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View Full Version : How does Bloodletting stack with Krueger's Lighting Tendrils?



Smythe
04-05-2016, 09:12 PM
Tharn Bloodweavers have Lightning Tendrils cast on them. Their weapons gain reach and electro-leap.
The bloodletting ability states to choose and ability when you make an attack with the weapon.
My question is: Do the initial melee attack and the electro-leap damage roll both count as the same attack? IE would bloodletting: Blood-burst trigger two AoEs?

SageofLodoss
04-05-2016, 09:45 PM
The electro leaps do not count as the same attack. As a matter of fact, electro leaps are not attacks at all, they are just straight damage rolls. Those damage rolls belong to the model that caused them but they are not an attack.

Rules which specify a relation or cause and effect of the melee attack will not transfer over to the electro leaps.

Rules which specify a modification to damage rolls belonging to the model in general will modify electro leaps. For example, Bloodtrackers and Wolf Riders with Lightning Tendrils can result in effective POW 12 electro leaps when their leaps affect models they have designated as Prey, since Prey just straight up adds 2 to attack rolls and *damage rolls* against Prey target.

Bloodburst would not trigger twice because the second model will have died to the electro leap, not the melee attack, and it says "When this attack boxes..."

Oddly enough, read as written Blood Spiller may grant additional damage die against living models suffering electro leap damage rolls from a bloodweaver if they choose Blood Spiller, since that doesn't say anything about weapon or attack, but it also says "a living model," singular, so that's probably an oversight.

Smythe
04-05-2016, 10:46 PM
That's how I've been playing it.

I'm just wondering what the distinction is between "attack" and "effect generated from the weapon that is making an attack" is.

"Attack" is just so vague.

Does "attack" not encompass every effect generated by a combat action?

SageofLodoss
04-05-2016, 11:31 PM
Does "attack" not encompass every effect generated by a combat action?

Not at all. Forsaken can use their combat action to use Blight Shroud, which may destroy a lot of models with the POW 8, but none of that is an attack because Blight Shroud is a *Action, not a *Attack.

Electro Leaps generated by an attack are not themselves attacks. Admonisher damage rolls generated by an attack are not attacks.

Eruption of Ash (Thagrosh, Durst) inherits the magical damage quality from the magical weapon that caused it but the POW 12 dealt by the AOE is not an attack.

Spells like Saeryn's blight bringer are not attacks despite dealing out POW 12's because its not an offensive spell.

Lots of instances where the various effects generated by a combat action are not considered to be attacks.

vintersbastard
04-06-2016, 06:57 AM
"Attack" is just so vague.
Actually, it's the opposite - only things that are called attacks by the rules are indeed attacks, anything else isn't.

Grey Templar
04-06-2016, 08:48 AM
"Attack" is just so vague.

Not at all. The word Attack is very explicitly defined in the rules.

Smythe
04-06-2016, 09:56 AM
Fair enough. Thank you for prompt responses :)

GooeyGungan
04-06-2016, 11:04 AM
... read as written Blood Spiller may grant additional damage die against living models suffering electro leap damage rolls from a bloodweaver if they choose Blood Spiller, since that doesn't say anything about weapon or attack ...

Is this the case? Blood Burst specifies "this attack" and Dispel specifies "this weapon," but Blood Spiller does not. Do you get the additional die if you Electro Leap into a living model?

Larnu
04-07-2016, 12:01 AM
Yes it does, Locked thread with question:
https://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?619-Electro-Leap-Question-2

vintersbastard
04-07-2016, 01:56 AM
Yes it does, Locked thread with question:
https://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?619-Electro-Leap-Question-2

I'm confused by your statement - Mootaz, who was an Infernal back then, clearly states that the Electro Leap does not gain the additional die.

Larnu
04-07-2016, 02:18 AM
I'm confused by your statement - Mootaz, who was an Infernal back then, clearly states that the Electro Leap does not gain the additional die.

He says the opposite. The OP in the link asks "Does an Electro Leap attack by a Tharn Bloodweaver using Blood Spiller gain the extra die to damage?" Mootaz replies with "Yes, the Electro Leap ability is tied to the weapon but the actual leap is not performed with the weapon. " (emphasis mine). So his answer is clearly yes, it does.

Edit:
Apart from I didn't even notice Mootaz' post above, i scrolled and read the whole way through, and read the second time he posted as his answer and lock result.

Leo_the_Rat
04-07-2016, 03:34 AM
Larnu- you have misread Mootaz's second post. He agrees that Electro leap is on the bloodweaver's weapon. He then goes on to say that since the leap itself is not using the weapon you do not get the extra die.

DarkLegacy
04-07-2016, 05:23 AM
Leo and Vinter have the correct reading of Mootaz's post.