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wazatdingder
06-08-2015, 08:03 AM
I found a question that can help with another popular arguement at the moment using all released and completely legal models.

Can Ossrum cast Bullet Dodger on Herne and Fire For Effect on Jonne?

These are both upkeeps that only effect individual models, both being cast on separate models in a unit.

nitnit
06-08-2015, 08:11 AM
I'd say no. My reasoning being, upkeep rules state that a unit can only be affected by 1 friendly and enemy upkeep at a time. And even though your targetting 2 seperate models with 2 different spells, they are still 1 unit.

The Captain
06-08-2015, 08:37 AM
This is basically the same question that is being argued about in the Saeryn/Rhyas thread. Neither of those upkeeps is on a unit (they are incapable of targeting a unit), both are on a model, and no model has more than one upkeep on it.

Stormpuppy_Infantry
06-08-2015, 09:00 AM
https://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?230728-Epic-Twins-Upkeep-Question

For the others, that is the relevant thread.

Well, it is not recommended to duplicate the thread. But it seems that OP wants to make the new post to avoid 'no answers for the unreleased products' policy of the Infernals.

I am bet that you can upkeep both spells, but some people thinks that it does not.

Vex
06-08-2015, 07:15 PM
Of course you can upkeep both spells. The spells in question target models, not units. No model has more than a single upkeep on it, and the unit has no unit-wide upkeeps, so it is all perfectly legal.

sterling319
06-08-2015, 07:36 PM
The problem is that the upkeep rules don't specify whether an upkeep spell affecting a unit only affects one model. It says, "A model or unit can have only one friendly and one enemy upkeep spell in play on it at a time." Mini-Prime Mk 2, pg 58. Therefore, when Ossrum upkeeps Bullet Dodger on a model in a unit, and goes to cast Fire for Effect on another model in the unit, he is putting more than one upkeep spell on a unit at one time. The above rule does not care how many models in the unit are affected, it is still a case of two friendly upkeeps on the same unit.

So until an Infernal overrules it, or an errata changes the rule, that's pretty clear-cut. Rules as written, no, you cannot have two single-model upkeeps on different models in the same unit.

Edit: After reading Leonard_Dukes linked threads, I have to agree with him. You can have as many single-target upkeeps in play as there are models in a unit, or access to spells of that kind.

SeoNN
06-08-2015, 07:57 PM
The problem is that the upkeep rules don't specify whether an upkeep spell affecting a unit only affects one model. It says, "A model or unit can have only one friendly and one enemy upkeep spell in play on it at a time." Mini-Prime Mk 2, pg 58. Therefore, when Ossrum upkeeps Bullet Dodger on a model in a unit, and goes to cast Fire for Effect on another model in the unit, he is putting more than one upkeep spell on a unit at one time. The above rule does not care how many models in the unit are affected, it is still a case of two friendly upkeeps on the same unit.

So until an Infernal overrules it, or an errata changes the rule, that's pretty clear-cut. Rules as written, no, you cannot have two single-model upkeeps on different models in the same unit.

Im not sure does mini-book have it (it shoud) but the whole paragraph is:
"A model or unit can have only one friendly and one enemy upkeep spell in play on it at a time. If another upkeep spell is cast on a model or unit that
already has one from the same side—friendly or enemy— the older upkeep spell expires and is replaced by the newly cast one when the affected model is hit by the spell. The
older upkeep spell expires even if only a single model in the unit is affected by the new upkeep spell. Likewise, an
upkeep spell on one model expires if its unit is affected by a new upkeep spell from the same side."
So the answer to OP's QU is "NO, u can't "

solkan
06-08-2015, 08:08 PM
Im not sure does mini-book have it (it shoud) but the whole paragraph

The rebuttal to your argument has already been written in the other thread.
See: https://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?230728-Epic-Twins-Upkeep-Question&p=3162725&viewfull=1#post3162725

Short version: 'target model' animi applied to troopers doesn't work that way, and upkeep spells are written the same way animi are.