Vyros lists & Musings

[ucfan34]

Starting thread from discussion in the Vyros Tactica thread.

Vyros list I've been running is.

+6 Vyros
-10 Discordia
-11 Sentinels + UA
-10 MHSF + UA
- 3 Articifer
- 2 MHA
- 2 Magister
- 2 Sylys
- 1 Arcanist

I'd suggest running at least one Phoenix with Vyros. I've been having a lot of success with Discordia and two Phoenix. At 35,you can still fit two Arcanists and a min unit of MHSF with UA and still have two points to spare. And having the extra range of an Arc Node for Stranglehold is really, really useful, especially if you have Sylys in tow.

I have to question this thought:

I find myself wishing I had an Arc Node. Adding a 2nd heavy at 35pts is too much. Looking at the Chimera with interest.

What is the Chimera provide here? I understand the obvious cost 'issue', yet compared to the assumed list, it only looks like a weak link.

I assume you're taking something like:
Vyros
- Discordia
Sylys
Sentinels + UA (max)
Artificer

That's 25 (so maybe at this point level, a second may be too much) but if you're at 35, a Phoenix is a fantastic investment for Vyros.

I'm finding it hard to come up with 10 points at 35pts for the Phoenix.

I was thinking of dropping the MHSF to a min unit and the Artificer, but I'm not quite ready to give up on the Artificer in the list yet. This would however free up the points for the Chimera.

+6 Vyros
-10 Discordia
- 6 Chimera
-11 Sentinels + UA
- 7 MHSF + UA
- 2 MHA
- 2 Magister
- 2 Sylys
- 1 Arcanist

Alternatively, I was thinking with the Chimera / Arc Node I might drop Sylys. That would allow me to drop either the MHA / Magister and add another Arcanist.

+6 Vyros
-10 Discordia
- 6 Chimera
-11 Sentinels + UA
- 7 MHSF + UA
- 3 Articifer
- 2 MHA / Magister
- 1 Arcanist
- 1 Arcanist

I was looking at the Chimera pretty much due to it's cost. It gets me a node, another set of open fists (if necessary), and on the feat turn (which is probably turn 2) I should be killing enough to fill both it and Discordia up with focus. It's sitting at Def 15 pretty much the turn it needs to be (presumably).

Not sure if those 'pros' outweigh other options in general though. Getting it on the table is the obvious answer to some of this, but speculation/hearsay/conjecture makes the forums go round.

[Kallas]

At 35, if you prefer the Sentinel brick over MHSF I'd suggest:

Vyros +6
- Discordia 10
- Phoenix 10
Sylys 2
Sentinels + UA (max) 11
2x Arcanists 2

That's 35. You've 6 left for whatever else. I'd, personally, run with twin Magisters, but I'm a huge fan. Or you could (if you really wanted) drop an Arcanist and grab min MHSF + UA.

I think Vyros works best by far with a mix of troops and jacks.

For comparison, my preferred Vyros list is:
Vyros
- Discordia
- Phoenix
- Phoenix
Sylys
2x Arcanists
MHSF + UA (min)

I feel that the MHSF are safe either naturally or near Discordia for blast immunity. You can brick up with IR on Discordia or Vyros, and having Arm 20 regenerating Phoenix is just funny. The MHSF can usually get enough focus on feat turn to get a chain started and can kill off support more than capably.

But, folks have preferences, so what's yours?

[NEoJoe]

I've never really made an attempt to use a Chimera with Vyros. Can I ask what spell you want to be arcing even? That can make a difference in all this.

Also consider that you said you might be playing Vyros back a bit farther than necessary. Would that mean that with Sylys' +2" you won't need a node?

But I'm not trying to convince you not to do the Chimera thing. I know how good Stranglehold is and how good Eliminator can be. Hell, even with arcing. Off the top of my head, the little node bugger might be good for placing Eliminator at the right spot all the time, allowing Vyros a huge board shift more often than if he didn't have a super mobile node who's hard to pin down.

Kallas' first list has six points to spare. Plus your Chimera into that and you have a super basic Vyros list that also has a Chimera. Perfect way to give it a test drive. In fact, the only 35 point list on my ibodger is that one, and the six points are 3 escorts and eEiryss.

What I'm doing nowadays though looks more like this

Vyros
-Hydra
-Phoenix
-Sylys
1x Arcanist (important distinction)
Full Sents +UA
1 Escort
Min MHSF+UA

I enjoy the Hydra, what can I say. The alternative that I do for Character Restrictions practice is drop Sylys for another escort and the second Arcanist.

Ideas! Have them!

[ucfan34]

At 35, if you prefer the Sentinel brick over MHSF I'd suggest...

I'll give the first list a try. Many ways to fill 6pts (Chimera, woot). I don't have a 2nd Phoenix for the 2nd list. I presume you don't feel you have an issue with threat saturation? It could just be me, but I find if I make a 35pt Vyros list with more than 1 heavy I'll review it and decide I need more bodies.

...having Arm 20 regenerating Phoenix is just funny.

Thus far, I've only used IR on Sentinels and Vyros. This sounds like it's worth trying.

The MHSF can usually get enough focus on feat turn to get a chain started and can kill off support more than capably.

Am I right in presuming that part of your strategy then is to fuel of the jacks on an early feat turn, and then clear as much as possible? After reading it I can see this overcoming my fear of a lack of bodies.

But, folks have preferences, so what's yours?

Grape > Strawberry
Red > Blue
Blond > All others
or if you meant regarding Warmahordes / vyros. Not too sure quite yet, but I think I naturally lean torwards units/bodies. The more I think about your Disco and Phoenix x2 list the more apt I am to try it out. I could proxy no problem, but I'd hate to buy a 2nd Phoenix with all of the Vyre jacks coming up soon (or not so soon).

I've never really made an attempt to use a Chimera with Vyros. Can I ask what spell you want to be arcing even? That can make a difference in all this. Also consider that you said you might be playing Vyros back a bit farther than necessary...

Strangle Hold. Saw 3 missed oppertunities for it over my last 2 games (one of which I'd say cost me the game), and I wasn't able to get in range even with Sylys. And yeah, it's probably me playing too far back. I should probably be able to get in at least 2 games tonight. Gonna put some concentrated effort to move further up field. I'll see how it goes. Pending that I'll probably drop Sylys, and add the Chimera for a few, and then try both. My initial feeling that both the Chimera and Sylys is a waste.

But I'm not trying to convince you not to do the Chimera thing...

No worries. I knew when considering the Chimera, that it wouldn't be the most optimal (says who, lol) or popular choice. Actually, after reading your thoughs on Eliminator I think I'm more apt to try it. I've definately used Eliminator the least so far.

Kallas' first list has six points to spare. Plus your Chimera into that and you have a super basic Vyros list that also has a Chimera. Perfect way to give it a test drive. In fact, the only 35 point list on my ibodger is that one, and the six points are 3 escorts and eEiryss.

Yeah, first thing to come to mind when I responded above. And someday I've got to try this Eiryss everyone raves about.

What I'm doing nowadays though looks more like this...

I built Discordia instead of a Hydra since I had the upgrade kit on hand. (My silly wife bought me the Discordia upgrade and no Heavy Myrm kit, lol).
I see you list looking like my initial one. +Hydra then -solos. I can see that, but then where the hell am I fitting that trundling Artificer. :P

Ideas! Have them!

I'm sig'ing this.

[NEoJoe]

Blond is indeed the best one, but not by a huge margin. If blonde is 10/10, brunette and red and black are 9/10. Gotta be a vibrant kind of blond though. Also dyed bright red and jet black are pretty sweet.

Anywho, your wife did pretty good by setting you on the path to Discordia. I think overall, if I had to pick any one weapon to bring to a fight, it'd be Discordia, the giant jack/unit attachment face smasher.

[Kallas]

I'll give the first list a try. Many ways to fill 6pts (Chimera, woot). I don't have a 2nd Phoenix for the 2nd list. I presume you don't feel you have an issue with threat saturation? It could just be me, but I find if I make a 35pt Vyros list with more than 1 heavy I'll review it and decide I need more bodies.

I've been running relatively jack heavy (battle report thread in my sig) and I've not been particularly hard done by.

The three heavies work well: all three hit hard, are tough (Discordia protects from shooting, Phoenix regenerate) and have high POW/infantry clearing guns/other (all guns POW 14,have a SP or AOE and two have Combustion.)

Thus far, I've only used IR on Sentinels and Vyros. This sounds like it's worth trying.

If you run like a brick but a little dispersed with Discordia in the middle, you're laughing. Discordia pops her Kinetic Field and all three become ARM 20 vs ranged and IR hikes one up to ARM 22, probably best to go for Discordia (no free regen means less damage is better.)

Am I right in presuming that part of your strategy then is to fuel of the jacks on an early feat turn, and then clear as much as possible? After reading it I can see this overcoming my fear of a lack of bodies.

Generally, but that's more because earlier there are many more opportunities for focus gaining. The second main reason is as you say, clearing enemy bodies is very important.

Bodies pumping out numbers, if your jacket can slaughter swathes of infantry just as easily, what are bodies doing? Concentration of force means your jacks live longer. Those snipers/scathers/non-Blast AOE's/etc tearing through your infantry? Not doing much to your much tougher regenerating jack.

But of course be cautious and use your speed. With Vyros, you're running rings around everyone but Vyros! Use that speed and your ranged ability to put dents in them before they can even try.

And with two Arc Nodes, you will have plenty of targets for Stranglehold/Eliminator. Stranglehold has saved me multiple times and if you do take Eiryss, you will control a great portion of enemy jacks. And Stranglehold works on beasts!

Grape > Strawberry
Red > Blue
Blond > All others

Banana > Strawberry
Grey > Yellow
Brunette > Blonde

or if you meant regarding Warmahordes / vyros. Not too sure quite yet, but I think I naturally lean torwards units/bodies. The more I think about your Disco and Phoenix x2 list the more apt I am to try it out. I could proxy no problem, but I'd hate to buy a 2nd Phoenix with all of the Vyre jacks coming up soon (or not so soon).

Units are fine, as long as they have a purpose. Building your list to work in unison is better than simply having numbers. This is why I'm very comfortable with the three heavies: I love the speed and power they combine with the precision and tricksiness of the MHSF.

Play to your strengths as a player, but develop your ability. If you don't try other things, you cannot definitively define your strengths. I used to hate Kae, then I played her a bunch and she's my joint first favourite (with Vyros!) By knowing your models, you can know your style and that's more important. And if you can use more styles? Then you win

Strangle Hold. Saw 3 missed oppertunities for it over my last 2 games(one of which I'd say cost me the game) [...]
Gonna put some concentrated effort to move further up field. I'll see how it goes. Pending that I'll probably drop Sylys, and add the Chimera for a few, and then try both. My initial feeling that both the Chimera and Sylys is a waste.

If you don't want Sylys and Chimera, keep Sylys. Obviously, try the Chimera by all means, but Sylys does so very much for Vyros. Arcane Secrets on Vyros is amazing when you fire out one Stranglehold each turn.

If I use Vyros, I look for opportunities to use it, AS on the hit (3 dice, drop lowest) and boost damage (4 dice drop lowest) to tag a heavy. If it works, I can move in very aggressively to kill infantry/gang up on another heavy without fear of retaliation from the tagged one. With three heavies, possibly feat focus too, you can put serious hurt out there.

And Vyros should be mid field. Use the terrain to your advantage again. If you can get extra DEF up in the middle, it's worth being slightly more exposed.

The trickiest part is knowing where is too far. That comes through practice.

And someday I've got to try this Eiryss everyone raves about.

I used to never use her and I learned to deal without her. She is incredibly powerful, and with Vyros against WM, she will give you great control over jacks. She is very useful, but not auto include. Except in a tournament :P

I built Discordia instead of a Hydra

Best decision of your life, ever. No exaggeration.

Seriously.

OK maybe a little...

[ucfan34]

battle report thread in my sig

I shall read this.

you're running rings around everyone but Vyros!

Not sure what you mean by "but Vyros". Just that he's only moving 6" a turn without spells?

Stranglehold has saved me multiple times and if you do take Eiryss, you will control a great portion of enemy jacks.

Out of all the games I've played, I just encountered Eiryss on the table for the first time Tuesday night (eEiryss). She was effective. I can see why she's in so many lists. I'll have a batrep up soon.

Banana > Strawberry
Grey > Yellow
Brunette > Blonde

Madness! :P

If you don't want Sylys and Chimera, keep Sylys. Obviously, try the Chimera by all means, but Sylys does so very much for Vyros. Arcane Secrets on Vyros is amazing when you fire out one Stranglehold each turn.

I'll definitely be toying with this. Although, I can see myself just winding up 'upgrading' to a Phoenix after testing.

And Vyros should be mid field. Use the terrain to your advantage again. If you can get extra DEF up in the middle, it's worth being slightly more exposed.

I was able to do exactly this....and it SHOULD have worked, but damn user error. It'll be in the batrep.

[ucfan34]

Game from Tuesday night. Opponent was playing eButcher. Going off of memory, but think I've got most everything right.

I used the same list I've been using.
+ 6 Vyros
-10 Discordia
-11 Sentinels + UA
-10 MHSF + UA
- 3 Articifer
- 2 MHA
- 2 Magister
- 2 Sylys
- 1 Arcanist

Opponent's list was...
+ 6 eButcher
-11 Beast 09
- 2 Valechev
-10 Nyss Hunters
- 5 Great Bears
- 5 Drakhun w/ Dismount
- 5 Fenris
- 3 eEiryss

Scenario was Revelation. I got first turn & choose to deploy first. There are 3 walls/linear obstacles on the board all horizontal to the table edge. They're all pretty equidistant from each other and the table edges. A hill is sitting in front of my deployment zone where the 4 wall would be (if that makes sense). A building is sitting almost smack in the middle of the board right between the flags (terrain was set up before we rolled for scenario).

Deployment:
I deployed everything but my AD in typical "brick" formation off to the right, with the flag pretty much straight ahead. The MHSF was deployed off to the left across from flag 2. MHA was next to the MHSF.

Opponent pretty much deployed in a big line slightly to his left. From left to right. Drakhun, Greatbears (Slightly behind the line), eButcher, Beast 09, Valechev & Nyss hunters about (8" from the table edge), eEiryss & Fenris.

Game Turn 1
(Me): It was pretty standard as far as first turns go. Sentinels Ran (to a hill) Arcanist then activated allocating a focus to Discordia (I forgot to allocate before moving the Sentinels). Discordia then imprinted and advanced up behind the Sentinels. Vyros moved up a bit, then cast Inviolable Resolve on the Sentinels and Hallowed Avenger on Discordia. Everything else following behind, except for the MHSF who moved up along the left side behind a wall (with a building in front of them I was primed to shoot through), and the MHA who ran near the middle of the field to the right of the house.

(Opponent): Opponent rolled a 4 for ebutchers focus giving him 5. Don't quite remember the order everything moved, but... Fenris ran up the table edge. eEiryss advanced (ending up about 3" in front of Fenris) and took a shot at the only Sentinel in range (which happened to be the Standard Bearer. I'd like to say I set them up that way, but alas I did not.). her shot hit, removed IR, and killed with the auto point of damage. Valechev and the Nyss just advanced (unit is spread very wide w/ Valechev way back). Closest 2 Nyss both shots at the Sentinels. First shot missed with the Sentinels with the +2 for the hill. Second shot hit, but couldn't crack the armor. Beast09 advanced (may have run) and is standing next to the edge of the wall. Great bears moved up a bit, about 6 or so inches behind eButcher. Drakhun moved up about 4-5" behind the building in the middle.

Game Turn 2
(Me) Took my vengeance move with the Sentinels just moving forward 3". I allocated 2 focus to Discordia. Hallowed Avenger up kept for free on Discordia. I issued a run/charge to the Sentinels. I was able to get 3 charges off on the Nyss Hunters. Two Sentinels ran to engage eEiryss. The rest of the Sentinels ran up behind the 3 that charged. Discordia again imprinted and ran, following the Sentinels. I had Vyros advance to the hill. I then had the Artificer trundle up next to Vyros and casts force wall. Sylys Advanced. The Arcanist advanced up and tried to put concentrated power on Discordia, but was out of range. The Magister advanced to the left side of the Artificer. The MHA was able to charge the Drakhun, hit, then at dice -9 I rolled a 9 doing 0 damage. MHSF advanced up behind the house. I was able to get 6 of them in range to shoot the Drakhun. 5 of 6 shots hit doing a total of 1 point of damage.

(Opponent): Opponent rolled a 3 for eButchers focus giving him 4. He started by activating eButcher and popping feat. eButcher advanced and was able to get to a single Sentinel. He apparently did exactly what eButcher was designed to do killing all of the Sentinels except for the 2 engaging eEiryss. Beast 09 charged Discordia and did 11 damage. Nyss hunters moved up and managed to kill the 2 Sentinels engaging eEiryss. eEiryss moved up, shot at Vyros, and hit stripping focus (I said I was at Def 17 with the hill, but was actually at 19 with the hill and Force Barrier from the Artificer. Opponent rolled an 18.) Fenris Ran up field. The Drakhun moved up and Great Bears moved up. One of them killed the MHA, but I don't remember who. eButcher allocated his rage tokens. Beast 09 charged Vyros. Rolled a crit freezing Vyros in place. Damage roll left Vyros at 4 boxes. One of the Great Bears then charged in and finished him off.

Post game thoughts, comments, ect:
I'n not faced a single model in the opponents army yet. Before the game he asked me if I'd played eButcher. I had not, and he advised that he is a savage, and I didn't want him near my army. I did not heed the warning, although not purposely. Im ade some pretty glaring errors. Most of them being correctable by just taking a bit more time before jumping right to my next move. Most of them I realized just after it was too late. For all my efforts thus far to make the Artificer relevant I'm most irritated by that mistake.

+eButcher's army is deceptively fast.
+ Should I have kept in mind the exact reason I was bringing the Artificer, eEiryss would have missed Vyros. Grrrr
+ I forgot to cast IR on the Sentinels turn 2. Pretty sure it didn't make a difference.
+ It is sort of funny to see just how far opponents go out of their way to deal with it, almost justifying it's inclusion, but the more I play the MHA the more I feel like I should take something else. It's most notable kill thus far is a Koldun Lord. I've not rolled significant damage on a jack yet.
+ I'm drinking the Kool-Aid on the Magister, but I haven't been able to get the results out of it the I feel I should. It's probably me.
+ I'm right at .500 since starting up with Ret a few weeks ago (about 20 games). Playing someone who knows exactly how their going to kill your face was cool in a way...Now where are all those other newer players go?

[Murkhadh]

The beauty of the MHA is just how much that little 2 pointer will change your opponents plans, its hard to quantify its effect, its too risky to just ignore him.

[NEoJoe]

Nice read, UCfan.

Now about the turn you charged with the Sentinels. It takes time to learn, but if you can only deliver a couple of them, you have to do a few things. First, you have to make sure that'll be worth it. It almost always will be, but you've gotta check anyhow. After that, you only commit a few. You keep the rest ~10" back. This means the opponent must kill the commited ones, probably miss out on killing more, or be deep in your lines if he manages to get more stuff on your back Sentinels. This means you will get another round of vengeance. Now that's a general thing, I don't know what your board looked like, but yeah, eButcher can tornado through infinite units if they're all close. You cannot bunch up next to him or all of them will die and his army will get enough rage tokens to seal the game (you know that part now though). Just saying, sometimes you just charge with like two of them. I've split my single unit into three waves before and it works awesomely when you can appropriately do that.

Otherwise, good job. It sounds like your opponent really knows what he was doing, so he'll be really good practice (provided he wasn't actually charging with those rage tokens, eh?)

[Kallas]

I used the same list I've been using.

Opponent's list was...
+ 6 eButcher
-11 Beast 09
- 2 Valechev
-10 Nyss Hunters
- 5 Great Bears
- 5 Drakhun w/ Dismount
- 5 Fenris
- 3 eEiryss

Nasty list!

I deployed everything but my AD in typical "brick" formation off to the right, with the flag pretty much straight ahead. The MHSF was deployed off to the left across from flag 2. MHA was next to the MHSF.

You were deploying first, so you had less choice, but given the scenario, why did you split your forces (if I'm reading this correctly)?

Having your brick central would've given you more ability to counter his strategy and to move on to whichever flag would have been more ideal. Unless I'm missing something about the terrain...

As for the MHSF, similar thing. What was their target?

Game Turn 1
(Me): It was pretty standard as far as first turns go. Sentinels Ran (to a hill) Arcanist then activated allocating a focus to Discordia (I forgot to allocate before moving the Sentinels). Discordia then imprinted and advanced up behind the Sentinels. Vyros moved up a bit, then cast Inviolable Resolve on the Sentinels and Hallowed Avenger on Discordia. Everything else following behind, except for the MHSF who moved up along the left side behind a wall (with a building in front of them I was primed to shoot through), and the MHA who ran near the middle of the field to the right of the house.

Forgetting the allocation is silly, but everyone does it! It comes with time. I used to forget loads (Apparition, Phoenix Field) and I wrote a cheat sheet of the turn order and put it in a card sleeve to remind myself. Helps to remember Vengeance too...

Valechev and the Nyss just advanced (unit is spread very wide w/ Valechev way back).

How was he running the Nyss? Because Valechev is the Ranking Officer, the unit uses him as its Unit Commander, so all models have to stay in range of him, not Cylena.

I issued a run/charge to the Sentinels. I was able to get 3 charges off on the Nyss Hunters. Two Sentinels ran to engage eEiryss. The rest of the Sentinels ran up behind the 3 that charged.

As NEoJoe pointed out, if only a few can reach, you will want to keep others back. Especially against eButcher!

The Arcanist advanced up and tried to put concentrated power on Discordia, but was out of range.

Why did you try this? If Discordia is running, Concentrated Power will do absolutely nothing. CP lasts for one turn, so you may have been better off running your Arcanist into a better position.

The MHA was able to charge the Drakhun, hit, then at dice -9 I rolled a 9 doing 0 damage.

And that's why I really dislike the MHA. Can be brutal. Usually isn't.

eEiryss moved up, shot at Vyros, and hit stripping focus (I said I was at Def 17 with the hill, but was actually at 19 with the hill and Force Barrier from the Artificer. Opponent rolled an 18.)

Again a mistake that will be rectified by practice. Do you use tokens? Even little bits of paper work great for remembering.

Beast 09 charged Vyros.

Again, as pointed out, charging with Rage tokens isn't allowed. It's only a full advance, which for Beast is 4" with Reach.

+ I'm drinking the Kool-Aid on the Magister, but I haven't been able to get the results out of it the I feel I should. It's probably me.

Try and hold the Magister back a little, maybe behind the Sentinels. He can cast over their heads at heavies and lights and tug them about. And once the enemy closes, you can Combo Smite on the charge for knock down and decent damage on heavies.

If you get lucky on Force Bolt, you can KD something and either tug it closer to Sentinel it or shove it away as denial.


Some pretty good experience for you there. How are you feeling about your list choices? Do you feel anything lacks? Anything that excels?

[PG_Dawnlord Ed]

Blond is indeed the best one, but not by a huge margin. If blonde is 10/10, brunette and red and black are 9/10. Gotta be a vibrant kind of blond though. Also dyed bright red and jet black are pretty sweet.

I don't know you, NEo, but for some reason I'm not surprised that you're into the rockadile reds. ;-)

Anyway, good batrep. It sounds like you learned from your mistakes and got a lot out of the game. That's the best kind of loss right there.

I enjoyed seeing these lists too. Lots of things to try here.

[ucfan34]

Now about the turn you charged with the Sentinels. It takes time to learn...

Yeah, still working on unit spacing....it makes so much sense after the fact.

eButcher can tornado through infinite units if they're all close.

I pretty much just ran / charged in one big wave. eButcher started at one end of the conga line and stopped when there were no more bodies, lol. Also, I did forget to mention also that while I did upkeep Hallowed Avenger on Discordia, I forgot to actually use it. Neither me or my opponent realized until after the fact.

provided he wasn't actually charging with those rage tokens, eh?

No, that was just my poor use of terminology when trying to acuately explain what happened.

Nasty list!

No kidding. After the game my opponent mentioned that it was a bit strong all things considered. I personally don't mind this. Kind of a 'got to play better opponents to get better' kind of thing. I told him I would have tabled him if I could, I just can't.

why did you split your forces (if I'm reading this correctly)? As for the MHSF, similar thing. What was their target?

The army wasn't really as split as I probably made it sound. MHSF were just to the left and AD'd. A run on turn 1 would have had them in the left front of the rest of my force. Deployment was dictated off of the house. Everything off to the side a bit, and MHSF not really caring about the house for shooting purposes.

How was he running the Nyss? Because Valechev is the Ranking Officer, the unit uses him as its Unit Commander, so all models have to stay in range of him, not Cylena.

Didn't know this. Not sure of Valechev's CMD range, but the front few Nyss may have been out. Not being able to remember though, I'd error on the side of my opponent probably got it right.

Why did you try this? If Discordia is running, Concentrated Power will do absolutely nothing. CP lasts for one turn, so you may have been better off running your Arcanist into a better position.

IC. I was thinking it'd be usefule on the Hallowed Avenger charge.

Do you use tokens? Even little bits of paper work great for remembering.

I just upgraded from paper scraps to official tokens, woot! Haven't been using a token for the Artificer...learned that lesson the hard way.

Try and hold the Magister back a little, maybe behind the Sentinels.

Haven't really had him trail the Sentinels yet. I'll give this a go.

How are you feeling about your list choices? Do you feel anything lacks? Anything that excels?

Still trying to get a feel for everything as a whole. I'd say I don't really need a full unit of MHSF. Dropping them to a min unit would be the first change I'd make. Probably dropping the MHA at the same time and then adding a unit of SFA. If I'm not trying to work in a Phoenix or experementing with the Chimera as previously discussed.

It sounds like you learned from your mistakes and got a lot out of the game. That's the best kind of loss right there.

Indeed. Really gotta make it a point to clean up the little things.

Doesn't look like I'll be getting any games until this weekend, Sat is our tourney for the journeyman. I am bringing a Kaelyssa list also, but will pretty much stick to running Vyros barring the unforseen (or cryx). I'll have a few game to report back on after that.

[ucfan34]

Journeyman tournament was today. Brief write-ups and thoughts on the games are below.

Wound up using Vyros for all 3 rounds.

List:
+ 6 Vyros
-10 Discordia
-11 Sentinels + UA
-10 MHSF + UA
- 3 Articifer
- 2 MHA
- 2 Magister
- 2 Sylys
- 1 Arcanist

Round 1 was against Menoth/eKreoss.

Opponent's List was...
+ 6 eKreoss
- 9 Blood of Martyrs
-11 Avatar of Menoth
- 2 Chior of Menoth
- 7 Exemplar Errants + UA (Min)
- 5 Knights Exemplar
- 2 Exemplar Errant Seneschal
- 5 High Exemplar Gravus

Don't remember the name of the scenario. It was the one where each opponent had to destroy an object on the opponents side of the board to score a point.

Nothing too notable happened in the beginning of the game. Gravus was able to charge the object and put 8 damage on it. I was able to take out the Knights Exemplar and the Avatar with the Sentinels. Once that happened it was pretty much over. Opponent moved eKreoss out to try to take out the object for a scenario point, but only did a few damage. Sentinels Killed eKreoss on my next turn. Wound up with 37 CP.

Round 2 was against Searforge/Gorten.

Opponents List was...

+ 7 Gorten Grundback
- 3 Grunback Blaster
- 3 Grunback Blaster
- 3 Grunback Blaster
- 6 Ghordson Driller
- 9 Avalancher (on Thor)
- 5 Horgenhold Forge Guard (Min)
- 5 Horgenhold Forge Guard (Min)
- 3 Gundrun
- 3 Bokur (On Gorten)
- 2 Thor Steinhammer

Scenario was gaining ground.

Both armies moved up on the first 2 turns doing minimal casualties. MHSF did take out a few forge guard through the forest. Opponent popped feat and moved everything to my right. He wasn't able to catch Vyos or 1 Sentinel in the feat and due to the Sentinels placement the Artificer only moved about an inch. Opponent went for the assassination on Vyros who Was sitting at Def 21 Arm 22. Wound up being a bad idea. Didn't hit Vyros once. I'd moved up and cleared out the forge guard. Was sitting about 2" from Gorten, with the Sentinels at the end of my last turn. Was ready take him out when dice down was called. I wound up winning by scenario, but it was close. Model wise I'd only lost 3 Sentinels and 2 MHSF though. 16 CP total.

Round 3 was against Cryx/Terminus

Opponent's list was...

+ 4 Lich Lord Terminus
- 4 Stalker
- 8 Bane Thralls
- 5 Bile Thralls
- 5 Mechanithralls
- 2 Brute Trall
- 2 NecroSurgeon & 3 Stich Thralls
- 5 Withershadow Comine
- 4 Bane Lord Tartarus
- 2 Madelyn Corbeau
- 2 Warwitch Siren

Scenario was Capture The Flag.

This was a rough game. Had a Forest and Large pool of shallow water right in front of my deployment zone. I was able to take out all of the Bile Thralls with the MHSF. Also took out all of the Bane Thralls over multiple turns. Tartarus Made 4 tough rolls in a row. Other than that I pretty much had infantry run down my throat until Terminus killed Vyros. Arcanist did kill a Bane Thrall, woot.

Thoughts:
Game 1 my opponent's big mistake was moving the Avatar up in charge range of some of the Sentinesl. Gaze of Menoth, I don't mind. Game was closer than the score appeared.

Game 2 Vyros was virtually immune to ranged assassination, but I don't think my opponent realized it until it was too late. Game wasn't as close as it appeared. The Artificer as a Vyros escort is working out great, but against melee heavy armies it's noticeable that his role is diminished.

Game 3 my opponent was one of our local pressgangers. Got rolled pretty bad. Not quite last eButcher game bad, but pretty bad. He didn't face an army with souls in the first 2 rounds. He was excited about his prospects and I saw why, lol.

Good fun all in all. In my previous post I'd mentioned that I'd drop the MHSF to a min unit and the MHA. I think I'd drop the Magister instead of the MHA. He was easily the most ineffective part of my list (again, probably just me). The Storm Fall Archers would have been useful in all 3 games, but especially game 3.

10 min turns are a hectic. Making Vengeance moves and then the normal turn made it tight in all 3 games. The list is definitely not meant for some scenarios.