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Demorgue
05-12-2014, 03:26 AM
When Siege pops his feat, the first time an enemy model takes damage its base ARM value is halved.

When a Hunter shoots something large, Armor Piercing states halve the base ARM stats of.......

does this stack?

why or why not?

Demorgue
05-12-2014, 03:32 AM
Also one other question about Siege, say I wanna cast Mage sight, range is CTRL. Can I cast this spell through an arc node, and at that point measure my control area with the node as the Point of Orgin, and be able to upkeep it properly if the node and siege stay the same and proper distance?

Mindless
05-12-2014, 03:33 AM
It doesn't.

Because spells, feats and abilities with the same effect don't stack unless it says they do.

Breach specifies "...halve the base ARM of the target.... Armor Piercing says the same thing. So shooting a Khador Juggernaut with ARM 20 means you will halve its ARM down to 10 when calculating the damage during Breach. The Hunter having Armor Piercing will not halve the armor further.

Regarding your Arc Node: check the rules for Arc Nodes and you'll see what spells they can and cannot cast. They cannot cast RNG SELF and RNG CTRL spells because these must be cast by the warcaster on him/herself or on something in his/her control area.

BigFisch
05-12-2014, 03:37 AM
Also one other question about Siege, say I wanna cast Mage sight, range is CTRL. Can I cast this spell through an arc node, and at that point measure my control area with the node as the Point of Orgin, and be able to upkeep it properly if the node and siege stay the same and proper distance?

No, you can not arc CTRL area spells, the ARC node has no CTRL area.

BigFisch
05-12-2014, 03:38 AM
It doesn't.

Because spells, feats and abilities with the same effect don't stack unless it says they do.

Breach specifies "...halve the base ARM of the target.... Armor Piercing says the same thing. So shooting a Khador Juggernaut with ARM 20 means you will halve its ARM down to 10 when calculating the damage. The Hunter having Armor Piercing will not halve the armor further.

Regarding your Arc Node: check the rules for Arc Nodes and you'll see what spells they can and cannot cast. They cannot cast RNG SELF and RNG CTRL spells because these must be cast by the warcaster on him/herself or on something in his/her control area.

I disagree, I don't have the books in front of me but I am under the impression that effects WITH THE SAME NAME can not be applied more than once, not simply the same effect. I would like an official perspective on this as we may be playing this wrong at my FLGS.

Mindless
05-12-2014, 03:42 AM
I disagree, I don't have the books in front of me but I am under the impression that effects WITH THE SAME NAME can not be applied more than once, not simply the same effect. I would like an official perspective on this as we may be playing this wrong at my FLGS.

It doesn't matter if you agree or not. That's how it works. :)

https://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?53054-Siege-s-Breach-and-Hunter-s-Armor-Piercing-Question

https://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?44107-Armor-Piercing-Breach-0-ARM

Demorgue
05-12-2014, 03:51 AM
so hunter doesnt, but say Ayana or Ragman would then. Thanks

BigFisch
05-12-2014, 03:56 AM
It doesn't matter if you agree or not. That's how it works. :)

https://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?53054-Siege-s-Breach-and-Hunter-s-Armor-Piercing-Question

https://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?44107-Armor-Piercing-Breach-0-ARM

Man I wish they gave page references. Thanks for the info though I'll let my local friends know!

Mod_Neldar
05-12-2014, 03:57 AM
so hunter doesnt, but say Ayana or Ragman would then. Thanks

Yes. Breach doesn't change your base ARM so it and the Hunter are doing the calculation on the same number and get to the same result.

Aiyana and Ragman simply increase your damage by 2 which stacks with. Breach and the Hunter following the standard rules. You'll cut armor in half and then lower it by 2 with Ragman while an attack against the model will have its damage roll increased by 2 due to Aiyana.

Against a Khador heavy warjack you get this:

Base ARM: 20
ARM after Breach: 10
ARM after Dark Shroud: 8
Hunter's damage against it: POW 6 + 2 (Aiyana) + 2d6 + other modifiers.

Bittersashes
05-12-2014, 03:57 AM
I disagree, I don't have the books in front of me but I am under the impression that effects WITH THE SAME NAME can not be applied more than once, not simply the same effect. I would like an official perspective on this as we may be playing this wrong at my FLGS.

You are right in that they are not the same named effect and can therefore both be applied at once.

However, they both halve the BASE (ie unmodified) armour of the target, so assuming you are shooting at a Khador jack, AP on the hunter halves the targets base armour of 20 to 10 and then the feat halves the base armour of 20 (not the now-modified value of 10) to 10. Whichever order you apply it in, you end up with 10 ARM as both effects are based on the printed, unmodified value.