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azaminkor
01-07-2011, 06:25 AM
How does this interact?

Ambush

... choose any table edge except the back of your opponentʼs deployment zone.SR2011
In radial scenarios a player?s table edge is defined as the two table edges that intersect at the righthand corner. Mechanics that are measured from a player?s board edge may use a point on either of the two sides indicated below.Is any edge the back of my opponent's deployment zone? Is any edge free game or only the edges of my deployment zone?

Mod_Redphantasm
01-07-2011, 06:41 AM
Radial scenarios are something entirely new so this is more a question for Snakeman and the Infernals.

My guess would be that Ambushing models can only come in from one of your two table edges.

boskiche
01-07-2011, 07:03 AM
Using quote from SR2011 means that modles with ambush in radial scenarios can use only 2 table edges instead of 3.

rydiafan
01-07-2011, 07:10 AM
boskiche is correct. Ambush cannot come from your opponent's deployment edge, and in the radial scenarios your opponent has two deployment edges, so both are unusable as ambush edges.

Halfhoot
01-07-2011, 07:13 AM
What about a 4 person game with each person being in the corner. That would mean an ambush character could never be deployed ever. It should be that their "back edge" includes where they can deploy and would therefore get rid of half of one edge and half of the other... but then again should and is are entirely different things. Still... what about a 4 person game with each corner as a radial start?

azaminkor
01-07-2011, 07:17 AM
Ambush can come in from your opponents deployment zone, just not the back edge (not just edge). Neither of those edges are technically the the back edge.

rydiafan
01-07-2011, 07:18 AM
What about a 4 person game with each person being in the corner.

Steamroller does not support this format.


Ambush can come in from your opponents deployment zone, just not the back edge (not just edge). Neither of those edges are technically the the back edge.

There are four table edges. The SR2011 quote in post #1 clarifies that both table edges intersecting in the radial deployment zone are considered to be your deployment edge, which is illegal ambush choice.

Halfhoot
01-07-2011, 07:21 AM
Steamroller does not support this format.

But it's still a valid rules question and the answer to it would have an impact on the answer to azaminkor's question.

rydiafan
01-07-2011, 07:24 AM
But it's still a valid rules question.

Playing in a home-made scenario which is not designed by Privateer Press nor is supported by the rules is inherently going to have rules interactions which are not answerable. That's beyond the scope of the rules forum, as you are no longer asking about the rules of the game, but rather the rules of the scenario you made up.

azaminkor
01-07-2011, 07:37 AM
There are four table edges. The SR2011 quote in post #1 clarifies that both table edges intersecting in the radial deployment zone are considered to be your deployment edge, which is illegal ambush choice.

After looking at the tier benefits (which I assumed this rule was meant for in the first place) it looks like they are also placed from the back edge of your deployment zone. So I'd assume the interaction is the same with ambush. It just seemed ambiguous to me, as the back of the two edges is the point in which the intersect.

---
Ambush models can still be deployed normally, so I guess in a 4 way game you would have to go that route.

Mod_Redphantasm
01-07-2011, 08:01 AM
What about a 4 person game with each person being in the corner. That would mean an ambush character could never be deployed ever. It should be that their "back edge" includes where they can deploy and would therefore get rid of half of one edge and half of the other... but then again should and is are entirely different things. Still... what about a 4 person game with each corner as a radial start?

In this special scenario you, the creator, would have to decide how this set up works with ambush. Barring a scenario rule, Ambush models would be unable to ambush and must set up normally.

Adurot
01-12-2011, 02:46 PM
Any new response to this yet? Ambush says opponents deployment zone, so one local interpretation is that the ambushers can come in from the opponents board edge so long as it's outside their deployment zone.

Kiev
01-12-2011, 03:58 PM
Any new response to this yet? Ambush says opponents deployment zone, so one local interpretation is that the ambushers can come in from the opponents board edge so long as it's outside their deployment zone.

Page 6 of the SR11 packets answers this question. Both of the table edges make up the deployments zone there fore ambush can only come in on your two edges. There is also a picture.

From pg. 6

"In radial scenarios a player?s table edge is defined as the two table edges that intersect at the righthand corner. Mechanics that are measured from a player?s board edge may use a point on either of
the two sides indicated below."

Gsot
01-12-2011, 04:03 PM
With this applying to ambush does that mean you can deploy Sevvy's wracks 20" on from either edge, making a huge L shape? Assuming tier list.

BTW this is 1520/2304 square inches of the board... or just over 66%.

FearLord
01-12-2011, 05:01 PM
With this applying to ambush does that mean you can deploy Sevvy's wracks 20" on from either edge, making a huge L shape? Assuming tier list.

BTW this is 1520/2304 square inches of the board... or just over 66%.

No. Because as the type of scenario indicates, deployment is measured from your corner and forms a radius of a circle. Deploying 20" on means you measure 20" from your corner and can deploy anywhere in the area created by sweeping your tape measure around.

KujakuDM
01-12-2011, 06:39 PM
Sorry but you are wrong.

Deploying 20" from your table edge means you pick a table edge and deploy the wracks as such, not form your deployment zone.

Adurot
01-13-2011, 12:01 AM
Local player reads the ambush interaction as the rule says you can deploy off any board edge except the back of the opponents deployment zone. It does not say they can't come in off their board edge, so he says you can come in from their two sides so long as you don't come in inside their deployment zone.

Sevwall
01-13-2011, 12:11 AM
No, thats not how it works. I'm not official, but I can say with 100% certainty that ambushers can only come off the 2 sides of the table that align with your deployment zone.

And yes, in radials you get to deploy sevvy's wracks in a gigantic area.

FearLord
01-15-2011, 03:55 AM
Sorry but you are wrong.

Deploying 20" from your table edge means you pick a table edge and deploy the wracks as such, not form your deployment zone.

Incorrect. Radial Scenarios allow you to treat effects that require measurement from a player's table edge as either of the long edges that touch the deployment corner. Severius' tier benefit specifically references the back edge of deployment zone not player's table edge.

Riker1990
01-15-2011, 07:19 AM
Allow or require?

FearLord
01-15-2011, 10:30 AM
Allow or require?

I say allow, because it is either one or the other at any given time. You are required to choose one or the other each time such an ability comes up.

Malkav13
01-15-2011, 10:59 PM
I read it as you can ambush from anywhere that the enemy does not deploy at. Normally, that area occupies an entire side of the board, but in the radial deployment this is not going to be the case.

rydiafan
01-15-2011, 11:09 PM
The SR2011 developers confirmed in another forum that Ambush cannot be done from any portion of the table edge your opponent's deployment zone is attached to in a radial scenario.

Malkav13
01-16-2011, 12:10 PM
Do you have a link to that other forum? I'm terrible at finding these things and it would be useful to have to show to players in my area if needed.

rydiafan
01-16-2011, 12:33 PM
Question about Ambushers and the radial deployment: Can the Ambushers come on the tables edges that are used by your opponent for deployment, but beyond the extent of the radius? That is, on those tables edges deployment is out to 18". Can the ambushers come on in the remaining 30" of that side?

--Norbert

To re-iterate, the answer to both of these questions is NO! :)

Here it is.

Cannotcope
01-16-2011, 01:15 PM
Incorrect. Radial Scenarios allow you to treat effects that require measurement from a player's table edge as either of the long edges that touch the deployment corner. Severius' tier benefit specifically references the back edge of deployment zone not player's table edge.


The SR2011 developers confirmed in another forum that Ambush cannot be done from any portion of the table edge your opponent's deployment zone is attached to in a radial scenario.

Both Tier Benefits (for deployment of wracks/terrain) and Ambush refer to back edge of deployment zone (owning player's deployment zone for Tier benefits and opponent's deployment zone for Ambush).

Therefore, both Tier Benefits and Ambush should work in logically the same way in radial scenarios.

Either:
Tier Benefits are measured from the entire length of both adjacent sides (and therefore can cover a massive L shaped area) and Ambushers cannot come in through any part of those two sides.
or
Tier Benefits are measured from edges within the radial deployment area (for a smaller area) and Ambushers can come in from anywhere except the points from which Tier Benefits would be measured.

Any other ruling flies in the face of logical arguments.
("back edge of deployment zone" should not mean different things for different abilities)

Khador_Rage
01-21-2011, 02:01 PM
As stated my a PG earlier that you are supposed to measure Tier list terrain just liek your deployment zone, what good would that do? You're placing terrain in your deployment zone. It will be useless after turn one.

I agree with the above poster. I think it should be one or the other. I'd rather see terrain and ambushers measured from my two table edges. With the Tier terrain placement restrictions it's not like you'll be able to completed prevent movement on the board.

rydiafan
01-21-2011, 02:35 PM
I'd rather see terrain and ambushers measured from my two table edges.

That's exactly what you're supposed to do.

LEJ
01-21-2011, 02:46 PM
I agree, both must work the same way and its obvious that the 20" deployment theme bonus is pointless if its 20" from the corner.
Thus both must be 20" from either table edge like it says to do.

Khador_Rage
01-21-2011, 02:54 PM
That's exactly what you're supposed to do.


Fantastic! Thanks.

MFWalter
06-13-2011, 03:35 PM
Anything decided yet?

I was looking into getting Bog Trog Amushers for my Skorne list, but waiting for something final on here.

rydiafan
06-13-2011, 07:29 PM
Anything decided yet?

I was looking into getting Bog Trog Amushers for my Skorne list, but waiting for something final on here.

Post #25 in this very thread has a quote from the man who designed Steamroller. That is as final as it gets.

Your bog trogs would Ambush from anywhere on the two table edges which make up your deployment corner.