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Garcia5156
02-13-2010, 02:49 PM
Tried looking but couldn't find what people do with regards to Multi level Ruins in their games. Here's the question: does one measure melee range using the new volume rules? In other words, should vertical melee range be required (such as when attacking a model on a second floor balcony while the attacker remains on the first floor, for example), is it checked from the top of the attacking model's volume to the closest part of the defending model?

It stands to reason that this comes into play most when dealing with large based attackers or models with reach--if you typically have 2 or 3 inch high second floors. Also, the target model would benefit from a +2 DEF as their bases are obscured by terrain correct?

Bladestorm
02-13-2010, 04:59 PM
Page 51, "Melee range and elevation" covers this in so far as it is covered. I can't really quote it without posting the entire rule which I suspect is a no-no.

Garcia5156
02-13-2010, 08:10 PM
OK I see ... thanks for pointing that out! However, the ruling only covers models that are an inch or less apart in elevation. What about those that are more than an inch? Can melee range be determined from the volume of the model in those cases? That same ruling (on p. 51) seems to imply that the vertical distance should be considered in models that are over an inch apart in elevation.

Bladestorm
02-14-2010, 04:06 AM
That's as far as it goes for melee. For ranged the ranges are always measured from the edge of the base, even when heights differ. I expect it is much the same with melee - barring the exception laid down there for when they are close.

Malkav13
02-14-2010, 07:02 AM
I would use model volume at that point. If the volume of the target model is within 1/2'' then I'd say that you would be able to attack it.

Gen_eV
02-14-2010, 07:05 AM
I would use model volume at that point. If the volume of the target model is within 1/2'' then I'd say that you would be able to attack it.

But that's not what the rules state. The rules state to ignore differences in elevation of up to an inch. Beyond that, you follow the exact same rules as measuring range in all other circumstances.

Garcia5156
02-14-2010, 07:05 AM
Well the melee range according to Prime is strictly measured as .5" or 2" from the models "front arc" ... it says nothing about specifically measuring it from the base itself (though admittedly it's what we all do). The "front arc" though could be contrued as emananting from the volume of the model as well. There is no similar restriction statement about measuring from the base in the melee section as there is in the range combat section.

What do you think?

Gen_eV
02-14-2010, 07:29 AM
Page 30, Measuring distances.
"When measuring the distance from a model, measure from the edge of the base"

Page 51, Melee Range and Elevation
"When a model makes a melee attack against a model 1" or less higher or lower, ignore the vertical distance"

Volume is NEVER used for determining range, merely for LOS purposes. Seems pretty clear-cut to me.

Garcia5156
02-14-2010, 07:40 AM
A-ha!! Somehow that page eluded me! Thanks so much Gen eV! Of course, if at home you've got what could be ruled a 2" second floor, a model with reach can attack a model on it, correct? It does say in that section that if the distance is exactly a certain distance apart, they are within that distance.