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  1. #41
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    If you're looking for a unit to run/jam, aren't the groteques better? You get twice as many, and if they survive the jam, they can make not-completely-worthless melee attacks.
    Quote Originally Posted by sathoon View Post
    I'm starting to see proteus as the golden retriever/collie cross of the legion beast 'vean' family: he's very loyal if a little soft round the edges at times, likes to herd other dragonspawn, and is always dragging things back to his warlock's army line looking for praise.

  2. #42
    Destroyer of Worlds Falcen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vaildin View Post
    If you're looking for a unit to run/jam, aren't the groteques better? You get twice as many, and if they survive the jam, they can make not-completely-worthless melee attacks.
    Yes and no. There are a couple of important aspects: 1. DEF15 is great for cheap models, 2. AD helps to put them exactly where they need to be and leaves me more room in my deployment zone, 3. even though their guns are only average, the ability to shoot back instead of just suffering losses on their way in is still worth it, 4. they're additional guns for Lylyth's feat.

    So it depends a lot on which caster you play them with. I've tried both Scouts and Blightblades e.g. with Kallus and for him the bigger model count of Grotesques is the crucial factor (plus their higher POW) to take them instead of Striders.


    But I must add that Ambush for Striders doesn't look very hot to me. I'll wait and see what else the theme force will give until I decide about it.
    Last edited by Falcen; 01-11-2017 at 11:15 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by RocketSurgeon View Post
    So maybe you could say you're still playing rock paper scissors, only now you're playing with eight arms like some sort of bearded geek incarnation of Shiva and each success or failure impacts the next throw.
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  3. #43
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    This is the old Ravens of War from Mk2. The Theme we are about to receive has the same name and focus on Striders and faster models. Maybe we will have some similitude !

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Durgil View Post


    This is the old Ravens of War from Mk2. The Theme we are about to receive has the same name and focus on Striders and faster models. Maybe we will have some similitude !
    For Everyone's Reference (the image is not working for me) here is the Raven's of War:

    Reqs:
    (Lylyth2 theme)
    Warbeasts: Non-character with ranged weapons
    Units: Raptors, Strider Rangers (likely to open up to all striders)
    Solos: Strider Solos, Annyssa Ryvaal
    Battle Engines: None

    Tier 1:
    Reqs: Only models listed above
    Benefit: Strider Rangers become FA:U, +1 FA on Strider Deathstalkers per Strider Unit

    Tier2:
    Reqs: Army includes 2 strider ranger units
    Benefit: One free attachment to a strider ranger unit that does not count towards FA

    Tier3:
    Reqs: 2+ Deathstalkers
    Benefits: Place one 4" Aoe forest template (per 2 deathstalkers in the army) within 20" of the back edge of Lylyth's deployment zone

    Tier4:
    Reqs: Battlegroup includes 3 or more warbeasts
    Benefits: +2 SPD first turn
    Last edited by Eversmite; 01-11-2017 at 11:37 AM.

  5. #45
    Annihilator New Guy 17's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eversmite View Post
    For Everyone's Reference (the image is not working for me) here is the Raven's of War:

    Reqs:
    (Lylyth2 theme)
    Warbeasts: Non-character with ranged weapons
    Units: Raptors, Strider Rangers (likely to open up to all striders)
    Solos: Strider Solos, Annyssa Ryvaal
    Battle Engines: None

    Tier 1:
    Reqs: Only models listed above
    Benefit: Strider Rangers become FA:U, +1 FA on Strider Deathstalkers per Strider Unit

    Tier2:
    Reqs: Army includes 2 strider ranger units
    Benefit: One free attachment to a strider ranger unit that does not count towards FA

    Tier3:
    Reqs: 2+ Deathstalkers
    Benefits: Place one 4" Aoe forest template (per 2 deathstalkers in the army) within 20" of the back edge of Lylyth's deployment zone

    Tier4:
    Reqs: Battlegroup includes 3 or more warbeasts
    Benefits: +2 SPD first turn
    And this is why I have two extra Deathstalkers. :/
    Retribution isn't a job, it's a way of life. If its ears are round, put it in the ground.

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  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Falcen View Post
    In terms of killiung they are very dicey. Last game the were able to get rid of focus on Kaelyssa under Discrodia and Artificer, but most of the time they would kill models only about 6-8pts worth.
    It really depends on:
    1) caster
    2) matchup.

    Under Lylyth2 they've killed 20-30 points of infantry. AD give you ability to position well and aim. Pow 10 kill most infantry well enough. Pin Cushion makes them murder tougher stuff.

    I've found them great at killing standard non-stealth infantry, especially jammers. Pirates, Banes, Idrians etc. They obviously won't do much against elite troops or heavy armour, but thats to be expected. They will jam them A-OK though. Spd 7, Rng 12 and Reposition[3] makes them really mobile and allows hit 'n run tactics.

    Also - Ambush would make them insane. Rat 8 - 10 Pow 10 will murder your opponent support. Now, Blight Blades threaten 13,5 '' from border. Scouts would threaten 22''.
    I've played against great Khador players that utilized Kossite Woodsman to great effect and they're not even half as good as Striders are (Rat 4 if I remember well). Until then I didn't understand how devastating Ambush on (barelly) shooting unit can be.

    Scouts with Ambush would mean basically that your opponent Choir, Wrecks, Journeymans and other squishy support is dead turn two.

  7. #47
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    Personally I don't believe the Scouts will have Ambush.

    But I'm pondering something... If we have the free solo for X pts of units, and considering that Annyssa is not an option (too expensive to be free), would you consider a free Fyanna1 over a Deathstalker (or a Grotesque Assassin if availiable) ?

    On a more serious note, from the look of it, and if it is remotly close to the old Ravens of War, that means:
    - No Typhon or Proteus (except if Thagrosh or Absy, but I don't thing they will run this theme)
    - No Hellmouth (supposed to be "fast" models to be in the theme)
    - No Blackfrost Shard (they don't fit with the theme)
    - No Fury Management (they weren't any in the old one, and they are not really fast)

    Unless there is a big surprise tomorrow, like all Striders models gain Backstab, I fear the Theme will lack any real hitting power to deal with the bulk of an opponent army. High defense is good, but on the long run they are still just jammer and lose on attrition to anything that can boost to hit. Raptors are nice, but you need to send in almost a full unit to kill just 1 heavy. Overall, I think he comes down to this: the theme doesn't seem like it will offer enough answer to the current meta, for the moment, and will probably ask to cut to much of our support for the benefice we will get.

    PS: I know we have seen nothing but a name and a vague description of the theme, but based on the description and the old Ravens of War, I think my assumptions won't be too far off.
    Last edited by Durgil; 01-11-2017 at 10:15 PM.

  8. #48

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    FA: U deathstalkers?! Goes to amazon buys another pair. Hopefully its not limited to just scouts for the bonuses. Scouts deal with light infantry fine but are pretty limited beyond their niche roll. Id love to see a stormfall archer esqe range unit introduced or continuous corrosion added to scout bows. Losing cra sucks.

  9. #49
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    Looks like it is coming out today:

    Quote Originally Posted by PPS_Jackson View Post
    It is its own nightmare. It was settled into after terrible bouts of insomnia for early and teenage years.

    As to the serious note: We will be putting them up today. I often coordinate these endeavors, but as I regularly have said, I am in early. JR and I tend to see who gets in the earliest. So, yeah. I'm in. No one else required to do this is yet because we have different hours. We're shooting for earlier rather than later.

  10. #50
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    Here it is hot off the press:

    Legion warlocks
    • Non-character warbeasts with Flight
    • Non-character light warbeasts
    • Grotesque models/units
    • Strider models/units
    • Raptor models/units
    • Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion solos
    • Forsaken solos
    • Spell Martyr solos
    SPECIAL RULES
    • For every full 20 points of units in this army, you can add one command attachment or smallbased solo to the army free of cost. Free models/units do not count toward the total point value of units in the army when calculating this bonus.
    • Enemy warrior models, warjacks, and warbeasts lose Advance Deployment .
    • Up to one Grotesque Raider unit in this army gains Ambush. (You can choose not to deploy a unit with Ambush at the start of the game. If it is not deployed normally, you can put it into play at the end of any of your Control Phases after your first turn. When you do, choose any table edge except the back of your opponent’s deployment zone. Place all models in the unit with Ambush in formation completely within 3˝ of the chosen table edge.)

  11. #51
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    Seems to me like something Bethayne would like? While Lylyth 3 might not be able to buff damage it could be interesting to have ambushing grotesques come in to stationary targets.

  12. #52

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    So my guess was pretty accurate. Only thing I missed was Spell Martyrs and all Lights, and instead of +2 deployment no AD for your enemy. Overall, I'm pumped to give this theme a shot., just gotta figure out who to play it with.

  13. #53
    Destroyer of Worlds Leonard_Dukes's Avatar
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    For reference:

    Welcome to the All New War, where nothing can possibly go worng.

  14. #54

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    Grotesque Raiders don't have a gun so can't stationary .

    I'm thinking Fyanna2 or even Kryssa. Maybe Rhyas as well could be good, getting a melee infantry unit to pop in on feat turn and get some extra attacks.

  15. #55
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    I have a list drawn up, that I have not played yet, for Lylyth3 that fits into the theme. Of course, it doesn't have grotesques in it. But I could add a death stalker for free, so that's something.
    Quote Originally Posted by sathoon View Post
    I'm starting to see proteus as the golden retriever/collie cross of the legion beast 'vean' family: he's very loyal if a little soft round the edges at times, likes to herd other dragonspawn, and is always dragging things back to his warlock's army line looking for praise.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhonlore View Post
    Grotesque Raiders don't have a gun so can't stationary .

    I'm thinking Fyanna2 or even Kryssa. Maybe Rhyas as well could be good, getting a melee infantry unit to pop in on feat turn and get some extra attacks.
    The idea being that the rest of the army shoots and the raiders come in on ambush without having been shot up/swamped and hit the stationary targets.

  17. #57
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    Its not a bad theme. Turning off enemy AD seems pretty cool. Force them back into their deployment, give you room to move up the board. Ambush has value in scenarios that have zones off to one side. I like it. Not being able to bring Carny-type heavies hurts a bit on hitting power, but it seems like a strong scenario play. When did Legion stop being an assassination faction, and switch to scenario play?
    Quote Originally Posted by sathoon View Post
    I'm starting to see proteus as the golden retriever/collie cross of the legion beast 'vean' family: he's very loyal if a little soft round the edges at times, likes to herd other dragonspawn, and is always dragging things back to his warlock's army line looking for praise.

  18. #58
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    I am now even more glad about the distinction between AD and Distant Deployment as a mirror match would completely neutralize the Hellmouth if it had AD with an extended range.

  19. #59

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    Current war room error: Belphagor isn't kosher.

    Other than that, woo for making my silly flanking raiders list cheaper!
    Positioning! Slowly getting better at gauging what 6, 10, and 12 inches are by eye.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by iratebanana View Post
    Current war room error: Belphagor isn't kosher.

    Other than that, woo for making my silly flanking raiders list cheaper!
    You're lucky. my warroom is stuck on "downloading content"
    Quote Originally Posted by sathoon View Post
    I'm starting to see proteus as the golden retriever/collie cross of the legion beast 'vean' family: he's very loyal if a little soft round the edges at times, likes to herd other dragonspawn, and is always dragging things back to his warlock's army line looking for praise.

  21. #61
    Annihilator Whiskie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vaildin View Post
    You're lucky. my warroom is stuck on "downloading content"
    Force quit the App. Log back in, it'll work fine.

  22. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whiskie View Post
    Force quit the App. Log back in, it'll work fine.
    ended up restarting the phone. its cool now.
    Quote Originally Posted by sathoon View Post
    I'm starting to see proteus as the golden retriever/collie cross of the legion beast 'vean' family: he's very loyal if a little soft round the edges at times, likes to herd other dragonspawn, and is always dragging things back to his warlock's army line looking for praise.

  23. #63
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    So is it worth it to take two units of blight blades, and a unit of raiders in theme?
    Quote Originally Posted by sathoon View Post
    I'm starting to see proteus as the golden retriever/collie cross of the legion beast 'vean' family: he's very loyal if a little soft round the edges at times, likes to herd other dragonspawn, and is always dragging things back to his warlock's army line looking for praise.

  24. #64
    Conqueror rocketmime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vaildin View Post
    Not being able to bring Carny-type heavies hurts a bit on hitting power, but it seems like a strong scenario play.
    Since Proteus is bonded to Absylonia, an Abby1 or Abby2 list can bring him for hitting power.

  25. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocketmime View Post
    Since Proteus is bonded to Absylonia, an Abby1 or Abby2 list can bring him for hitting power.
    He is not really hitting that much harder than a Neraph anyway (at least not compared to a Carnivean/Scythean). Thag + Typhon is where the real hitting power is.

  26. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by vaildin View Post
    So is it worth it to take two units of blight blades, and a unit of raiders in theme?
    Yes I was wondering about that as well. Who to run that with though?

  27. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Da GoBBo View Post
    Yes I was wondering about that as well. Who to run that with though?
    My first draft of that list is Vayl1. The nice thing is, those three units, which should force your opponent mostly towards the center of the board, aren't that expensive. So you take good beasts, and some Raptors, and they should be able to hold the center, while you ambush in. You mainly want to do this when there are zones you can get to from those ambushes.
    Quote Originally Posted by sathoon View Post
    I'm starting to see proteus as the golden retriever/collie cross of the legion beast 'vean' family: he's very loyal if a little soft round the edges at times, likes to herd other dragonspawn, and is always dragging things back to his warlock's army line looking for praise.

  28. #68
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    My Fyanna2 list slots into this theme pretty well.

    Out of theme:

    Fyanna, Torment of Everblight - WB: +28
    - Succubus - PC: 4
    - Angelius - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 17)
    - Angelius - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 11)
    - Neraph - PC: 12
    - Neraph - PC: 12
    - Seraph - PC: 14

    Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion - PC: 6
    The Forsaken - PC: 4
    Blighted Nyss Shepherd - PC: 1
    Blighted Nyss Shepherd - PC: 1
    Spell Martyr - PC: 1
    Spell Martyr - PC: 1

    Strider Scouts - Leader & 5 Grunts: 9
    - Strider Scout Officer & Musician - Officer & Musician: 4

    In Theme:

    Theme: Ravens of War
    75 / 75 Army


    Fyanna, Torment of Everblight - WB: +28
    - Angelius - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 17)
    - Angelius - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 11)
    - Neraph - PC: 12
    - Neraph - PC: 12
    - Seraph - PC: 14

    Blighted Nyss Sorceress & Hellion - PC: 6
    The Forsaken - PC: 4

    Strider Scouts - Leader & 5 Grunts: 9
    - Strider Scout Officer & Musician - Officer & Musician: 0
    Grotesque Raiders - Leader & 9 Grunts: 12

    THEME: Ravens of War



    It basically trades the Succubus, Shepherds, and Spell Martyrs for ambushing Raiders, and removing my opponent's AD.

  29. #69
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    Another warroom error as far as I understand the rules: It's not counting warbeast packs as units. 1 Unit of Wasps + 1 Grotesque Raider unit should be enough to trigger the 20 point unit bonus.
    Legion of Everblight - 15/16 Casters, 671 points of models. | Mercenaries - 11/14 Casters, 550 points of models.
    Cygnar - 12/18 Casters, 396 points of models. | Cryx - 8/18 Casters, 432 points of models.

  30. #70

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    Is Fyanna1 meant to be part of theme being a Strider solo? Or does being a solo not qualify under Strider Model/Unit

  31. #71
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    Pretty good call, Philamilapeed.
    Like this post! (n) others liked this post.

  32. #72

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    She's clearly a strider, so she should be in there.

    I notices some wonky things in warroom regarding cygnar solos in the Cygnar list, though. They Might not have soothed out all issues yet I guess.

  33. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhonlore View Post
    Is Fyanna1 meant to be part of theme being a Strider solo? Or does being a solo not qualify under Strider Model/Unit
    There are no "no characters" restrictions towards solos so she should be available (Annysa is).
    Last edited by cainus_lupus; 01-12-2017 at 06:09 PM.

  34. #74

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    So, thinking of how well this list jams and slows down your opponent, I've come up with the following list to double down on scenario pressure (also, my first eTwins list!). I'm thinking of pairing it with a solid assassination list, so probably Abby2 (I don't own Lylyth3 or it'd be her).

    War Room Army

    Legion of Everblight - Twins RoW

    Theme: Ravens of War
    75 / 75 Army


    Searyn & Rhyas, Talons of Everblight - WB: +24
    - Searyn & Rhyas, Talons of Everblight (Cont.)
    - Angelius - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Points Used: 17)
    - Angelius - PC: 17 (Battlegroup Poibts Used: 7)
    - Nephilim Bolt Thrower - PC: 11
    - Nephilim Bolt Thrower - PC: 11
    - Seraph - PC: 14

    Strider Deathstalker - PC: 4
    Strider Deathstalker - PC: 4

    Strider Scouts - Leader & 5 Grunts: 9
    - Strider Scout Officer & Musician - Officer & Musician: 0
    Grotesque Raiders - Leader & 9 Grunts: 12

    The general idea is Scouts run in front of the zone/flag and just get in the way for a turn or 2, shoot if they can. Turn 2 the Grotesques Ambush in and clog things up further, or if you deployed them on the board, they should be able to run and engage by now. Get the Angelius and Twins into scoring positions, and liberally apply Repulsion and Bolt Thrower shots to keep your opponent away from the scenario elements.

    Possible edits to the list I've thought of so far include swapping out a Deathstalker for a Grotesque Assassin for those occasions you decide not to Ambush the Raiders, or swap both the Scouts and the Grotesques for two units of Blightblades, so you can AD or Ambush both as you please, which also frees up points for a Forsaken and a Spell Martyr.
    Last edited by Philamilapeed; 01-12-2017 at 07:03 PM.

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