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goesgoch
04-06-2014, 05:13 AM
A few of us got to talking last night and 3Strykers feat came into conersation....or how to mitigate it. One person said, well all you have to do is engage his army and you're good. Of course, most answered, well no, he can still feat, models engage still declare a charge and hit automatically....easy! No, he said. You're all wrong!

Charge attacks by the rule book are those charges that go more than 3". If you do not, then it is not a charge attack.....therefore under 3Stryker's feat those models who may indeed charge but do not go over 3" do not hit automatically. Right?

This also changes the way many of us play/trigger abilities such as set defence, that trigger on charge attacks etc

Basically, an unit may indeed be charging, but may not be making a charge attack as part of the charge. In essence, we've been assuming the not travelling 3" just meant no natural boosted dice, but in fact it turns the whole charge attack into a normal melee attack.

Are we correct in thinking this?

Tieger
04-06-2014, 05:59 AM
i dont have the rule book with me to give a page reference, but yes - to be a charge attack you need to have moved 3".

Stormpuppy_Infantry
04-06-2014, 06:00 AM
Charge attacks by the rule book are those charges that go more than 3". If you do not, then it is not a charge attack.....therefore under 3Stryker's feat those models who may indeed charge but do not go over 3" do not hit automatically. Right?

Right. Models can declare and perform charge while in melee, but if the charging models are not able to advance at least 3 inch then the first attack is not charge attack. Stryker3's feat gives benefit for charge attack and impact attack, and because their first attack is not charge attack they will not get that.




This also changes the way many of us play/trigger abilities such as set defence, that trigger on charge attacks etc

Basically, an unit may indeed be charging, but may not be making a charge attack as part of the charge. In essence, we've been assuming the not travelling 3" just meant no natural boosted dice, but in fact it turns the whole charge attack into a normal melee attack.

Are we correct in thinking this?

Yes. But charging models still make first attack of combat action to charge target if it can, even if first attack is not charge attack.

Myth2704
04-06-2014, 02:42 PM
It's the same thing as with Set Defence. If they don't move 3", no charge and therefore they don't suffer -2 to the attack (or in this case auto hit)

Sand20go
04-06-2014, 06:50 PM
Anything that takes away speed also means no charge attack.

vintersbastard
04-07-2014, 02:59 AM
Anything that takes away speed also means no charge attack.
SPD penalties prevent a model from charging - since the OP's question is explicitly about models that have charged, this really doesn't have anything to do with it.

imbob
04-07-2014, 03:39 AM
I thought the 3" of movement was needed to get the boosted damage roll? Not to make it a charge attack...

lobachevskii
04-07-2014, 04:32 AM
I thought the 3" of movement was needed to get the boosted damage roll? Not to make it a charge attack...


The charging model's first attack after ending its charge movement must target the model it charged. If the charging model advanced at least 3", this attack is a charge attack.

And charge attacks made with melee weapons are boosted. So you've got cause and effect swapped around ... . :)

WoldGnome
04-07-2014, 06:29 AM
I could have sworn there was a post recently where it was ruled that charging units would still get the bonus from abilities such as powerful charge even if you don't move or don't move the min 3".
I even remember people at my LGS discussing this and I planned to use it with my Wolves of Orboros.

However I just spent 30 mins trying to find the post and it seems to have disappeared...........or I dreamed the whole thing?!!

Am I cracking up?

vintersbastard
04-07-2014, 06:34 AM
I could have sworn there was a post recently where it was ruled that charging units would still get the bonus from abilities such as powerful charge even if you don't move or don't move the min 3".
I even remember people at my LGS discussing this and I planned to use it with my Wolves of Orboros.

However I just spent 30 mins trying to find the post and it seems to have disappeared...........or I dreamed the whole thing?!!I'm pretty confident on that count. ;)


Am I cracking up?This one, I can't tell...

Mastershake
04-07-2014, 07:04 AM
I could have sworn there was a post recently where it was ruled that charging units would still get the bonus from abilities such as powerful charge even if you don't move or don't move the min 3".
I even remember people at my LGS discussing this and I planned to use it with my Wolves of Orboros.

However I just spent 30 mins trying to find the post and it seems to have disappeared...........or I dreamed the whole thing?!!

Am I cracking up?

The rule book is pretty specific on what qualifies as a charge attack, so I'd be really surprised if they just up and changed it. That being said, I have seen a lot of people get confused about this, so you're in good company.

Sand20go
04-07-2014, 08:24 AM
Anything that takes away speed also means no charge attack.

Original post "A few of us got to talking last night and 3Strykers feat came into conersation....or how to mitigate it."

Mogote
04-07-2014, 03:24 PM
There is some confusion between a charge and charge attack here.


Some effects require a model to charge. A model required to charge must charge a model to which it can draw line of sight.


A charging model that ends its charge movement with its charge target in its melee range has made a successful charge.

A successful charge is one where the models ends in melee with its target. No stipulation on where that successful charge starts from, other than the target needs to be within LOS.


If the charging model advanced at least 3˝, this attack is a charge attack....The attack roll is made normally and can be boosted. If the charge attack was made with a melee weapon and the attack hits, the damage roll is automatically boosted.

Having a successful charge and moving at least 3" gains you a boosted damage roll on the charge attack.


If a charging model moved less than 3˝, its first attack is not a charge attack because the model did not move far or fast enough to add sufficient momentum to its strike. Its first attack must still be made against the charge target, however. The charging model completes its combat action normally.

Having a successful charge and NOT moving 3" means no boosted rolls and is NOT a charge attack. Still a successful charge however.


If a charging model ends its charge movement without its charge target in its melee range, then it has made a failed charge. If a model makes a failed charge during its activation, its activation immediately ends.

Failed charge is when you do not end in melee with the model you are targeting.

All quotes are from Prime pgs. 46-47.

Stryker 3 Feat reads:
When a friendly Faction model makes a mount attack or a charge attack while within Stryker’s control area, the attack automatically hits and gains an additional die on the damage roll. Lightning Charge lasts for one round.

Since models need to move 3" in order to make a charge attack there will be NO additional die on the damage rolls.