassinate.

    The biggest issue with Vlad1 is really that he will be spending 4 focus every turn to buff his army with S&P, or if it's the endgame and most of the army is dead, he's spending 4 focus to buff himself with Blood of Kings. That just means he has to be smart about how he fuels jacks, or he might be left on no camp, and he's not super hard to kill if your opponent gets an angle on him. Fortunately, his feat makes it easy to get the most out of jacks and maybe even get the alpha strike.

  14. #14
    Eater of Brains Esper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    2,068

    Default

    The only time I use Gallows is if I'm desperate, or if I don't lose anything by trying other than focus.

  15. #15

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelbinnean View Post
    The biggest issue with Vlad1 is really that he will be spending 4 focus every turn to buff his army with S&P, or if it's the endgame and most of the army is dead, he's spending 4 focus to buff himself with Blood of Kings. That just means he has to be smart about how he fuels jacks, or he might be left on no camp, and he's not super hard to kill if your opponent gets an angle on him. Fortunately, his feat makes it easy to get the most out of jacks and maybe even get the alpha strike.
    Luckily, as a Small model, Vlad1 is easy to screen. At least when you still have most of your models. And against some lists, Wind Wall can protect him from the enemy shooting. Not everyone remembers to bring magic guns... or to bring enough of them. Wind Wall is not the perfect protection but when it is good, it's really good.

    As for the Focus allocation? With Vlad1, you sometimes need to take risks with allocation and play aggressively. Offense is the best defense and all that. Just... don't take risks with positioning. If you only allocate and keep S&P on, Vlad1 doesn't need to be in the harms way to do that. Terrain is your best friend in this case and you can maybe use that in a later turn for the non-linear 9" walk to melee.
    Last edited by RedCommander; 01-09-2017 at 05:09 PM.

  16. #16

    Default

    Old Witch isn't easy caster for beginner...and Vlad1's Play looks like What I want and enjoy.
    But I really like Old Witch's Characteristic of fluff,I wish Play game with Vlad1 gives good experiment for me who want play with Old Witch.

    Anyway,I think Vlad1 75pt Army for after tutorial game.Is it good for beginner?

    Theme: No Theme Selected
    75 / 75 Army

    Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Prince - WJ: +28
    - Behemoth - PC: 25 (Battlegroup Points Used: 25)
    - Juggernaut - PC: 12 (Battlegroup Points Used: 3)
    - Juggernaut - PC: 12
    - Kodiak - PC: 13

    Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich - PC: 4
    Manhunter - PC: 4
    Manhunter - PC: 4
    Kell Bailoch - PC: 5

    Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 9 Grunts: 13
    - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
    - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
    - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
    Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5

    I hadn't bought Gobber Tinker,If I have that I will put Widowmaker scouts and Gobber Tinker in my army instead Kell and Kayazy.

    And I have a question of Vlad1's Feat turn.In his Feat turn,How to Focus allocate? SnP spend Focus 4,and Behemoth takes Focus 1...I guess? So how to use last 2 Focus? It is Just case by case?

  17. #17

    Default

    This is a great thread, and the Khador forums always come through with helpful stuff. And op I hope this doesn't offend you but honest to god I cannot help reading your posts in a Khador accent in my head. It's pretty awesome. Like Russian general from ww2 or something

  18. #18
    Conqueror
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Posts
    104

    Default

    His biggest weakness is, that he is easy to assasinate and many opponents naturally look for that.

    I started with Vlad1 and often got to gready, especially in the beginning. Allocated the Focus, cast S&P, Feated and moved to still get the Jacks in Range after their charge, buuut then I am an easy target.
    So now with a bit more experience I would SnP in the first 2 rounds, then feat an allocate a lot of Focus, then Blood of kings

  19. #19

    Default

    An additional consideration for you. I'm kind of a fan of the Grolar with Vlad1. Grolar is OK on it's own, but under SnP, it becomes pretty good.

  20. #20
    Annihilator Zelbinnean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Washington, D.C.
    Posts
    739

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KarasTengu View Post
    Old Witch isn't easy caster for beginner...and Vlad1's Play looks like What I want and enjoy.
    But I really like Old Witch's Characteristic of fluff,I wish Play game with Vlad1 gives good experiment for me who want play with Old Witch.

    Anyway,I think Vlad1 75pt Army for after tutorial game.Is it good for beginner?

    Theme: No Theme Selected
    75 / 75 Army

    Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Prince - WJ: +28
    - Behemoth - PC: 25 (Battlegroup Points Used: 25)
    - Juggernaut - PC: 12 (Battlegroup Points Used: 3)
    - Juggernaut - PC: 12
    - Kodiak - PC: 13

    Kovnik Jozef Grigorovich - PC: 4
    Manhunter - PC: 4
    Manhunter - PC: 4
    Kell Bailoch - PC: 5

    Winter Guard Rifle Corps - Leader & 9 Grunts: 13
    - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
    - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
    - Winter Guard Rocketeer - PC: 2
    Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5

    I hadn't bought Gobber Tinker,If I have that I will put Widowmaker scouts and Gobber Tinker in my army instead Kell and Kayazy.

    And I have a question of Vlad1's Feat turn.In his Feat turn,How to Focus allocate? SnP spend Focus 4,and Behemoth takes Focus 1...I guess? So how to use last 2 Focus? It is Just case by case?
    Really I think the weakest link is the manhunters. Kell won't benefit from S&P, but he's also going to do 6 damage to a jack per turn or snipe out two warrior models as needed. Adding Widowmakers and their Marksman is a pretty good idea there.

    The thing with Vlad is he likes quantity over quality, because S&P fixes any issues with quality (i.e., low MAT/RAT). That said he will probably find it hard to fuel 4 jacks, and Behemoth is always going to want the 1 extra actual focus for fully boosted second shot until you send her into melee...which will pretty much erase anything under S&P.

  21. #21

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by HardThirteen View Post
    An additional consideration for you. I'm kind of a fan of the Grolar with Vlad1. Grolar is OK on it's own, but under SnP, it becomes pretty good.
    Grolar? Um...But I don't have this guy,Khador models that I bought is Used item.So My Kodiak is just the Kodiak,He won't be the Grolar.
    Well,Grolar is Good Warjack? I think he is too expensive,His Point is same the Kodiak with Kell or Orin...What is Make the Grolar to Strong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zelbinnean View Post
    Really I think the weakest link is the manhunters. Kell won't benefit from S&P, but he's also going to do 6 damage to a jack per turn or snipe out two warrior models as needed. Adding Widowmakers and their Marksman is a pretty good idea there.

    The thing with Vlad is he likes quantity over quality, because S&P fixes any issues with quality (i.e., low MAT/RAT). That said he will probably find it hard to fuel 4 jacks, and Behemoth is always going to want the 1 extra actual focus for fully boosted second shot until you send her into melee...which will pretty much erase anything under S&P.
    I really like Widowmakers! It's Like Sniper in WW2! (If you have seen Enemy at the gate,you know what I mean) But if I used them,How to kill Enemy's Stealth Solo? Uses Kayazy Eliminaters?

    I thought like you,too.I have two Mad dog Box.Because I had thought two Mad dogs are better than one Devastator,I bought Mad dogs when the Mad dog was 7.But next month,Mad dog's Point had been raised...

  22. #22
    Eater of Brains Esper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    2,068

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KarasTengu View Post
    I really like Widowmakers! It's Like Sniper in WW2! (If you have seen Enemy at the gate,you know what I mean) But if I used them,How to kill Enemy's Stealth Solo? Uses Kayazy Eliminaters?
    Advance widowmakers within 5" of the stealth target, or use Reinholdt's ability to cancel stealth.

  23. #23

    Default

    Send a fully-loaded Juggernaut into a Warlock with two Fury. Spenc one focus to charge, one focus to boost attack roll (since you probably need 8s or 9s to hit). He transfers. Boost fist attack; he transfers. You have now done 0 damage.

    Grolar charges abd boosts hammer attack; he transfers but is now knocked down. Fist hits automatically; he transfers and is now out of transfers. You make 3-5 POW 12 shots that hit on 3s; he takes, oh, maybe 12 damage. Buy another hammer attack: dead Warlock.

    It's a simplification, but I still believe the Grolar is our best Warcaster/Warlock killer, and just a great generalist. And if your warcaster doesn't hand out Pathfinder, then the Grolar is probably your best armour cracking option.

  24. #24
    Conqueror Tenzilla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    461

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Soul Samurai View Post
    Send a fully-loaded Juggernaut into a Warlock with two Fury. Spenc one focus to charge, one focus to boost attack roll (since you probably need 8s or 9s to hit). He transfers. Boost fist attack; he transfers. You have now done 0 damage.

    Grolar charges abd boosts hammer attack; he transfers but is now knocked down. Fist hits automatically; he transfers and is now out of transfers. You make 3-5 POW 12 shots that hit on 3s; he takes, oh, maybe 12 damage. Buy another hammer attack: dead Warlock.

    It's a simplification, but I still believe the Grolar is our best Warcaster/Warlock killer, and just a great generalist. And if your warcaster doesn't hand out Pathfinder, then the Grolar is probably your best armour cracking option.
    There is always the chance of a crit stationary on the boosted axe, but yes, overall the Grolar is great at killing locks/casters.

  25. #25
    Destroyer of Worlds
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Darkest Canberra
    Posts
    4,353

    Default

    I think the best advice for a new player is: you're going to lose, so lose well.


    Seriously, pick what's fun to you. Go into each game as a learning experience. You're going to lose. And that's actually good! I mean, this isn't a game where you can download a list of models from the internet, show up, and hope your dice beat the other player's dice. You're going to lose. The reason I think that's great (and thought it when I started, and still think it when I have the pleasure of being murdered by one of the really good players I come across) is that it means this game doesn't have an end. You're not going to say to yourself "well, I have the best list and now it's just dice and luck and painting". You'll never stop learning how to get better, because you can always get better.

    After every game, don't jump to the conclusion that you could have done better different models. Maybe you could have! But that's not really helpful yet. Instead, assume there was a way to win with what you had - because, chances are, there was a way, or at least a chance. FIND THAT WIN. Discuss it with your opponent. Work it through. There WAS something you could have done better.

    That's how you get better. Pick a list of stuff you like, and learn how to make it DANCE.

    Maybe you'll run Witch and double Kossites and Bombardiers and Drago and a Beserker. And maybe that's not a good idea. But if you work at it you could well be the BEST PLAYER ON EARTH with that specific combination. You will have learned tricks no-one else ever thought of. And a lot of those tricks you'll be able apply to "good" lists. You might even turn that "bad" list into a good list!

    Desperation is the mother of all invention. Honestly, if you can live with losing a lot more than you win (and really, you sort of need to, starting this game), then my recommendation is to pick a list or two of any quality (i.e. just pick fund stuff) and stick with them as long as you can stand. Get your arse kicked. But surprise people. Work out tactics. Make those lists dance as hard as they can dance.

  26. #26

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SmellyTerror View Post
    I think the best advice for a new player is: you're going to lose, so lose well.
    It's important to accept the possibility of defeat and if it does indeed happen, to accept it gracefully.

    However...

    The game isn't over until it's over. Whatever the list you end up with, starting from day one, play it to the best of your ability. Make it a challenge. Play to win. That way it's interesting to everyone involved. But don't forget that it's a game and games are meant to be fun.

    But if you do lose? Accept it and move on... but make sure you understand why you lost. That way you can improve.
    And if you do win? Make sure you undestand why you won. And see if there's any room for improvement.

    ... The (in)famous Page 5 of yore probably explained this better than I did.
    Last edited by RedCommander; 01-12-2017 at 06:07 PM.

  27. #27

    Default

    Long time no see,Khador's Kommandants!

    in last sunday.Finally,I Played Warmachine!

    My Caster is the Vlad1,And Oppnents Caster is Cryx's iron Lich Asphyxious.

    First game is 30pt game,My army is...

    Khador - tutorial

    Theme: No Theme Selected
    30 / 30 Army


    Vladimir Tzepesci, The Dark Prince - WJ: +28
    - Juggernaut - PC: 12 (Battlegroup Points Used: 12)
    - Juggernaut - PC: 12 (Battlegroup Points Used: 12)
    - Kodiak - PC: 13 (Battlegroup Points Used: 4)

    Manhunter - PC: 4
    Manhunter - PC: 4

    Kayazy Eliminators - Leader & Grunt: 5
    Widowmaker Scouts - Leader & 3 Grunts: 8

    I didn't want to use two Manhunter...But I had forgotten my War Dog&Kayazy Eliminators.
    Well,I have made So Maaaaaany Mistake.I didn't Keep my Focus,I didn't use well Widowmakers...etc.etc.

    I won the first game,but I think Actually this game's winner is My Oppnent.He have tried Assassnation in best time,but His three Hellfire all missed.

    And...I looked the other table,then I really understood that advices about 'you're going to lose, so lose well'.

    In the other table,Zaal2 has 10~20 soul token and Haley3's Cygnar army depends against the Zaal2 who has 18(?) fury.

    When ended that game,I thought Warmachine/Horde is hardcore game and I will lose many game.

    But,you Know,This game is Really Cool!!! I want to play Next game With My Vlad1!

    So...I really need Peaceful-mind that enough accept my lose and don't get rage.

  28. #28
    Conqueror
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Posts
    104

    Default

    Glad you enjoyed your game.

    Dice rolls are always an important part of the game, never forget that.

    It is a really fun game, but as someone who is playing for like 4 month now. It will get frustrating at times. Just don't loose your cool and try to improve and it will be really fun.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •