Totem Hunter or Croak Hunter?

[Khador_Extremist]

Which do you prefer? or which do you think is the better and why

[drachenfels]

depends... how many points do i have left in my list? since they are non critical components and tend to be harassment/flanking model and none of the minion warlocks have any spells that explicitly make them better (nothing that boosts shooting, nothing that improves melee) it all comes down to what i have left after ive taken everything else i need.

[Ragged]

If I think my opponents going to have annoying solos I'll take the Totem Hunter, if not I'll take 2 Croak Hunters and have them follow my posse's and help them cut through anything they encounter.

[SneaklePete]

Totem hunter. Partly because he's awesome, but mostly because having Prey on a key solo/unit helps me force it to a certain side of the board. But I also play a lot of jack and construct heavy lists, so the smaller living models tend to be the posses' work.

[mortal]

I prefer the croak hunter. The ranged ability and 4 dice on a charge has worked way better for me than the totem hunter.

[GlassJaw]

Which do you prefer?

Yes. Get both.

2 Croaks and a Hunter make an insane flanking trio.

[Uehen]

The hunter is worth the extra point if you have it, the frogs are worth their two points as well. Sometimes you will wish you had the other, but really, it will come down to how you play. I like having three frogs and the hunter. Tossing spears into knocked down models with Barney is always a fun time.

[MagnustheJust]

Yes. ......

[Epizeuxis]

I use two croak hunters, as well as the totem hunter. I'll probably add a third croak when they get restocked at my LGS.

It's a good deal of fun to set them off to the side and let them skulk around in the forests. Forces my opponent to deal with them, or risk some serious trouble - which makes it harder for them to ALSO deal with angry gatormen, and warbeasts cruising up the middle of the table. Plus, killing some nice supports or solos, then putting prey on the caster is a nice set up for Barnabas' feat turn. 3d6-4d6 with 2-3 croaks, plus a TH with prey all on a knocked down caster is hilarious.

[Fedora]

I don't own any croak hunters, but totem hunter for me usually ends up just filling up my last couple of points.

I can never quite decide what I should send him after since it basically always causes my opponent to just send them to the opposite side of the field, or when he goes after them he wiffs on damage or something (Like on Tartarus every single time.)

I don't think he's ever done anything that actually did anything truly significant for me (Like Thrullg who wins me games in some of my worst match ups, 'hurfdurf I'll shut thorn down for three turns! Am I the champee now boss?') and other things that I wish I could murder, he simply can't. (Darragh) And every single time he has a shot at a caster, I can't manage to kill his prey off with something else so he can jump said caster with prey up. Maybe I should just give up and go straight to preying their caster and just make them afraid to move up.

Once the Witch Doctor comes out, I don't suspect he'll be seeing much play for me anymore.

[MagnustheJust]

I don't think he's ever done anything that actually did anything truly significant for me (Like Thrullg who wins me games in some of my worst match ups, 'hurfdurf I'll shut thorn down for three turns! Am I the champee now boss?') and other things that I wish I could murder, he simply can't. (Darragh) And every single time he has a shot at a caster, I can't manage to kill his prey off with something else so he can jump said caster with prey up. Maybe I should just give up and go straight to preying their caster and just make them afraid to move up.

Question... Is your Totem Hunter painted? I had similar issues with my Totem Hunter, till I finally finished painting him - he was started back in 2007 when he came out, but I never finished him till last summer.

Since then, he has been a force to be reckoned with!!

[MMMMK]

I've been using a min. unit of Trogs to perform most of these tasks instead of the Croaks (don't own them yet).
How do you more veteran Gator players compare the Trogs to the Croaks? I find that the versatility of ambush is
really handy and means that the Trogs can threaten a big part of the board. If what you want to kill is deployed
centrally, then the Trogs can be ambushed and run behind your opponent's line.

I feel like I always misplay the Totem Hunter, but in my games he usually fails to achieve what I need him to. Jump
is a neat ability but the Hunter is just a bit fragile in my experience and tends to get in two attacks on a juicy target
(which sometimes fail to kill it) then counter charged and killed despite Sprinting away (if he was successful, anyway).

[SneaklePete]

I feel like I always misplay the Totem Hunter, but in my games he usually fails to achieve what I need him to. Jump
is a neat ability but the Hunter is just a bit fragile in my experience and tends to get in two attacks on a juicy target
(which sometimes fail to kill it) then counter charged and killed despite Sprinting away (if he was successful, anyway).

Bury that sucker in a forest. With pathfinder and leap, LOS isn't much of an issue and it keeps him safer. Prey is fun, but I usually don't actually go for my prey item. I use it to push something away, then take out the other easy targets my opponents doesn't expect him to go for. He does attract a lot of fire though, especially when I face an opponent who likes to use him and knows what damage he can do.

[Fedora]

Question... Is your Totem Hunter painted? I had similar issues with my Totem Hunter, till I finally finished painting him - he was started back in 2007 when he came out, but I never finished him till last summer.

Since then, he has been a force to be reckoned with!!

No, he's painted. He's just really good at whiffing, and of course anything that ever has tough always passes against him. (Such as A&H one time because of Valachev and eIrusk. Passed both their tough rolls so he's just kind of sitting there twiddling his thumbs then ends up dead.)

Speaking of tough; I wouldn't mind something with entropic field that is Blindwater congregation ONLY, since I don't want every faction ever forever to get the same like they're getting our witch doctor.

Hate tough so very very much.

[Hoyled]

Tough and the Totem Hunter, I know that sad song. Charge the Wardog, kill it, it makes its tough roll, second initial, makes its tough roll. Survive both the dog and ESorcha's attacks, main weapon on Sorcha, do some damage, second initial the dog, kill it, makes its tough roll. No sprint escape for Totem Hunter, ESorcha cuts him in half next turn.

[Gator_Dave]

I like to use a Totem Hunter and two Croak Hunters together, along with a light unit of
Bog Trogs to set up ambushes. I run them along the edge of the map, in cover if posable.

I like the sculpt and look of the Croak hunters better then the Totem hunter,
I'm really into reptiles and amphibians, especially frogs. And the range they bring to the table is always nice.
And you can use them in Gator tier lists, except for Maeloks I think. And a four dice charge on a living model is sick! Especially if they're benefiting from gang fighter.

But the Totem hunter demands a lot of respect on the field, and also fear. I was going to start marking my Totem Hunters base with hash marks representing caster kills, but there would be to many. So many elements make this piece the perfect killer. In the right hands, he's a very powerful weapon.
He does break Gator tier list, which sucks. But he's worth it on some lists.
And a piece of advice, don't paint your Hunter to bright, use earthy colors, you want him to blend in. Use him as a mind game. I was thinking of modding mine a removable gator skin pelt using an extra gatorman posse member and some magnets. They'll know he's there at first but then forget as he blends in.
And what a fun piece to play.

[Sellsword]

Just to make sure that I've been playing him properly, Totem Hunter is a member of Blindwater right? I mean he triggers the croaks abilities in melee and counts for Calaban's feat turn right? Also, as for his looks, I modded him using the swamp troll (see my album) since his stat lines so closely resemble the croaks, it's only right that he look the part.

[Vex]

Just to make sure that I've been playing him properly, Totem Hunter is a member of Blindwater right? I mean he triggers the croaks abilities in melee and counts for Calaban's feat turn right? Also, as for his looks, I modded him using the swamp troll (see my album) since his stat lines so closely resemble the croaks, it's only right that he look the part.

Totem Hunter is not a Blindwater model. However, he is a friendly faction model (since the faction you are playing is Minions). That is all that the Croak's gang ability requires. Calaban's feat is even less restrictive, requiring only friendly models.

[drachenfels]

Vex - he is in the blindwater actually, which i the reason he is allowed to be used in pure blindwater lists (not caster theme forces)

[MagnustheJust]

Yep... Totem Hunter is listed with the other non-amphibious solos and units allowed in page 17 of the Minions book.

[gaminguy]

I tent to field them together if I can, they have similar vectors on the board and they complement each other nicely. It's hard for me to justify the Croak Hunter by itself, but as part of a team he does well.

[mauler78]

Honestly, both. I like to field a 9pt unit I like to call stealth assassin. 1 Totem Hunter and 3 Croak Hunters. Put prey on something in the back that annoys the hell out of you like say for example the Choir. Run the "unit" up the side of the board, and slant in on the second turn. You now have a 4 model back threat unit that will wreck face on most living models, for tougher models you have the gang fighter.

Armies this is less effective on, Cryx.

[drachenfels]

for 9 points id rather have WE&SJ as a flanking force, or if they are already included then another full 5man posse is better.

here's what i posed in the troll thread about these hunters Vs posse

ya know... i dont think i can agree with the 2 above posts, or similar ones... running all 3 together is 7 points... Id much rather spend that 7 on a min unit of posse and a feralgeist.

still get 3 offensive bodies
1 posse on the charge has just slightly less hitting potential as the totem hunter (cold blooded reroll vs mat 10, kelkax is +3, shield is equal to bite)
but the other 2 posse are much stronger than the pair or hunters (23.5+20x2 vs 26x2 [if against living target and the totem gets it in melee range first)
posse have higher base mat than frogs (frogs can get higher with gang) but posse can get reroll.
posse bring an extra 6 boxes of damage at a higher base armor (that increases) than either of the other 3, but no stealth.
posse threat 12" against living, the rest is 12 for totam, and 11 for frogs
also gators can cause terror, frogs are not fearless.
(not to mention random fun stuff for feralgeist to do where ever he wants)

now that was for totem and 2 croaks vs 3 posse and a feral, i think the posse comes even further ahead in a situation of totem and 3 croaks vs 5 posse

[mauler78]

^ Drachenfels

I think miss understand the reason to spend 9pts on a TH and 3 CH. I will not dispute that a unit of gators is going to bring raw power to the board. However, they are a unit and must stick together as a unit. 4 solo models have the ability to move around and deal with threats as needed. More importantly, and the reason I use them is the entire mob has stealth. So it forces my opponent to commit models to deal with it, or wait until it is up in his grill causing problems.

The biggest different in my mind, is 8pts on gators is a meat and potatoes melee unit. 9pts on TH and 3 CH, is a stealth fast moving harassment unit that has the potential to make a caster have a very bad day.

[ColdYinTiger]

I like the idea of using the trio to abuse Maelok's malediction in a squirly sort of assassination strike against a caster. Charge Maelok on in towards the caster on feat turn, and have your two croaks and totem bounce around with their own charges or jumps. Not always useful but it should be a fun one that can hammer on most casters/locks, two ganged up, poisoned charge attacks, plus a prey fueled totem hunter with +2 to hit and damage is nice.

[SneaklePete]

I've play a couple games recently using Barney and a Croak/Pendrake tag team, and I'm liking it.

I run into many situations where the croak doesn't quite have the range, and Pendrake steps in with his bow. Pendrake dies from a shot? The Croak retaliates. They make a nice pair that won't break the game, but can rarely be ignored and can counterpunch competing solos.

[Jestor]

Totem Hunter is one of the most self sufficient fast solo's in the game. If you can only take one or the other, the choice is pretty obvious to me

Mauler - That combo is better in non-minion armies. For 9 points in faction, we have much better choices. Wrastler is 9. Wrongeye and Snackjaw is 9. Full Posse is 9. Our other two heavies and Full Trogs are 8. We can jsut do a lot with those points. Also factor in that, unlike other armies, we don't have good access to magical attacks means Thrullg needs to factor in there some how as well. For your Skorne? Sure, having the super solo assassin squad is cool. For Blindwater? Definately not at 35 and only possibly at 50.

[Borkas drinking buddy]

Croak hunters, three of them, all day long. The Totem hunter was sweet before the nurf hammer came down. Totem is still nice. But with the lack of ranged attack that the Croaks have, and the gross 4d6 on the charge against living models....it just isn't worth it's points.