Something I´m missing? -Long gunners

[Manglarn]

Hi!

I get the feeling that not so many have long gunners in theirs army , don´t know why , because to me they are pretty awesome ( mkii).

If you have 10 long gunners and use combined ranged attacks without have moved during the previous turn , you also get the 2+ aiming bonus and the extra free attack , giving the result: 3 14" attacks with MAT 17 and the power 20 + 2D6.

I think that is very overpower, but I get the impression that others dont use this possibility?

Am I missing anything with them , some kind of disadvantage?

Thanks in advance!

[Ivellis]

They're very squishy, anything can kill them, they also need to stand still to set that up, and to get a shot off they need LOS. (Which is obviously a downside to most shooting)

They are good yes and I use them regularly, but I wouldn't call them OP.

[xeletor]

It's 2 attacks when you don't move on the CURRENT turn (3 with pHaley on feat turn)
Assuming you meant that, yes its pretty powerful: the people I play have forbidden me to buy long gunners
I like ATGM better anyway.

[UBomb]

They are a good strong ranged option that we have, but most poeple will give up the dual shot and 14 inch range and go with gun mages +UA for true sight.

I use them from time to time and never have been mad at myself for bringing them.

[Serric]

From looking over Ranked Attack on a few of our models, the Longgunners would be able to ignore our own models when making their shots, so that does help them out a bit.

[Fryerdan]

I own 2 max squads and ua combined with trenchers they're nasty. i love em.

[Aries37]

It's because generally ATGM are a little more toolboxy. I know which out of the two I hate facing more.

[kylegnagy]

the people I play have forbidden me to buy long gunners

The people you play obviously dont like to play the game for real I.E. they didnt bring their pair. If they forbid your use of a unit, then what unit are they dropping that is of equal quality? The unit is not broken in anyway so their lack of a solution for the unit causes them to force you to exclude them..... I suppose its good that you like the ATGM.

As for the long gunners.... I love the use of them with Siege. Nothing like dropping them in a foxhole, or dropping the enemy in one to create line of sight. You can even remedy the lack of true sight using mage sight from several warcasters or the Black 13th flare. I look forward to seeing the synergy with our new warcaster.

I love using them because I roll terribly and anything with combined attacks makes rolling easier for me.

[isawatsuke]

for me its a choice between long gunners and atgms during the list construction step pciking both tends to leave me with a list thats too focused on shooting (remember ill probably also have black 13th, eiryss, and a+h). Most of the time i pick atgms because they ignore stealth and have magic weapons.

[Weaselcreature]

I almost always bring longgunners...in fact, their look is the reason I chose Cygnar (back when I knew absolutely nothing about the game).
As was pointed out, you only get 2 shots when you hold still, 1 shot when moving. And keep in mind, a CRA can be broken up into 5, 2-man shots, or 2, 5-man shots or any combo you want letting the unit adjust their fire to what's coming at them.
They love having Snipe on 'em, too!

[GunMageinTraining]

Mage Sight only applys to the warcaster and any battlegroup warjacks, so LGs need B13 Fire Beacon to negate stealth.

If they have snipe, they are very effective, but without it they loose power dramatically. Any blasts (hello mortars) wreck them hard, and most tables/opponent's won't simply let you get those 10man CRAs double tapping. Anything that can run to engage them renders them near worthless too, but they are viable.

Just not overpowering in most circumstances.

[whats82]

Plain don't like'em. Too static and .. boring. Never had an urge to buy them and probably never will.

[CT GAMER]

I like the concept and function of them.

However I have never liked the models and so have never bought any.

I'm holding out for plastic multi-pose long gunners or at the very least a re sculpted unit.

Until then I'll continue to get by without them...

[Ysthrall]

My LGs were the first unit I bought. They've done well in most games I've played them, work darn well if they get snipe, temporal barrier, or any other support. They're a thresher unit, and able to deal a lot of damage at a respectable range, and are pretty cheap.

Not every unit can cope with every situation. LGs can't deal with stealth or (need magic to hurt me) units. They can kill tough units, infantry swarms, do a fair whack of damage to jacks and warcasters, and always cause a significant issue for my opponent. Which for 104 pts is fine with me.

I've never found AoEs to be too much of a problem, but the occasional high speed solo has been. For which I have Junior, a storm smith, or even my warcaster around to clear up.

I had fun with them a while back vs trollbloods. Tough rolls are all very well, but volume of fire will get them in the end...

[Eagle dan 4]

Long gunners aren't a cygnar staple, we have many other units that do the same job just as good. I do have them but i find the B13 are much more effective and versatile due to mage storm and true sight.

It depends what army your facing, agaisnt khador go for it their slow speed will let you get a few shots into them before they reach you, but when playing cyrx on the other hand there not as good

[PG_Dino-Czar]

Long gunners are in an odd place for me. I never regret fielding them, but I usually talk myself out of putting them in a list. I guess I just see them as requiring a lot of support, and when I take that support away I don't really trust them to do their job.

That said, let me reiterate that I have never regretted having them on the table. Long gunners are exceptional at what they do if given time to do it.

[dergliss]

Plain don't like'em. Too static and .. boring. Never had an urge to buy them and probably never will.

Really, "static"? This is exactly the opposite of how I'd describe the Longgunners. With a min unit and UA, you can move and shoot 7 times with a 19 inch threat range, if they stand still they can catch an approaching melee force with 14 POW 10s. Got a hard target coming? Hit it with two POW 17 CRAs. Group of Man-O-War? Hit each of the three of them with a pair of 2-man CRAs. Swing a melee unit between them and an opposing melee unit, then drop Suppressing fire on top of them and make them practically unchargable, or stick them in a defensive position and SF off a section of the board to funnel melee infantry where you want them.

With the ability to CRA and/or double tap as well as Suppressing Fire, they have a lot of utility to adapt to your opponent's force. They aren't the do-all end-all, but their adaptability is exactly why I like them. And when you put them behind the Precursors, they loose most of their weaknesses.

[phreaker187]

LG's are really good, the point cost for them usually steers me away a little more now. The general trend is moving to the ATGM + UA with a marshaled ranged jack. If the LG's had marshal and gave the unit something they would be a no brainer.

[AxeHappy!!]

As much as I hate to ask this has waterfalling been corrected? If not then there is your answer to why the Long Gunners are such a pain.

[phreaker187]

As much as I hate to ask this has waterfalling been corrected? If not then there is your answer to why the Long Gunners are such a pain.

Yes, it's been removed from the game.

[Dark Fledgling]

As has been said, Long gunners get 1 shot per round. the ROF 2 is the maximum number of shots they can make a round. If they stand still to take advantage of duel shot, then that is how they gain the second shot per round. 2 shots standing, 1 shot moving.

Long gunners are in an odd place for me. I never regret fielding them, but I usually talk myself out of putting them in a list.

That said, let me reiterate that I have never regretted having them on the table. Long gunners are exceptional at what they do if given time to do it.

I could not agree more. I find that when building lists, its becoming rarer and rarer for me to put in the long gunners. That being said, when I DO bring them, I have never been disapointed. They have always earned their points back, and have always hit key targets exactly when I needed them too. (Well, except for stannis brocker when they missed him with a 5 man CRA while he was knocked down... damn double ones)

I always understand that they will take AoE fire and suffer losses, but its not the huge 10 man CRA's that help me throughout the game, its the little POW 13's on the solo or the POW 15 doing just damage to take out a system on a key jack. It's the clearing of charge lanes for my jacks and giveing me just enough POW 12 shots on the warcaster to keep him down for good.

Long gunners are the ranged unit that all other ranged units are compared too. They are the unit that has made Cygnar THE ranged army since prime and while all our other ranged options are great aswell (ATGM's, B13th, Trenchers.) They will always be a staple, regardless of wiether they see table time.

Every time i bring them they perform well, and everytime I don't bring them, I wish I had.

-DF

[Techcasualty]

I am always happy with my long gunners. They, IMO, are what trenchers should be in terms of damage capability.

I mean, let me give you a couple examples on WHY I love them.

"Alright, all I have to do now is kill 7 of your long gunners to protect my jacks"
This was in a losing game, but proves the point. You want to talk about damage capability? They are one of the few units we still have that makes jacks quake in their boots.

While discussing how to beat my army..
"I'll just sit behind the forest and refuse to come out. I'll just make you draw"
This one was great. While discussing how to beat my army, they came to the conclusion that the best way was to force a draw. They knew if they stepped into the long gunners los they were going to get toasted.

[Faradon]

I dusted off my cygnar and played a few games over thanksgiving week... during that time I played about 6 games or so and used long gunners only once. I just had too many other good options that felt like they would work together better with the rest of my units.

I also can't bring myself to use the UA... It does make me sad though because in Mk1 I chose Long gunners over most other infantry all the time.

[elwoodblues6389]

Long Gunners = death and destruction.

I love them to death. i hated painting the same *#$)$%) model 10 times however...

[Agamemnon]

Even Khador respects the damage output of a full unit of Longgunners. Now that the B-13 cant put out as much damage they are our heavy hitters at range.

[Dais]

i am embarassed to admit it but i have a hard time using many of the cygnar ranged staples including long gunners. i love what they do when dual shot works but when i park 10 long gunners somewhere nobody ever walks withing 14-18 inches of them. ever.
they make great board control but if i pay 10 points i need more than board control and i struggle to get much more out of them. im not giving up yet though.

[WolfKahn]

I loved my LG's in MK1 but probably won't be fielding them in MKII.

reason: they lost rank fire !!

they took a useless UA (ok suppresion fire is ok but very situational) and added an ablitity to it that make the LG's shine by themselves and now i'm forced to take the UA just to get rank again.

and what does the standar bearer offer the LG ? nothing! no fearless, no + x to y, nix! *grumble**grumble**grumble**grumble**grumble*

PP needs to rethink what the UA was ment to do for the LG in MK III

[Bonehead]

Eh? The long gunners in MkI never had ranked fire, it always came from the UA. In MkII they changed the name of ranked fire to ranked attack, but it seems functionally the same to me (at 3:15 in the morning at least). The Standard Bearer offers a reroll on failed morale tests.

[Techcasualty]

umm in fact, with mk1 the formation rules made ranked attack a little close to necessary for the long gunners. Now that you can be SPREAD THE FSCK OUT it's not so much an issue.

[Bonehead]

Good point about formation. I completely forgot how well nigh mandatory the UA was under the MkI rules.

[DragonWolf]

I think that is very overpower, but I get the impression that others dont use this possibility?

LG are are only overpowered if you play on table with little to no terran that block LoS. In my neck of the woods, there's always plenty of terran so I rarely bring LG and prefer Nyss Hunters for the same point cost. Nyss are faster, have pathfinder, are much better in melee, ignore concealment, cover and forests, plus whatever else I'm forgetting ATM.