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Vakdaron
07-24-2012, 10:02 PM
Does a model with Hunter ignores Stealth coming from Camouflage ?

ex:

-I have Rangers in a forest. They gain +2def (forest), +2def (camouflage) and stealth (prowl) since they benefit from concealment by being in the forest.

-The other team has Nyss Hunters. They have hunter so they ignore forest, cover and concealment when determining LOS or making a ranged attack.

So the problem is that the Nyss ignores concealment but do not ignore stealth, but since stealth comes from concealment, I am thinking they should be able to shoot them right?

drachenfels
07-24-2012, 10:17 PM
no. prowl stealth is not granted while benefiting from the forest (or other such area), only while "within" it.

Vakdaron
07-25-2012, 12:15 PM
sorry I don't understand your answer :(

Coffee_twitch
07-25-2012, 12:23 PM
the answer I believe is no, due to prowl granting stealth to the models in question. Concealment they would ignore due to the hunter ability.
Here's the link:
https://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?94778-hunter-ability&highlight=Hunter+ability+prowl

sleet01
07-25-2012, 12:26 PM
Hunter would ignore Camouflage, which is +2 to DEF while benefiting from Concealment, because Hunter ignores Concealment and therefore the models do not benefit from Concealment. Hunter would *not* ignore the Stealth effect granted by Prowl because Prowl is granted while *within* an area or effect that gives Concealment. Hunter does not remove the forest's ability to grant Concealment, only the Concealment benefit that the Rangers receive, so Prowl still works.

Kenton
07-25-2012, 12:31 PM
sorry I don't understand your answer :(

It will help to read the cards whilst reading the answers to your questions.

The Steath from concealment that you mention is due to an ability called Prowl, which is what drachenfels referred to.

To answer your question: you will ignore any DEF bonus from concealment due to Hunter as you ignore the forest. However, this does not change the fact that the Rangers gain stealth for being in concealment. This is an effect on the Ranger and is unaffected by your ignoring the concealment.

I know that it seems odd that you ignore the wood but can't hit the enemy because of it, but that is the way the rule works. With WM/H it is best to read the rule and the apply the literal interpretation. This is most often correct.

I hope this helps.

Trollicious
07-25-2012, 02:29 PM
Nyss (or any unit with Hunter) will ignore:

-the forest, for LoS purposes (you cant hide behind it)

-concealment (+2def) granted by being in the forest

-camoflage (+2def by having concealment)

-cover (+4def)

They would not ignore stealth for any reason. If a unit with Prowl (rangers) was benefiting from prowl for any reason, then they will get stealth. Just because an ability like hunter ignores concealment, cover and forests for LoS, DOES NOT mean that the unit is no longer in the forest. Therefore the unit will still have stealth, and the Nyss hunters will not be able to hit it (unless they are within 5")

BrickandMurder
07-25-2012, 06:47 PM
Hunter would ignore Camouflage, which is +2 to DEF while benefiting from Concealment, because Hunter ignores Concealment and therefore the models do not benefit from Concealment. Hunter would *not* ignore the Stealth effect granted by Prowl because Prowl is granted while *within* an area or effect that gives Concealment. Hunter does not remove the forest's ability to grant Concealment, only the Concealment benefit that the Rangers receive, so Prowl still works.

This is correct. Prowl was not in the OP. The question regards an interaction of hunter and camouflage. Not hunter and prowl.

Sleet01 is correct.

Vakdaron
07-25-2012, 07:16 PM
sorry I should have mentioned it was prowl that gave stealth, I did at first and then removed it because I thought maybe people didn't know every terms so they would answer by knowing the generic rules, sorry about that
thanks for the answers, it just felt strange that they would still gain stealth by having concealment while not benefiting from concealment

Gamingdevil
07-26-2012, 12:04 AM
thanks for the answers, it just felt strange that they would still gain stealth by having concealment while not benefiting from concealment

That's because they don't gain stealth by having concealment, they gain stealth from being in terrain that grants concealment, which is a big difference. They do ignore Camouflage, because that is indeed a direct consequence of having concealment, but Prowl works differently.

The Captain
07-26-2012, 02:49 AM
sorry I should have mentioned it was prowl that gave stealth, I did at first and then removed it because I thought maybe people didn't know every terms so they would answer by knowing the generic rules, sorry about that
thanks for the answers, it just felt strange that they would still gain stealth by having concealment while not benefiting from concealment
Frankly, it's always best to be as exact as possible with your terminology so as to avoid ambiguity. People (hopefully) don't answer rules questions unless they know the rules themselves, in which case they should also be familiar with the terms relevant to the rule.