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dapperFedora
03-29-2013, 01:11 PM
My friend had a sinister idea and I am trouble wrapping my head around how Theme List benefits work to say whether it will work or not.

Fiona can take any Thamarite Unit in her Theme List.
Her first Teir makes all of her Units into Cultists, which gives them Fearless and makes them Thamarite models.

Wouldn't that mean that you could take any merc unit you want since they all become Thamarites?
If not, then how would other Tiers that add in other units to your list selection work?

Thanks in advance.

Ogrob
03-29-2013, 01:17 PM
No. In order to meet Tier One she needs to restrict herself to the models available. Only then do they become Thamarites. You can't use the benefit from tier one in order to meet the requirements for tier one, because you don't have the benefit yet.

dapperFedora
03-29-2013, 01:35 PM
No. In order to meet Tier One she needs to restrict herself to the models available. Only then do they become Thamarites. You can't use the benefit from tier one in order to meet the requirements for tier one, because you don't have the benefit yet.

But then what about instances like Ashlynn's Theme? Her first tier lets her take something that isn't listed in her restrictions. Wouldn't it be impossible to take the units then since as soon as you take them your list is completed? Or are theme lists built up in stages?

slinkdawg
03-29-2013, 02:23 PM
Ashlynn's theme force explicitly states what options become available. Note that Ashlynn's theme force is NOT a highborn covenant contract force.

Once you elect to take a theme force instead of a mercenary contract, you are limited to the models in the theme force. So if you choose "Devil to Pay", you no longer have access to models like steelhead halberdiers or kayazy eliminators. Four star syndicate and other contract options are off the table once you choose a theme force. You become limited to the listed models in that theme only.

Ogrob
03-29-2013, 02:26 PM
The best suggestion I have is this: Ashlynns and other theme lists with this same type of bonus have specific exemptions adding to the list of allowed models. Fiona does not have this, and therefor list building chronology should apply as normal. Add something not listed, and you fail to meet tier one.

Consider also this: If you were right, any unit in the game could be added on the logic that it becomes thamarite.

solkan
03-29-2013, 02:31 PM
Even though the rulebooks have a nice section in the book concerning explicit rules priority, there are several cases where rules make exceptions implicitly, presumably because explicitly stating every exception would result in huge blocks of text. Ashlynn's Theme for is one of those situations.
For the choice between
1. You've just been given a rule that doesn't work (because you're told to add a model not allowed by a previous tier).
or
2. The rule telling you to add the model is making an exception for itself in the tier requirement.
You're supposed to go with option #2.

Fionna's Theme isn't, because it's telling you that if you meet the requirement you may get a benefit that happens to be redundant on some of those models.

dapperFedora
03-29-2013, 02:39 PM
Okay. Thanks for the help guys, just wanted to make sure.